I stated in another thread that I don't hang with straight people.

[closeupready]

Online, of course, that's different. There are many straight DU members here that I love, love, love. But then, the difference is that online, you can get to know people on an intellectual level before meeting them, and click with them at a political and emotional level. Even IRL, I have at least one straight female friend, who is what used to be known as a 'fag hag', and I love her to death.

But as I said in the other thread, I don't hang with any straight people, and I really never have. I'm not sure where such a relationship is supposed to lead. Certainly, it doesn't lead to romance. And with regard to friendship, the straight people I've met (even my fag hag friend) can never seem to 'get' gay life, how we live, why we do the things we do.

I realize that not every gay person lives in large communities where thousands of gay people congregate together to be with their own kind, and so for them, you may need to diversify the pool of those about whom you'd consider friendship.

But I prefer the company of gay men, even lesbians.

So for those of you here who hang with straight people, can you explain that? I mean, how did you meet your straight friends? Do you ever clash on things relating to sexuality? Is there some quality of such a relationship that is present, where such qualities are absent in your relationships with other gay people?

Interested in any thoughts, thanks in advance.

[WillParkinson]

1. No...

I have straight friends. My sexuality, or theirs, is not the main focus of my life for me or for them. We have other common interests. Even my husband and I do not share the same interests overall, but he is still the love of my life.

I just have friends. They're not straight, they aren't gay. They just are. I won't refuse a friend based on who they sleep with. To me that smacks of elitism and is just as bad as straight people saying they cannot be friends with gay people.

Could be just me. I don't know. As Depeche Mode said, "People are people."

[closeupready]

2. I don't think it's 'just you' - I think I'm weird like this.

I think it's probably true that most gay people have straight friends, and/or 'hang' with them.

And I know a popular fetish with some men is seducing the 'straight' man - you know, "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy". I don't think I've ever had such a fetish. If there isn't going to be any romance, then what's the point?

I mean, we can talk about archaeology or economics or gardening, fine, but such talk alone can't sustain a friendship, or at least not a very deep one.

Additionally, I should point out that a good number of my friends are not only gay, but former boyfriends. Or else one of us once (or still does) had a sexual attraction for the other guy.

[Smarmie Doofus]

3. Good questions.

>>>>So for those of you here who hang with straight people, can you explain that? I mean, how did you meet your straight friends? Do you ever clash on things relating to sexuality? Is there some quality of such a relationship that is present, where such qualities are absent in your relationships with other gay people? >>>>>>.

I look at it very differently, I guess. Sometimes I even "prefer" the company of straight people.... by which I really mean ...I prefer mixed gatherings to all, or predominantly gay ones.

For one thing... conversation topics tend to be more eclectic. Also... I tend to not be that interested in stuff that my glbt friends like to talk about ( celebrities, pop culture gossip, etc. for example. Ugh. Yawn. )

I meet straight people at work , thru political activities, thru other people.

They're not hard to find, really. In some neighborhoods they're literally all over the place!

If they're going to clash with me over my... or their... sexuality, I guess we wouldn't be friends.

[closeupready]

7. 'in some neighborhoods, they are literally all over the place..'

Yeah, I know.

[Fearless]

15. +1

[edgineered]

4. Please do not think that you must make changes

to who you are in order to gain friends, straight or otherwise. By the same token be sure that you are not overly concerned with how those you meet are going to react if they 'find out' about you.

I know this is important to you, and I also know that seeing others who always seem to be with friends can cause you to ask questions of yourself. People have spent their entire lives looking for answers. The ones that get good at it are called philosophers. You'll find a world of people who can no more understand the world than they can understand themselves. It gets real confusing when who you are changes everyday.

Be happy that LGBT is more accepted now than ever in recent history. I am a straight ally, so maybe I can't fully understand, but never do I put up with ignorance and hatred in my presence. Lets hope the day comes when you dont need those like me to 'have your back'.

[closeupready]

6. A sincere thanks for this post.

[stevenleser]

38. I echo engineered...

your situation/experience is not altogether different from mine. All of my friends are women. I spent a lot of time wondering if that was something I should be concerned about and then decided it was who I was and should stop worrying about it. I just like being around women and dont much like being around men.

I dont think there is anything wrong with that, or with you hanging out only with LGBT folks.

[closeupready]

39. Thanks!

I try to be well-rounded, but I just am who I am.

[LonePirate]

5. Geography plays a huge part in this, I think.

I live in a small midwestern city with almost no gay community or culture outside of the bar scene. I'm also an introvert with little interest in bar hopping so that makes meeting people and establishing friendships more difficult. Consequently most of my in-person friends are straight. Most of my online friends are LGBT. That's just how life has happened to shake out for me.

[closeupready]

9. Yeah. I

came from a small midwestern town originally, so I know how limiting that can potentially be. Maybe that's why I always wanted to be in some metropolis somewhere - so I could surround myself 24/7 with gay people.

[William769]

8. Diversity plays a large part in my life.

In that would be friends and acquaintances. I love my brothers & sisters (our family) just as much if not more than my real family. I also love people of all shapes, sizes, colors & backgrounds. To me thats what I consider my rainbow.

If I am not a diverse person, how can I expect others to be?

[closeupready]

10. True.

In truth, I think I'd have to say I prefer the company of people NOT like me, and NOT from my kind of background. Not sure exactly why, but it's an undeniable fact.

[William769]

11. I should have added in my other post thats how I live my life

& don't expect to be a model for others to follow. People should live how they feel most comfortable. If this is right for you then more power to you.

Bill

[WillParkinson]

12. I agree 100%...

No one should be allowed to tell us how we should live our lives. If it works for you then that's all that should ever matter.

[Fearless]

16. Absolutely agree!! n/t

[unapatriciated]

13. I can answer your question from a different angle.

To start out with I'm a straight white female. I know, I know people don't usually start a conversation clarifying their sexual identity, give me a little slack this one time I now enjoy the friendship of many GBLT's but growing up I did not. Like you I spent my time with people I 'thought' were more like me. As I got older I became a little more picky about who I called a close friend. Compassion for their fellow man not sexuality was my basis for calling someone a close friend.

I understand why you would want to stay close to the gay community, it is not like joe and jane america have been very welcoming to GBLT's. I'm fortunate to have had the opportunity in meeting and getting to know many GLBT's because of my daughter, her wife and their friends. You know what I found out? Their lifestyle was much the same as mine, working, having a little fun and raising their kids. If I had not taken that opportunity I would have missed out on knowing some really great people and having them call me friend. To be honest most call me mom and one calls me Dougie (don't ask it's a long story).

I guess what I'm trying to say is true friends care about you and sexual preference doesn't really factor into it. I have a close friend at work, I call her my friend Sheridan not my lesbian friend Sheridan.

[closeupready]

19. You remind me a little of Teresa Heinz-Kerry, who

famously said during her husband's run for president, to the GLBT community, "just call me 'mom'!"

[Fearless]

14. I'm pretty much the opposite.

Last edited Sat Mar 24, 2012, 10:54 PM - Edit history (1)

For most of my life since coming out, I've maintained a majority of friendships with straight people and some with LGBTers. I think it primarily has to do with our interests but also the comfort factor (surprisingly I'm sure, but I'll explain). I look for different things from friends as I do from a boyfriend/husband/fuck. For friends I look for common interests. Someone I can sit down and talk with about this and that and that can do things together in a purely platonic sense. I don't do the "friend becomes boyfriend/husband/fuck" thing because I find it leads to drama and stupidity. Personal experience.

Friends I prefer straight because I don't want to find them attractive. I want friends not fuck buddies. It helps that I am fairly masculine in a traditional sense, enjoying sports, hiking, camping, etc. Combining that with my desire to not be attracted to my friends, it just sort of pans out that way. I don't think when meeting new people that my friends have to be XYZ, but chances are if I'm spoken for I'm more apt to turn away even gay guys that have similar interests. I know that road, and it's not for me.

In terms of boyfriends/husband/fuck I'm looking for someone who is very attractive, romantic, intimate, (ok and maybe fucking hung!). And luckily I've found such a person. We share interests too no doubt. But at the same time there aren't forty other guys barking up my tree or waiting in the wings as "friends" who secretly despise my boyfriend and suck up to me. I can't stand people who act like friends to take advantage of a situation.

My two cents.

Hmm... didn't really answer all the questions...

People who have problems with my sexuality aren't my friends. So I never have that problem. Frequently I'll answer questions about being gay that they're curious about. Perhaps not surprisingly, penis size is a frequent topic of interest. With my group of friends whenever they start talking about relationships or relationship issues, I do too. It's fairly normal for us. No one bats an eye. What's better is when we bring around others who aren't "the group" per se and start up those discussions... then we make new people more comfortable with "gay stuff" and normalize it further in everyday conversation.

As to how I meet straight people... I just meet people to be honest. I don't think about their sexuality (unless it's obvious). If they hit on me I tell them I'm spoken for. Otherwise, friendship is fair game if we get along well.

And the only quality that changes between straight friends and gay friends is their sexuality. I don't think there is a delineating factor that universally differentiates them from each other other than that. Although I will say that the easiest way to get a gay guy on my bad side is to hit on me after I've said I'm spoken for. For straight guys, the easiest way to get on my bad side is homophobic remarks or uber jock machismo.

As for women in this who debate, I have very very few female friends. They are either met through others, my past/present subordinates at work, or lesbians. Over all, I don't do much with women at all.

[Neoma]

42. Penis size, seriously?

What are a bunch of straight guys asking about your penis size for?

[Fearless]

44. Lol. Not MY penis size...

That's one of those things people need to find out the old fashioned way. Actually, I meant asking about other guys in general. Some straight guys seem to care. It's very tied to masculinity for some reason. I can't tell you the number of times I've gotten into discussions with coworkers regarding this. (Of course it may be because there's a running gag that the director of the place I work has "issues" in that department and things progress downhill from there.)

[bigwillq]

17. I have more "straight" friends than "gay" ones.

Grew up with a big group of friends; still am close with most of them. I also hang out with a lot of different groups of folks; gays, straights, blacks, whites, latinos, Catholics, Jewish...and who we sleep with isn't really that big of a deal.

[closeupready]

27. Right, I understand.

I address this below. Cheers.

[bigwillq]

28. Address what?

[closeupready]

29. Sorry, I was really unclear there. Post #24.

I address more specifically why 'who you sleep with' is, sadly, important.

I guess in some sense, now that I think about it, it is also important to me. In a manner similar to how minority people will sometimes seek to be surrounded by their 'own kind', I seek to be surrounded by gay people.

I recall a meeting I attended many years ago at this community center. It was a meeting of gay Asians, and I attended with an Asian friend of mine, at his request. And truthfully, I was very intrigued, and kind of hoped I could have made some new friends, but if not, just to be there and to listen. There were maybe 20- 25 people in attendance. I think I was one of two white Americans there. Everyone else was South Asian ex-pats, desi's.

And late in the meeting, one of the leaders stated, without making eye contact with me, "I think it's important to reinforce that these meetings are for South Asians ONLY. The dances, well, it doesn't matter, but these meetings are only for South Asians."

I was angry at the time, but in hindsight, I realize that was just his thing. And to be fair, I think sometimes I'm a little the same way, too.

[bigwillq]

30. I would call that racism.

The "only South Asian" part.

I never really consider myself to be the "surrounded by my own kind" kind. I guess I live in a very diverse world. I feel like I fit in with just about everyone, which is why I don't really feel it's a big deal about who people sleep with. It makes us who we are, to an extent, but it's just a minor part of who we are.

My straight friends and I talk about sex all the time. Straight sex, gay sex, SEX.

I think it's a bit natural to want to be surrounded by gay people, especially when one first "comes out", but I don't know if I would enjoy to be surrounded by just gay people, or just white people or just catholics, etc, etc....

I like diversity. I like being around people of all different backgrounds, races, etc...It's just how I've always been.

But everyone is different. It seems like you're different than I am in regards to who we seek to be surrounded by. Nothing wrong with that. Thanks for clarifying.

[closeupready]

31. yes, it was racist, but from a position of weakness, it makes some sense.

Obviously, I didn't want to empathize, at the time, because I was embarrassed and disappointed.

But with the passage of time, I've come to see that I kind of get why minorities don't want a white guy around, being a busybody, asking lots of questions, kind of being intrusive to a milieu which is, for them, second nature.

Peace!

[La Lioness Priyanka]

33. No, it's not racist. It's keeping a safe space for a minority community

there is nothing at all racist about that.


it is not at all racist, for me to want to keep my support group for south asians only. It's support group, if we can't be open and we may not be able to be open in front of outsiders, what is the point of support group?

[closeupready]

36. Regardless, it doesn't matter. The salient point was, he was rude about it,

and I'll never forget it. If I recall correctly, I didn't even open my mouth during the entire meeting.

And then after the meeting, during the brief kaffeeklatsch, I just felt so very awkward. I wanted to leave, but out of respect for my friend, I stayed; he chatted up some others there, but I just averted eye contact and kept to myself. But I was just like, wow, how stupid was I? Even typing this, it still kind of stings, but it's just one of those things you have to experience and learn from. I imagine S. Asians get the very same type of thing from us in the majority all the time, so now I know what it feels like.

But I hope you don't think I begrudge South Asians their safe spaces as such. I think it was something I did when I was younger, and a bit naive. As I've tried to indicate here, I also prefer 'my own kind' in personal relationships. I certainly can't lecture anyone else when I'm the same way.

Peace!

[La Lioness Priyanka]

40. yes, typically he should have pulled you aside and NOT embarrassed

you. that i think is rude.

but my point is rude is not racist. you know what i mean?

[closeupready]

41. Yes, upon further reflection, I think I have to agree with you.

He was trying to preserve the integrity of the group and the entire basis for having formed the group in the first place - a minority within a minority trying to survive within a society sometimes hostile to them for numerous reasons. Even as a friend to their community (as I still am), my whitebread American presence there served not to help free discussion happen, but rather had the potential of chilling it. It's likely many there didn't share his views, but I do think it's a perfectly legitimate point, I really do.

At the time, I wasn't able to think this all through, but I'm glad you've helped shed some light on what the thought process was, I'm always appreciative when you do that.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

43. i really appreciate how you take things in the way they were intended

rather than get all defensive.

i truly appreciate that about you

[closeupready]

45. I could never get mad at you, you know that!!!!

(playing with the new smilies, lol)

[La Lioness Priyanka]

32. Please, it's not racist. It's called safe spaces. Its about as racist as having an African American

LGBT club.

You may be gay, and that is your only oppression, however for my community they have many more unique oppressors. Some because of their race, culture and sexual orientation.

it is not at all racist, for me to want to keep my support group for south asians only. It's support group, if we can't be open and we may not be able to be open in front of outsiders, what is the point of support group?

For something to be racist, one race has to systematically have greater power than the other. Only in context of that is something racist. South Asians in america don't have greater power than whites in society.

[bigwillq]

35. Good points (nt)

[mitchtv]

18. the only straight people I am friends with are my family

and there's plenty of them. I had a few strate friends in my union, but they all drifted away when I left. I am still friendly with a few from my old neighborhood, but the longest and closest friends are gay, and we have treasured those relationships, as we have all lost many mutual friends and aquaintances.

[closeupready]

20. This is, like, totally me, Mitch.

Your experience is my experience.

[beyurslf]

21. I have lots of straight friends. With the exception of my best friend (who is gay), I probably

spend more time with straight folks than I do gay ones. I don't really think about it. We're friends because we have common interests and enjoy each other's company. I would assume these are the reasons most people are friends. Honestly, I probably have more lesbian friends than gay male friends too. At least, friends that i consider close friends anyway.

[closeupready]

26. I guess the thing is with me, I enjoy talking about sex

and dating and just the whole experience of being gay, traveling to other places, meeting gay people, films, etc. It helps that for the most part, gay men are liberal and progressive, so I can also feel safe talking about things like the economy and candidates for public office, we can share a laugh about the Republican clowns, etc.

[beyurslf]

46. I live in the heart of red america,

but all my friends are liberals. I talk just as normally about dating and guys as my straight friends do about their experiences. I don't talk about sex all that much, but it just be the lack of it that stops me.

[Prism]

22. I have very few gay friends

I'm a low-key homebody, so I think floating around in the gay world was doomed from the start. I used to have a rather large social circle in my early 20s that consisted largely of gay men and women, but over time the instability started to gnaw at me. This one dating that one who cheated on the other one who crushed on this one. The lines between friends, sex buddies, boyfriends, and dates became so blurred in that circle that massive amounts of effort were required to keep all of the drama at bay. There was nothing more satisfying than coming home after a long day at work only to have my phone go off for the nightly round of social turbulence.

Don't get me wrong, straight people certainly have their share of drama, but I find my straight friends (rather politely) do not include me in it. A straight guy friend just isn't hunting me down to complain about his girlfriend for three hours and keep me updated every millisecond of the day about their relationship drama, or why doesn't he have a girlfriend, and oh my god I'm so ugly and nobody likes me.

In other words, for me having a lot of gay friends is work, lol.

Now, most of my LGBT social interaction is online or at a place I volunteer. I have two gay friends I socialize with regularly, but I keep it fairly solitary, well away from the group dynamic. I've tried dipping my toes into the LGBT waters here and there, but within weeks the same drama always rears. "Well, me and my husbear are in an open relationship, and here, let me just put my hand down your pants. We can blame it on the beer and your boyfriend doesn't have to know." Oh fuck me running, no thank you.

I'd like to say this is just a few solitary individuals, but it happens every. single. time. I try to socialize in a gay setting. So, I quit doing that. Things are much calmer for it.

[closeupready]

24. That's interesting. Well, for me, it's kind of the opposite.

I have a few close gay friends, and I'm very devoted to them. I try to be fun and helpful, to the extent I can. When they need a shoulder to cry on, I try to be there. When they just feel like going out for a bite to eat or a movie, I try to put on my happy face and have fun.

With straight people, on the other hand, it seems a straight man can NEVER be involved with a gay man without his woman/girlfriend/wife/whatever ALSO being involved. It's kind of like, he's asking for implicit permission from her to be friends with me. And she can veto the relationship. So you can't just be friends with a straight man; you have to be friends with him and his female sex partner.

Or at least, that's my own experience. I mean, what kind of a friendship is that?? I don't get it. If you can't make your own decisions about who you socialize with, then you're already married, and I'm just simply not interested in being involved in a three-way relationship with me as the toadie.

I also should mention that the straight friends I had way back when, back home, turned on me when I came out to them. So, I suppose that colors my view about straight people.

[MNBrewer]

23. I have straight friends that I "hang with" but they're women, by in large.

Males that I hang out with are almost all gay. Most straight men I hang with I know through the homebrew club, of which I am one of two gay male members. (I did used to be the only gay in the village, so to speak).

[closeupready]

25. I have a straight female friend.

I can talk with her about literally anything, and she's a real friend - she asks me about my life and what's going on, and she seems genuinely interested and empathic, and vice versa.

But she's an exception, IME.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

34. My friends are mostly South ASian and Queer. I have some straight friends from childhood

and that's pretty much it.

I prefer the company of lgbt folk because straight privilege and people who can't seem to recognize this privilege, annoy me

[closeupready]

37. Me, too. For example,

With my gay friends, I think just about every single conversation contains discussion about dating/boyfriends/sex.

How does one carry on that conversation with a straight man? Is a straight man even interested in hearing about that? And what kind of advice are they going to offer - 'try meeting potential dates at church'?

[closeupready]

47. The thread linked below illustrates

the ugly mentality that discourages me from mixing with straight people.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002525598

Somehow, as a gay man, it's my burden to break down the ice and make him like me. Because he's 'done so much and tired of it; it's your turn now' (words to that effect).

So much more I could say, but this opening post really pisses me off.

[William769]

48. Please don't get me started today, I'm seeing red in another thread.

To the point I may get post some posts hidden.

It's a good damn thing we are on a message board where I can't truly speak my mind.

I do feel where you are coming from.

Bill

[closeupready]

49. Hugs to you.

You know I support you and your feelings, as well.