Gloat Free NBA Championship Score (Tuesday, June 19)

[Jack Rabbit]

Game 4

Heat 104, Thunder 98 (Heat leads the Series, 3-1)

[bigwillq]

1. ....

[Scurrilous]

2. ...

[trumad]

3. One more

[joeybee12]

4. This is why I was rooting for the Spurs...

OKC had never been to the finals before...at least not as OKC...and it overwhelmed them.

[trumad]

5. Miami would have demolished the Spurs...

Just like OKC demolished them.

[joeybee12]

6. I don't think so...

Spurs were the best during the regular season...weird how as soon as they lost one game they couldn't win again.

[trumad]

7. Yeah---and the Celts owned the heat in the Regular season.

which means----errr nothing.

[joeybee12]

8. Usually that's reliable...

Usually.

[JonLP24]

10. Popovich was the only coach

resting players well before the regular season ended. That was a factor in this condensed shorter schedule while other teams were beat up and fatigued down the stretch.

They were a great team but the 2-3-2 format favors road teams and w/ 2 great home teams, at best it would probably 2-2 right now if these two teams played.

[JonLP24]

9. The Spurs have been to the Conference finals before, right? Wouldn't Conference Finals experience

mean that they win the Conference Finals?

I don't think it is "The Finals" being a factor. Westbrook and Durant are playing out of their minds for the most part. The Heat are simply the better team so far, especially on D.

Not to mention OKC took out Dallas & LAL on their way to the Conference Finals, 2 teams w/ massive amounts of playoff experience while the Spurs took out Utah & LAC.

[joeybee12]

11. Happened in 2009 with Orlando...

Played like crazy against Boston, not so well against LA

The finals is a whole different world...sure OKC is playing well, but in crunch time, experience shows...besides, it's all part of Stern's plan...let the Heat win this year so it's the Lebron redemption story...and next year it's the OKC that everyone likes getting to win it all...the NBA makes the WWF look legit.

[JonLP24]

12. Yes, Stern is putting the ball in the hoop for the Heat

Can't teams just simply be better? Like LA over Orlando or Miami over OKC(Though OKC strikes me as one of those teams that can come back down 3-1, if they steal game 5 in Miami they are an explosive team that is terrific at home).

W/ the crunch time, at-least in Game 4, the Heat made their shots. Like Lebron making that 2 after the cramp followed by Wade driving to the hoop moments later. Then when OKC tied it up Lebron made the go ahead 3.

[joeybee12]

14. He's letting the refs know NOT to call on Lebron...

It's amazing how fixed it is...and in a sport that only has 5 players, it's so damn easy to do.

[JonLP24]

16. Lebron has been whistled for 14 personal fouls this series

4 in every game except for last night(2). I guess the refs didn't get the memo?

[joeybee12]

19. Yeah, they did...

Look what he got away with at the end of Game 2 which would have tied the series...he has the least fouls called on him of any major player.

[JonLP24]

21. That was a

borderline call. I would probably need more looks at it to determine one way or the other but look at what you're stretching it too. The Thunder were down 2 when that happened, you're assuming Durant would have made both free throws and that they would have stopped Miami from scoring and eventually won the game. This proves the series is fixed? In fact IIRC, that was the same game refs said Wade touched the ball out-of-bounds when video review showed it was OKC that knocked it out. Why would the refs say Wade touched it when the fix is in for the Heat?

Say it was a bad call, don't bad calls happen in other sports? What makes a bad call in the NBA proof that it is fixed(Let me had when I officiated intramural basketball it was a very difficult sport to officiate since everything happens so fast) but not in other sports?

[joeybee12]

28. Game 2 of the Celtics-Heat series...

I rest my case.

[JonLP24]

29. Game 2 Miami-Indiana

Non-call

I rest my case.

Actually, what you are pointing is a call on Wade(again, that is assuming Boston would win without that when the game was far from decided). So why did the refs whistle Wade for a foul on Westbrook in the closing minutes? If the fix is in for the Heat, why call the foul?

[trumad]

25. ahhh the Jealous Douchebag Brigade is out in full glory.

[hughee99]

13. Looks like the Heat will either win a title OR permanently raise the bar on choking in the NBA. n/t

[JonLP24]

15. It's been done before

Just not in the NBA Finals. 13-0 teams have went up 3-1 and went on to win the finals but there have been more playoff series than NBA finals series.

The last team to do it was my Phoenix Suns in the 2006 playoffs against the LA Lakers. The Suns had 2 home games in the final 3, which the Thunder will have if it gets that far. If it was reversed and Miami had 2 home games in the final 3 I'd confidently say the Thunder winning won't happen. If Thunder steal game 5 I won't be surprised if they go on to win their final 2 home games.

[hughee99]

17. I'm not planning to bet the house on Miami.

They seem to get a little better, and choke a little later each year. Eventually they'll win it all, I'm just not convinced they are there yet.

[JonLP24]

18. I was just

disputing that it would be raising the bar on choking considering OKC has 2 home games left and it's been done before. I guess I would have to name the biggest "choke" and I'd say Houston over Phoenix in 1995 NBA Playoffs, sad to say. Phoenix had home court in the series and not only were they up 3-1, they were also up 2-0.

Though the only other time a road team came back from 3-1 was Boston against Philadelphia in the 1968 playoffs.

[hughee99]

20. I still think it would be raising the bar because it is the finals.

Yes, the down 3-1 with 2 home games left has been done, but no team has had 3 chances to win the NBA title and failed all of them (so far).

[JonLP24]

22. I realize it is the finals

Last edited Wed Jun 20, 2012, 03:15 PM - Edit history (1)

I noted that and the reason for why it didn't happen as opposed to other playoff series is because of the volume of series.

So I boil it down to which is more unlikely to happen? Houston coming back from 3-1 on the road to a team w/ a better regular season record(Phoenix) or the Thunder coming back from 3-1 w/ 2 home games against a team w/ a worse regular reason record(Miami)? That was my point I was trying to make.

A little late but felt like adding. The Thunder being down 3-1 was perhaps more unlikely than them coming back from 3-1.

The Thunder were 5 and 5.5 point favorites to win games 1 & 2.
Game 1---http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/matchup/heat-thunder-2012-06-12 The site is suggesting to "lay off" moneyline but it was -230.
Game 2---http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/matchup/heat-thunder-2012-06-14

Money lines of -230 & -235 indicate OKC was heavy favorites at home.

Miami was -4 in game 3 - http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/matchup/thunder-heat-2012-06-17 The site is suggesting to play Thunder on moneyline but Miami was -175. Miami was -3 & -142 for Game 4. http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/matchup/thunder-heat-2012-06-19

For game 5 Miami is -3 & -148 for Game 5. If OKC pulls that out I expect them to be heavy favorites again for games 6 & 7.
http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/matchup/thunder-heat-2012-06-21

With that the previous 13 times, I imagine in almost all cases the teams up 3-1 in the NBA finals were far bigger favorites than Miami so OKC coming back wouldn't be as significant in comparison to the cases where it didn't happen. I think "choke" is a term that is often overused in sports but in this context if Miami failed to win it would be a big choke which followed an even bigger choke by OKC.

[hughee99]

23. I understand what you're saying.

Not everyone remembers lower playoff series, and usually for not that long. If Miami fails here, this will be the new "gold standard" for NBA choke jobs, and it will stand for a long time.

[JonLP24]

24. LOL - I was editing my post when you posted

See my post in-case where I highlight more strongly what was on my mind when I made my original arguments.

When it comes to remembrance factor, I can't disagree there.

[RockaFowler]

26. They haven't lost

They just won 3 in a row. How exactly is this a choke job??

[hughee99]

27. I don't think you've been following the conversation...

"Looks like the Heat will either win a title OR permanently raise the bar on choking in the NBA"

I think we can all agree, one of these two things WILL surely happen. Much of the discussion after is based on possibility of the latter occurring.