Gun Control & RKBA
Related: About this forumAnyone else notice, that it is the SAME people from the early 1990's pushing gun control??
Feinstein, Lautenberg, and McCarthy? Talk about a one trick pony!
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NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)I lived in the SF area when she took office after the Moscone Milk assassinations.
I detested here then, and I detest her now.
grrrrr.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)you should understand why she is so personally committed to gun control.
We have to respect her for what she lived through when Harvey Mild was killed.
gejohnston
(17,502 posts)according the the accounts I read. So, are former SFPD cops still allowed to keep their guns when they leave the force? Or did they, like some places, expect officers to buy it out of their pocket?
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)True that she has a personal tragedy with guns in what happened to Moscone and Milk, that's a good point.
However, she's not what most of us would call a true blue progressive, not by a long shot.
``
Lurks Often
(5,455 posts)I certainly don't blame her for wanting to protect herself, especially during that time, but she wants to make sure the rest of us can't protect ourselves.
Scuba
(53,475 posts)
virginia mountainman
(5,046 posts)If it had not been for them, I would have never became a political activist back in 1993. They keep it up, so I continue to resist, and write checks to those that support my families primary defensive weapons.
Scuba
(53,475 posts)
spin
(17,493 posts)that gun owners are excessive paranoid or fearful.
While it is true that violent crime in our nation has decreased to levels last seen in the late 60s we still don't live in a crime free utopia.
There are many measures you can take to secure your home and help insure the safety of your family. That doesn't mean that you are afraid of an attack but merely aware of the possibility.
But even a burglar alarm and a dog in the house can fail to stop an intruder. I found this out one time in Tampa when my daughter found herself confronting a guy pushing the sliding glass door in our kitchen open despite the fact that an alarm was blaring and a 60 pound Black Lab was in the house.
Fortunately she had access to an large caliber handgun and I had taught her how to use it proficiently. She drew down on the intruder who was halfway through the door and he wisely decided to run. No shots were necessary and a potential tragedy was averted.
Consequently I feel that if all else fails, a firearm is an excellent weapon for self defense assuming you are responsible enough to have the safety training required to handle it safely and the skill to use it. However I should point out that firearms are not for everybody.
The fact that I have a firearm available for self defense does not indicate that I am paranoid but does show that I understand reality. Bad things do happen to good people and they are unpredictable. It is wise to be reasonably prepared.
Of course you have every right to bury your head in the sand and say that nothing bad will ever happen to you. Chances are you are right and I hope that you are.
I should also add that it is somewhat foolish to call another poster excessive paranoid without knowing who he is, where he lives or anything about his lifestyle. Still if it makes you feel good or helps your ego, enjoy yourself.
tosh
(4,424 posts)the paranoia about having one's guns taken away.
dexter sinister
(34 posts)that very thing? I sure have.
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)It's the slippery slope argument, isn't it! Gun laws about background checks for everyone, and closing the gun show loophole, and requiring gun safety standards--those are EXACTLY THE SAME as taking away ALL THE GUNS. Oh, wait....
Aren't those NRA talking points?
Edited to add: Fuck the NRA.
dexter sinister
(34 posts)of safely owning guns. I really appreciate it.
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)
dexter sinister
(34 posts)How sad.
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)
dexter sinister
(34 posts)
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)"render my family defenseless"
Il a un flair pour la dramtic.
frylock
(34,825 posts)whatever will you do if you can't defend them with a 30 round mag? buy a shotgun and quit fucking whining ffs.
virginia mountainman
(5,046 posts)We chose rifles. We have ACRES of property....
You would even be surprised at what the preferred rifle is around here... (hint, it its basic design is over 100 years old, and is very much a military weapon, a REAL military rifle, not some thing that just LOOKS like one.)
NOT MINE, mine looks much nicer!
aquart
(69,014 posts)Keep up the good luck.
Response to aquart (Reply #33)
NEG This message was self-deleted by its author.
dexter sinister
(34 posts)It works lots of different ways.
DonP
(6,185 posts)Very slick actions on those and, next to my '03 Springfield, the best sight systems I've ever seen.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)iiibbb
(1,448 posts)virginia mountainman
(5,046 posts)An my kids can too! 
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)Works for me. Glad to have you aboard the gun sanity express.
virginia mountainman
(5,046 posts)That while the Lee Enfield, does use 5 shot "clips"...It's "magazine" holds ten rounds..
This is why idiots should not write laws about things they know little about. Sort of like the "shoulder thing that goes up"
And while I am perfectly comfortable using my light, handy, and very powerful carbine, my wife prefers an semi-automatic that is based on the AKM action. It uses 30 round magazines too, (also with an adapter that I happen to have, it's magazines will accept a 10 shot "clip".
She is much more comfortable with it. So she should use it. I on the other hand, have much broader firearm needs than she does when I am not home like helping with the family farm, dealing with some rouge dogs, hurt and dangerous large animals, not to mention the bear problem at the school bus stop, etc etc...
The semi-auto AKM is simply too anemic for my firearm needs, as it, it is too under powered...The things she is most likely to need her rifle for is much different than mine.
And for the record, she intends to keep it...
MightyMopar
(735 posts)The composition of America's electorate is changing and gun pushers won't be welcome.
spin
(17,493 posts)I predict some minor improvements in our gun laws will happen and another watered down version of the Assault Weapons ban might pass.
That's the most you can get because political reality is a bitch.
But then, I could be wrong.
MightyMopar
(735 posts)virginia mountainman
(5,046 posts)Who is going to disarm a people that refuse to be disarmed?
YOU?!
MightyMopar
(735 posts)Most gunwackos will give up when their credit cards are revoked. The Pagans motorcycle gang is far tougher than the typical armchair wacko and the feds raided them.
virginia mountainman
(5,046 posts)How very progressive of you....
Puha Ekapi
(594 posts)....and revealing that a poster here has no problem with armed jackbooted thugs as long as they work for the Government. But Mr./Mrs. Ordinary Citizen? Nope, can't have that.
sarisataka
(18,755 posts)liberal/progressives who happily shred the Constitutional protections of the BoR and support government sanctioned mass murder as long as it is for a 'good cause'
MightyMopar
(735 posts)Jefferson said the Constitution can be changed. Look it up, you might learn something. We shouldn't look at the Constitution like the Taliban look at the Koran.
sarisataka
(18,755 posts)The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which, in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as Part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate.
Shall we propose Amendment 28-
The 2nd Amendment is herby repealed. Arms are subject to any regulation or forfeiture as deemed by any vote of the Federal, state or local government.
Those who own arms, within allowed laws may be ostracized and denied employment or any other rights and privileges, without recourse, according to any standard the community deems acceptable. These standards shall be superior to any contrary law, including the Constitution.
Any who fail to follow laws regarding restriction shall be subject to death of themselves, their families may be subject to death as well and their property destroyed. No due process nor appeal is necessary for these punishments.
Anyone committing any crime in the presence of an arm shall be subject to immediate execution.
I have pulled all of the ideas from here on DU... some in this thread have supported some.
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)I seem to like what I see... I especially like this line: "The BOR isn't a death pact"
I could not agree more the constitution is a document which... yes... does change. And hopefully it changes to take some of the needless weapons away from people who put my right to safety at risk.
Puha Ekapi
(594 posts)...are neither liberal or progressive. The word "Stalinist" comes to mind as an apt description.
MightyMopar
(735 posts)"Some men look at constitutions with sanctimonious reverence, and deem them like the ark of the Covenant, too sacred to be touched. They ascribe to the men of the preceding age a wisdom more than human, and suppose what they did to be beyond amendment… laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind… as that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, institutions must advance also, to keep pace with the times… We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain forever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors."
-- Thomas Jefferson, on reform of the Virginia Constitution
"That our Creator made the earth for the use of the living and not of the dead; that those who exist not can have no use nor right in it, no authority or power over it; that one generation of men cannot foreclose or burden its use to another, which comes to it in its own right and by the same divine beneficence; that a preceding generation cannot bind a succeeding one by its laws or contracts; these deriving their obligation from the will of the existing majority, and that majority being removed by death, another comes in its place with a will equally free to make its own laws and contracts; these are axioms so self-evident that no explanation can make them plainer."
-- Thomas Jefferson to T. Earle, 1823
http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/Quotes-USconstitution.htm
BTW, NRA board member Grover Norquist famously had a bust of Lenin in his office.
gejohnston
(17,502 posts)the rumor I heard is that he has a paining of Lenin, and studied his tactics. Newt Gingrich did the same with FDR.
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/12/newt-gingrich-admires-roosevelts-franklin-and-teddy/
Neither of which has anything to do with Stalin.
Puha Ekapi
(594 posts)...you favor a Police State with the military enforcing rules of the Reich.
MightyMopar
(735 posts)Puha Ekapi
(594 posts)...of my firearms. They all are very competent in the safe and skilled use of them. Same for my neighbors.
dexter sinister
(34 posts)I hope you're not a creationist as well...
dexter sinister
(34 posts)...
Response to MightyMopar (Reply #15)
Post removed
MightyMopar
(735 posts)The reason the KKK has no power is because the FBI destroyed them.
spin
(17,493 posts)I live in north Florida. The Black community in my small town is well armed.
Puha Ekapi
(594 posts)...white folks aren't the only ones with legally owned firearms. I'm not white, and in my home community and others like it throughout North America, most households are well armed. We learned a hard lesson early on what happens to us at the hands of the dominant culture when the means to defend ourselves is removed. Pass all the freaking laws you want, it won't disarm us.
MightyMopar
(735 posts)History is not on your side and it's not on the side of a fading redneck culture either.
Puha Ekapi
(594 posts)..what? That I am not white? That traditional 'skins on the rez aren't well armed Democrats?
leftofcool
(19,460 posts)Puha Ekapi
(594 posts)...being against Constitutional Rights, you are also opposed to Native Rights.
dexter sinister
(34 posts)Somehow the criminals didn't get the memo and the decent folks have few defensive tools.
MightyMopar
(735 posts)spin
(17,493 posts)The problem is that we have 80,000,000 gun owners and over 300,000,000 firearms in our nation.
The political reality is that this is not going to change anytime in the near future.
dexter sinister
(34 posts)I wonder how different the world would be if Japan had dropped an atomic bomb on Seattle back in 1944...
dexter sinister
(34 posts)Japan is still even now a virtually homogeneous culture. Not even similar to the USA.
malaise
(269,157 posts)There are licensed owners. That said there ae way moe illegal weapons than legal - thanks to the loose regulations demanded by the US NRA.
virginia mountainman
(5,046 posts)And who exactly will deal with the "gun pushers"? Just exactly what do you propose, and WHO, will you get to do it??
What will you do about large numbers of people that just sit back and laugh if some strict law gets passed? And who will you get to enforce it?
MightyMopar
(735 posts)Reward neighbors and ex wives for turning them in and send bounty hunters after them in return for their assets.
Now that we're easing up on marijuana, we can fill the for profit jails with gunwackos.
The coming information age will trump your guns like cars beat horses. They'll have nanobots go under your door and up your ass.
virginia mountainman
(5,046 posts)Shows how little you really do understand about the situation at hand. I posses the skills to make firearms and ammunition, practically from scratch, want me to explain to you how to do this???? I have fully functioning firearms that are over 120 years old, they still work as good as the day they where built.. They will easily last 120 more years.
You cannot un-invent things, and like with the marijuana, where their is a will their is a way.
MightyMopar
(735 posts)virginia mountainman
(5,046 posts)This is why, we win the debate...I wonder, if your name is not "Piers"....
MightyMopar
(735 posts)gejohnston
(17,502 posts)not the party. The support for the party is depended on support for Social Security, better trade policy, Wall Street regulation, etc. How do you think Bernie Sanders gets has overwhelming support even in most conservative parts of Vermont? He even unseated a Republican who voted for the first AWB.
MightyMopar
(735 posts)Gun culture is the last gasp of white male dominance. The future is against you.
gejohnston
(17,502 posts)all the Hispanics I know own guns. A lot of African Americans and women too. You can rant all you want about your culture war, it only makes your movement look foolish. On the other hand, your classist and anti rural rants is also costing the party. People don't vote issues, they vote their identity.
Response to gejohnston (Reply #50)
Post removed
gejohnston
(17,502 posts)now that you are sounding less than rational, I suggest a good merlot.
rl6214
(8,142 posts) dexter sinister
(34 posts)to the recalibration center...
generalhh
(20 posts)I own my wife owns our parents both have atleast a shotgun. Many southern blacks own and shoot. Many retail/food small business owners own firearms.
People say the demographics of this country are changing and they are right also i know almost all of my black friends from UNC that live in states that allow it cary or own guns for their protection(sorry DC/NYC unc Alumni).
Be careful grouping all blacks and Hispanics into big monolith blocks. and assuming they support all the polices you support.
Black people and Hispanics also have a strong distrust of the police partly because it was the police the directly allowed the abuse of our people in every generation. Remeber the police and most young black men dont have the best of relationships. Stop and frisk and driving while black stops but when u call the cops its 30min wait or more sometimes and usally the police cant help you until after you are shot,lynched, dead, raped.
dexter sinister
(34 posts)would like to be forgotten.
dexter sinister
(34 posts)I know those kinds of facts aren't well liked for some...
sylvi
(813 posts)Sounds like you would have been right at home in any of dozen despotic, authoritarian regimes as the officially designated Block Informant. That's a good little Brownshirt. You can pick up your extra rations at the neighborhood Staatspolizei office.
sarisataka
(18,755 posts) 
Could you elaborate on why you believe the people of Somalia, Pakistan or Dumbfuckistan are lesser people than residents of the United States?
JI7
(89,262 posts)MightyMopar
(735 posts)sarisataka
(18,755 posts)have you? Libertarian is not a label I would assign.
Somalia- well that went south when the mission changed to disarming the warlords, but that was a different goat rodeo.
I thought I have worked with or met someone from every X-stan country but I might have missed one. My experience gives different views of the residents of each but dumbfuck is not one.
MightyMopar
(735 posts)gejohnston
(17,502 posts)Somalia could be considered as feudal. BTW, the average Somali doesn't have access to guns for two reasons: strict gun laws before the place fell apart, and they can't afford it. The per capita income is about ten bucks a year, meaning it would take that long to save for a box of shells, never mind the gun.
The AK wielding guys you see in pictures are retainers for the local warlord, IOWs, the forces of the defacto governments.
Mojorabbit
(16,020 posts)Yavapai
(825 posts)such as MEXICO.
I am sure that you would feel much safer over there!
leveymg
(36,418 posts)Feeling a bit vulnerable and outgunned?
leftofcool
(19,460 posts)Should I use my brains against him or my rifle?
leveymg
(36,418 posts)Did you need one of these to deal with it?
leftofcool
(19,460 posts)One wild boar who tried to rush me after I tried to avoid him, one copperhead and one very large and very rabid raccoon. What I use is none of the above but that is not in question. You stated that I should use my brains to defend myself and I asked you a question that you refuse to answer.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)Besides, I said your brain should be your primary defensive tool, not the only one in every situation. The snake you should have left alone, if it wasn't going to get into the house.
Didn't know there were wild pigs out in the western part of the state. How was the boar? Probably kinda gamey, but smoked with some cloves, ginger and cranberry sauce or a course mustard, maybe not bad.
leftofcool
(19,460 posts)2 shots to the boar which was carted off by the forest rangers for me. We have had a serious problem in Kentucky with them. The rabid raccoon took one shot and I left him for the flying wildlife. They gotta eat too. Snake wasn't close enough to the house for me to worry about but was way too close to me to not take a shot. I was bitten by a rattler once on a hiking trek so I don't take chances with copperheads since they are more dangerous. Most of the time, you don't have to shoot to kill animals unless you know there is danger. Brother boar is a big problem and will hurt you. Rabid raccoons have to go as well.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)or a semiauto rifle.
Duckhunter935
(16,974 posts)guardian
(2,282 posts)
generalhh
(20 posts)You know why the are all good semi-auto rifles and are fun to shoot. I personally run 3gun with my piston driven AR-15 Sig.
My wife shots and likes the light recoil of the Sig but prefers to shoot my FAL (mostly because of the great optics it has on it I got off a broke solider mid pay week for $75.
I dont really use any of my "modern sporting rifles" for my home defense they stay locked up in the safe. But i do have a Saiga 12 Semi-Auto 12 gauge shotgun filled with 00 buck or winchester pdx-1. It is feed by a 10 round magazine (although i do own a 20rd drum and 5 and 12 round mags). My wife can shoot it well and with the attached light and laser identifying target is easier at night. I have a quick release safe for this shotgun mounted in our closet. with a coded key press the gun is freed from the clamp/lock on the wall. the closet is also our safe from and includes hardened walls and doors (rated to small rifle (223/5.56,7.62x39, .308) It also has separate communications from the house and monitor to view home security cameras. THe previous owner of this place had all this done we picked up the place on a distress sale. Former military guy who was a contractor owned before us.
sylvi
(813 posts)And brains designed weapons. You know, for those times when solving a Rubik's Cube just doesn't do that much for deterring an attacker.
DragonBorn
(175 posts)Excuse me. My father is a 1st generation immigrant, was a teacher back in his home country, worked for the Board of Ed in NY, and then moved on to County Government in Bureau of Consumer Protection. He has been a democrat since moving to this country and is a very intelligent man.
But when we first got to this country we where very poor, coming from a literal third world country. So we ended up living in a very bad neighborhood. You know what my father did to protect us? He bought a rifle, that I happily now own. Are you trying to suggest that my father is somehow less intelligent that you because he decided he need protection for his family from the gang members and hood rats that would gather on our the steps to our house and smoke weed? The neighborhood was so bad cops didn't come unless there was gunfire or someone was bleeding on the street. What would you have suggest he do? Nothing? I'd love to hear your non-violent suggestions for clearing a group of 8 uncooperative guys off your porch when the police wont respond to your calls.
I'm betting if you lived in my old neighborhood for a week you'd understand why your so wrong.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)
Sekhmets Daughter
(7,515 posts)Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)
doc03
(35,363 posts)in the 90's are still shills for the NRA?
frylock
(34,825 posts)doc03
(35,363 posts)same bullshit. I am proud to say I quit the NRA when old Wayne turned the NRA into a Republican mouthpiece.
frylock
(34,825 posts)good on ya! 
spin
(17,493 posts)bowens43
(16,064 posts)Criminals, murderers, gun dealers
and psychotic death loving lunatics
Talk about one trick ponies....
MightyMopar
(735 posts)sylvi
(813 posts)In fact they're some if its biggest fans. Less worry about a potential victim being armed.
MightyMopar
(735 posts)dexter sinister
(34 posts)and as far as I know has never apologized for it.
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
sylvi
(813 posts)Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)Oh wait.....
discntnt_irny_srcsm
(18,482 posts)The Song Remains the Same & The Smoker You Drink, the Player You Get.
HockeyMom
(14,337 posts)In 1955 when I was 6 years old I saw a bus driver in NYC shot in the head to death. I have been a "gun grabber" ever since, even after an attempted attack on my person many years later. Don't believe the NRA talking points on that one either.
villager
(26,001 posts)Where's the smilie for the "that's so sadly pathetic" head shake...?
