*** Posted To The African-American Group ***

[1StrongBlackMan]

Last night, I was reading through a particular thread in which 2 Black DUers (myself included) were told (various forms of) "You do not speak for all Black people", despite our position aligning with the vast majority of Black DUers. Most (really, all but two) of the DUers telling us have self-identified as being white.

Now, I'm used to this line of "reasoning", and I'm pretty sure the other Black DUer is, too. Maybe it was my natural curiousness ... Or, perhaps, it was boredom (Mrs.1SBM is out of town) ... Or, perhaps it was the Paul Masson (see: previous explanation) that led me to conduct a little experiment.

I scanned 40 threads, 10 threads that touched on race, and 30 randomly selected from the GD and GD (each having more than 50 replies, none of which touched on race). I counted how many times a variation of the "You do not speak for all ______ " appeared, and noted the racial self-identification of the DUer that posted it and the race of the DUer receiving the response. I, also, noted whether the response receiver's comment reflected what I perceive to be the mainstream opinion of DUers (as reflected by the other comments within that thread).

Guess what I found???

In the 10 threads that touched on race, the phrase was made over 70 times, with all but one of the recipients being Black. The one white recipient was told "{something to the effect of} you do not speak for all Black people", despite her comment aligning with the comments of the Black DUers in the thread.

I found 5 instances of a Black DUer telling someone they did not speak for all Black people. In each of those cases, the comment was made by someone holding a view that did not align with the views of the other Black people in the thread. (Note: I, also, found 1 instance that may have come close ... A Black DUer, holding a mainstream (Black) view, told one that didn't that their views did not reflect the views of Black mainstream views.)

In the 30 threads selected from GD and GD , there was not a single instance of anyone telling anyone, they did not speak for all anything.

Now ... What conclusions can we draw from these findings?

[DonCoquixote]

1. IT sounds like there is a lot of deception

Though, to be fair, I do not always align myself for all Latinos. Back in the days when the GOP was warming up to some Latinos, I was told "well everyone else is voting for their person" (and the language used was NOT politically correct, so you can fill in the blanks) and I said just because so and so as latino does not mean I want them in power.

The point being is that yes, there are people trying to silence black and other minorities by saying the real opinion is x..y, but not in any way z, Z being what most people would say. However, there may be people who just do not like Z at all. In my own case, if z=a GOP latino, than I am not in any way z.

[steve2470]

2. I think some posters lie about their race/ethnicity

Way too many trolls here IMHO.

[lovemydog]

3. My conclusion:

there are many jackasses online.

[Kind of Blue]

4. On the one hand, there's the person

who asks why do _ people feel this or that. So _ person now needs to speak for millions of other _ people, because they're not individuals but monolith.

On the other, we've got your scenario, the oppoosite one of
_, as if anyone of any group makes such a claim or there's proof such people exist. And one cannot speak on common lived experiences within a group. All wrapped up being held up to both kinds of stereotypes.

There's a great articled called Derailing for Dummies that speaks to you-don't-speak-for all...

It also works to suggest to them that their experience is worthless because it doesn’t align with everyone’s – particularly those that you’ve decided to favor That is, the experiences that, to your mind, back up your prejudices. This is belittling and offensive in the extreme as you are essentially denying their reality. People’s personal experiences are important to them, so it’s likely they will, whilst getting increasingly hurt and upset, continue to try and defend and “prove” them to your exacting measures while you can bask in the satisfaction of knowing you have caused them distress. You are well on your way to winning!

Unless You Can Prove Your Experience Is Widespread I Won’t Believe It
You’ve successfully got them in a catch-22: we have already established experience is not a monolith and just because people come from the same marginalized group does not mean they will all have the same thoughts and feelings and experiences.Yet with this one you can make it an essential proviso of your agreement that they have to PROVE what they’re claiming is definitively representative of a majority of their group of people. What is really awesome is that if, by this point, you have them so upset and frustrated that they are not carefully disclaiming their language and so say something that you can in any way distort to mean that they‘re speaking “on behalf“ of all people from their group, you can go right back up to the prior point, Your Experience Is Not Representative of Everyone, and start all over again. You can repeat these two as many times as you like! In fact, this is highly recommended as it will increase feelings of anger and frustration on their part, and then you can throw You’re Taking Things Too Personally or You’re Getting Hostile at them! http://www.derailingfordummies.com/derail-using-retaliation/

[1StrongBlackMan]

5. WOW ... So many of the tactics listed at the link ...

appeared in the thread that prompted my little experiment.

They were trying to derail the discussion? Who would have thought?

[Jackie Wilson Said]

6. I bet Clarence Thomas says this a lot.

[betsuni]

7. I've been trying to figure this out.

I saw that thread yesterday and the usual "You don't speak for all Black people" comment and wanted to say something, but what? What does it even mean? I keep thinking of an ancient Greek saying I saw somewhere that men have friends, women have relatives, and animals their own kind. A subconscious habit of imagining non-white-male-people traveling in herds? That's my theory so far.

[1StrongBlackMan]

8. What do you, a non-Black person, say ...

when challenged with the "You don't speak for all Black people" comment?

Say:

That is true; however, I have listened to what Black DUers (and maybe) and other Black people outside of DU. I am confident what I am saying is consistent and aligned with what they have been trying to communicate to you; but, you seem unable to hear. My confidence is based in the fact that they would tell me, if I was off-base ... just as they have been trying to tell you.

Then, brace yourself for:

Yeah, but ... They (Black DUers and the other ~70% of Black people) don't speak for all Black people, either.

And, depending on how your Blood Pressure is, you can respond:

True, again ... That privilege seems reserved to you and the, relatively few, Black people that agree with you.

[Number23]

11. Not only do the black people here not only speak for black people, apparently we don't even speak

for ourselves!!! Judging by the very interesting number of people who are so content to act as though we are somehow aliens among our own people. That despite being black ourselves and having grown up in or currently living in black communities, that we don't know anything about what black people are saying/thinking/doing.

And the funny part is -- EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY THING that the people in THIS form have said about black folks has been correct. EVERY LAST DAMN THING.

Not that it will make any difference to the folks who watch this forum for the sole purpose of discounting and maligning everything said here.

[betsuni]

12. Thank you!

It really is like arguing with a dining room table.

[kwassa]

9. You don't speak for all black people

Just kidding.

I see that reply, and it is partly why I posted the poll numbers earlier today, to bring the conversation back to reality. You know what the majority of black opinion is; I think that I do, too, though I get additionally attacked for being white. I actually try my best to listen to black people, unlike many of them, and I've been listening for decades, so I have an idea.

This "You don't speak for all black people "response is really a non-response, but it is the only response possible from a group of white people who have no other ammunition. They can't understand that their white analysis of which candidate is more favorable to black people is rejected by many if not most of the black contributors here on DU. They they attempt to disfranchise the black participants here by claiming they are atypical rather that what they really are, quite typical.

Part of this is just the craziness of the campaign season, with extreme partisanship the order of the day here on DU. Some of the attacks on Hillary are just insane and divorced from reality. Pure character assassination, based on nothing and ideology. I just keep reminding myself that all the screaming, on both sides, is really meaningless outside of DU. It will also have no impact on voting results. There will be no civil meeting of the minds, agreeing to disagree.

This separation from reality is part of the reason that I participate so little here, though I do glance through threads about once a day. Individual screamers on DU do not represent a national consensus of political opinion.

And over the years on DU I have learned finally to look at WHO is saying these things; you will see them over and over again. I suspect the "You don't speak for all black people" will come out of the mouths of the same few people, over and over again.

[Number23]

10. And it always tickles me that the 3-4 black people here who's views are 100% aligned with theirs

never, ever get the "you don't speak for all black people" line even though nothing could be closer to the actual truth.

If 15 polls are taken that show 90% of black people support President Obama and you just have to high five the 3-4 black people who go out of their way to represent that 10% in the most dumb-assed, ignorant, profanity laced manner possible and crap all over he 25 black folks whose views are every bit aligned with what the majority of the community is saying, I don't know how the hell you don't realize that you are saying so very, VERY much about yourself.

[kwassa]

13. Doesn't Clarence Thomas speak for all black people, too?

Or was it Cornel West? I am so confused.

Killer Mike. That is the influential black leader I am supposed to listen to.

No, it is all about these people grabbing any public black supporter and holding them up as proof of something they have already decided is right for black people.