Technical (read: n00b) Question -- Why are sawed-off shotguns illegal?

[Nuclear Unicorn]

I'm not arguing to have them legalized; I honestly don't know enough to decide one way or another.

Thank-you in advance.

[AZ Mike]

1. Because of the damage they do and the purpose they serve....

That's it.

Good question.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

4. OK. Accepted without argument, but pistols are concealable as well (obviously)

With a 15-round magazine doesn't that give a pistol more lethal potential than a shotgun?

[Jenoch]

8. I think it is because the only

reason to cut off the barrel of a shotgun (and presumably the stock as well) is to make the gun concealable for nefarious purposes.

[Straw Man]

10. True, but ...

With a 15-round magazine doesn't that give a pistol more lethal potential than a shotgun?

When the laws against sawed-off shotguns were passed (1934), 15-round pistols were extremely rare. Shotguns were (and are) cheap and ubiquitous, becoming easy weapons of opportunity.

[rl6214]

24. Not necessarily

If you load that shotgun with 00 buck, each shot gun shell has I think it's 8/9 38 caliber pellets it it. At close range it's devastating. With up to 8 shotgun shells in your average shotgun, that gives you 64 or so projectiles without reloading. Compare that to a pistol with 15 rounds.

[wercal]

11. I thought they were associated with '20s era gangsters

And restricted about the same time fully automatic weapons were.

[Eleanors38]

20. Can't think when I last heard of one used in crime. nt

[PoliticAverse]

2. Because they are much easier to conceal with a shortened barrel.

Also note they aren't necessarily 'illegal' they are classified as NFA weapons (some states specifically do make
them illegal).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Firearms_Act

[Straw Man]

3. Nothing to do with damage.

They are no more destructive than long-barreled shotguns.

It's the concealment issue. That's all.

[krispos42]

5. Probably to make the dividing line between handguns and long guns clear

If it can be fired from the shoulder, it's a long gun.

If it's got a barrel of 4", it's small enough to be a handgun.




I don't have any real idea, except that they can be popular among robbers and such. A very short barrel makes a shotgun with a hell of a spread.


In the movie "Killing Them Softly", two men rob a card game; one of the is armed with a double-barrel shotgun that is cut so short that the ends of the cartridges are exposed a half-inch or more past the muzzles.

[Eleanors38]

23. Low-velocity splatter if the shells are hanging out.

[petronius]

6. I suspect it's because they're rather concealable, and are perceived

as being particularly powerful examples of firearms that can be so hidden. Also, they've historically been associated with criminal uses (bank robbers, gangsters) while legitimate uses were less well-known. And perhaps a shotgun to be shortened was historically more available to those criminal users than a handgun might have been...

[ileus]

7. They're only illegal if you don't get a tax stamp.

200 bucks and you can own one.

[gejohnston]

9. ironiclly,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sawed-off_shotgun#Canada
a sawed off shotgun, as long as it factory made, is unrestricted, meaning it doesn't require any registration in Canada. You just need a valid PAL.

Actually they are "legal" in the US, just have to jump through the NFA hoops.

They are more powerful than handguns and are easier to conceal than a full sized one. Of course, like everything else there is a price to be paid. You shorten the barrel, you lose accuracy, range and power.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

12. You know what keeps drawing me to the "gungeon"?

The fact that people argue facts. So much of GD etc is little more than hyperbole and histrionics.

I made an observation today that the sequester wasn't a political issue, i.e. there was no popular backlash. Next thing I knew I was being savaged for endorsing the sequester as if observation = endorsement.

Here people argue case law and technical details. IOW -- it's facts based. Ironically, "gungeoneers" are labeled as being emotionally fragile (and yet the abuse we passively accept none of our critics could endure).

[NYC_SKP]

15. I thought it was the soft pretzles.

They're salty, buttery, just a hint of sweetness!







OBTW, I agree with you. Less emotion, more reason, very rare to see insults and namecalling behaviors.

[rl6214]

25. Ooohhhhh, I picked up four of those at the mall today

Buttery and salty good.

[ileus]

18. Everyone else (except xians maybe) are protected.

2A progressives are left to fend for ourselves. Best thing is we have truth on our side, and it always wins out over emotion and misinformation.

[Eleanors38]

22. We're experts at sounding expert...

Turkey guns can run as short-barreled as 22" without significant loss of a given cartouche's actual muzzle velocity (shotgun propellant is similar to that of a hand gun's in that it is fast-burning). Why, then, even bother with varying barrel lengths? Because longer barrels are steadier swinging for long shots at birds, or for sporting clays; short barrels are unsteady for most any range or hunting sports except for turkeys where the hunter is sitting stone still with the blunderbuss resting on knees, or held by a stock thumb hole, and sometimes a vertical grip. Furthermore, short barrels are Not synonymous with open choke or big patterns. Turkey guns are the tightest chokes of all ("extra full&quot .

No purpose-built turkey or "tactical" gun is sawn-off; they are built to fill different roles.

[PoliticAverse]

14. Note that they are still illegal in some US states/localities even with an NFA tax stamp. n/t

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

13. Technically speaking...

...the shorter the barrel of the shotgun, the wider the load will spread at a given distance. This has the effect of wounding a number of persons who are closely grouped or reducing the skill needed to hit one individual. This combined with the ability to conceal it makes it a target for greater restrictions.

[oneshooter]

16. Interesting enough I have a 14" barrel 12 ga in my collection.

Bought it from a fellow in Florida that didn't like the recoil. Mailed direct to my PO Box. Great piece, a little loud though.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

17. What year, model...

???

[oneshooter]

21. It is a percussion double offered by Dixie Gunworks a few years ago.

It was called the "Stage Coach" shotgun.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

26. nice

[Eleanors38]

19. I have a 1955 Stevens 311 S x S in .12 ga, the same model cited in Miller...

Only Miller's was a sawn-off, over a foot shorter than my standard issue 28". Up into the mid-1980s, Stevens/Savage offered a law enforcement 311 with 18.5" barrel -- ironically, a 1/2" more than the min. requiring NFA registration. I've shot doubles in teal and dove with that old whore.

[Half-Century Man]

27. They were made illegal in the Bonny and Clyde era.

Bank robbers liked to saw off several specific weapons. Clyde Barrow liked a sawn off BAR (Browning Automatic Rifle). And the Browning Auto-5 (the first mass produced auto loading shotgun) was a favorite to cut down. They weapons favored by organized crime and the Depression-era bank robbers (Sutton, Barrow and Parker, Dillinger)were made illegal in 1934 as "destructive devices".