‘As long as you choose to be on that side, I’m going to continue to hate you’

[shira]

“Bringing down Israel will really benefit everyone in the world and everyone in society, particularly workers.”

These words were spoken by Lara Kiswani, executive director of the Arab Resource and Organizing Center, at a Nov. 12 panel discussion at U.C. Berkeley organized by the BDS Caucus of UAW 2865, the union for 13,000 University of California graduate student workers. Those grad student-teachers and other workers will be voting on a union resolution to boycott Israel on Dec. 4.

Throughout her talk, Kiswani made crystal clear that the goal of the boycott, divestment and sanctions movement against Israel is not to legitimately criticize Israeli policy, but rather to bring an end to the Jewish state, and she claimed that UAW 2865 members will be playing an important role in achieving that goal should they approve the BDS resolution in their vote next week...

http://www.jweekly.com/article/full/73278/as-long-as-you-choose-to-be-on-that-side-im-going-to-continue-to-hate-you/

[shira]

1. The true face of BDS: Pure hatred. More from OP....

One Jewish graduate student who attended the recent UAW 2865 BDS Caucus event had this to say during the Q&A period:

“I’m the voice of dissent in this room … I am a rank-and-file member of the union. I’m Latina. I’m Jewish, and I’m pro-Israel, and I’m really disturbed because I want to dialogue with people on the other side, and I really just feel a strong sense of hatred coming from the voices and the language. … I’m just worried that we’re creating a microcosm on this, our very own campus, with the kind of hatred that exists in Palestine and in Israel. … I also have to say, it is very, very hard to listen to this and not think this has something to do with Jewish identity… I feel extremely threatened as a Jew by what you guys are saying … the way that you are talking is so aggressive and so … anti-Semitic.”

The graduate student’s heartfelt remarks were met with the following hate-filled response from Kiswani:

“See, part of the problem with the Palestine question particularly on campus is it always gets framed as this two-sided thing and liberal democracy loves to make it seem like everyone has a right to speak, including the oppressor alongside the oppressed. … I don’t think that this form of liberal democracy really has a place in terms of real struggle. … Maybe liberal Zionists here on this campus have a hard time understanding what that means. … As long as you choose to be on that side, I’m going to continue to hate you.”

After Kiswani’s remarks, the Jewish graduate student left the room in tears.

[peacebird]

2. Maybe the Jewish grad student should dry her tears and try examining the actions of Israel

And figure out WHY so many people now begin to wonder whether Israel should continue to exist?
It seems it was perhaps foolish to give a country to a single group just because they were persecuted by Hitler.
Perhaps we can carve out a country somewhere to give to the American Indians who were persecuted by those colonizing America? Many groups have been slaughtered/persecuted over time. The fact that Israel has declared itself legally a Jewish country cannot sit well with its non-Jewish citizens.

[oberliner]

3. "many people now begin to wonder whether Israel should continue to exist..."

Well there you have it.

[COLGATE4]

4. Yep. nt

[Mosby]

5. eliminationist rhetoric from the left

Get used to it, it's only going to get worse.

[shira]

10. You're right, it's only going to get worse....

The best thing that can be said is that they're more open about their intentions WRT Israel and the Jews.

The mask is coming off. More people are on to what they're all about and they're only going to become more obnoxious and open about their intent as they become more unhinged.

[peacebird]

18. I said Israel, nothing about Jews. They are in many countries. The country OF Israel, was poorly

placed, in location where folks already lived and did not want them. Why didn't the grand architects of this experiment carve out a county in England? Or a state in the US? The country OF Israel behaves very very badly, keeping people in Gaza essentially in 'prison'. Continuing to build settlements. Essentially causing the very behaviour from Palestinians that they then use to justify the disproportional responses that allow them to crush large swaths of Gaza and then tell the rest of the world to pay to rebuild. I believe the leaders of Israel hope to make life so unbearable that people will leave Gaza. And yes, the slow motion slaughter is totally reprehensible. So I do question whether the nation state of Israel should still recieve the largess of American foreign aid, and whether the nation state of Israel should exist. Not whether Jews should exist, they can and do live freely in many places around the world.

[shira]

23. Israel wasn't just picked for the Jews. It's their ancestral homeland....

They're indigenous to the land, going back thousands of years. Same shared language, culture, traditions, history, religion, & DNA with people who lived there before the common era. That's why no other country was chosen for the Jews.

The Palestinians could have had their own state alongside Israel long ago. They've been offered their own land, free of occupation and settlements. They've rejected every offer. It's obvious Palestinian leaders want Israel destroyed more than they want their own state.

Look at it from the leaders' perspective. They have autonomy within their own totalitarian Palestinian enclaves. They're rich and corrupt, raking in the most USD per capita than any other nation on earth. What do they have to gain from living side-by-side with Israel in their own failed state? For examples, see all other mideast states surrounding Israel. Having their own failed state after a peace deal with Israel ensures they lose all the money & aid keeping their territories afloat now. Why risk that? Besides, living side-by-side with Israel is the last thing they want as they want the Jewish state destroyed.

[nichomachus]

29. Eliminationist rhetoric

Like the rhetoric that eliminated Palestine in the '40s to create Israel. Why don't you condemn that elimination?

[Mosby]

30. There was no Palestine

In fact most Arabs living in the future Israel at the time thought of themselves as Syrians.

Regardless though the Arabs were offered a state as part of the partition plan (UN res 181) and they turned it down and started a war of genocide against the Jewish Zionists.

[King_David]

7. Yes it's a pretty revealing post. nt

[leftynyc]

35. Surely you can't be surprised

Only a complete imbecile would argue this wasn't the goal of BDS.

[King_David]

6. This is not a 2014 phenomenon

This has been going on way before 1948 where the world has never seen a need for a Jewish state ever and a large amount of people see no need for Jews either but it's not new.

[shenmue]

8. Spot on

but others won't admit it.

[peacebird]

11. Jews, Catholics, Mulsims, etc, great. A country specifically for one religious or wthnic group, no.

Especially since the people who live in Israel ARE already diverse. For Israel to declare itself legally a Jewish state, that is problematic.
What about the rights of the non-Jewish citizens? What about Israelis continued settlement building?
The massive over reaction of the Israeli govt in the past several years has turned me from a supporter to one who no longer believes Israel should get massive support dollars from America, and yes, I question whether a huge mistake was made giving land to the Jewish people in order to form a country - and whether those who "gave" the land actually had the right to do so.

[grossproffit]

9. It's posts like this that have me rarely visiting this forum.

I'm not a professional poster like the many here who thrive on posting diatribe 24/7 against Israel but this post really sets me off.

Your choosing "peacebird" as your moniker is the icing on the cake of hypocrisy. Peace for everyone other than Israel.

Israel isn't going anywhere and neither are the Jewish people.

[peacebird]

12. Jewish people live in many countries.

I have no problem with Jewish, Muslim, Christian, or atheist people. I have a serious problem with the Actions of the government of Israel. Jewish people can live anywhere. Should they have the right to continue settlements? No. But do they continue? Yes. And they will do so with impunity. And then if they will likely claim they can't possibly throw these good Jewish citizens out of their homes or off their land.
Enough.

[King_David]

13. Are you sure you mean to post this on DU?

You said :

"many people now begin to wonder whether Israel should continue to exist"

Disgusting!

The Democratic Party of the USA would not welcome you with that view .

[peacebird]

14. Yes. I am. What I find disgusting is Israel continuing to build settlements, and Israel treatment

Of those living in Gaza. Israel slaughtering people on a boat trying to bring humanitarian aid to Gaza.

[King_David]

15. That's not what you wrote though or posted here

What you wrote is :

"many people now begin to wonder whether Israel should continue to exist..."

Think that belongs on DU ?

[peacebird]

16. That is a snippet from what I wrote. Israel does not 'need' to exist for the Jewish people to exist.

Jewish people live in many places. I think Israels actions are at best reprehensible, and I question whether forming Israel out of guilt/horror over the actions of Hitlers regime may well have been a mistake. So yes, I question whether Israel should stilll be the recipient of US largess in foreign aid, and yes, I question whether it should continue to exist. Not whether the citizens OF Israel should continue to exist, only whether the nation state of Israel should.

[King_David]

17. " I question whether it should continue to exist"

Are you sure your comfortable posting here on DU a site supporting the democratic party ?

[peacebird]

19. Completely.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/.premium-1.629876

Obama also thinks Israels behaviour re: settlements is obnoxious.

Israels leader has dissed Obama freely. Last I checked Obama was a Democrat, tho nowhere near as progressive as I would have liked. I realize Israel is not going away, but I still think that creating it was a classic case of good intentions gone wrong.

[King_David]

20. You were not talking about settlements

What you said:

I question whether it should continue to exist

Obama would without a doubt kick anyone off his staff who said such a thing about the Jewish State.....pronto.

There's nothing at all progressive about that , I read that in the most extreme right wing sites all the time.

[peacebird]

24. Read the freaking post king david. I am sick of you trying to misinterpret what I said to fit your

agenda.
I am no longer going to repeat what I said, you clearly have an agenda that believes any criticism of Israel is antisemitism. Off to the freaking ignore with you. You are incapable of discussion on this.

[King_David]

31. No misinterpret since I posted your words verbatim

If you don't like me quoting your post then best put me on ignore, makes no difference to me....be
my guest

Who said anything about "antisemitism" ?

Best own what you say and this is what you said :

And I Quote you peacebird :

"many people now begin to wonder whether Israel should continue to exist..."

[shira]

22. Carry that line of thought out to its logical conclusion...

If the state of Israel no longer exists, what happens to the Jews there under Palestinian or Islamist control?

Do you have any idea how religious minorities (christians, jews, bahai) are treated throughout the mideast? How about women & gays? Your suggestion would lead to mass ethnic cleansing or genocide.

The Jews won't give their country away for a promise that the rest of the world will treat them nicely. 2000 years of being treated like shit in other countries was enough.

[peacebird]

25. Then maybe they shouldn't treat OTHER people like shit, ya think? Maybe that would have helped.

I believed in Israel until they started responding in such disproportionate ways.

[leftynyc]

36. Forget the settlements

You made an odious comment and are being asked if that's how you really feel. You're talking about the entire country of Israel, not the settlements. So show some courage of your convictions and either stand behind it or back off.

[hack89]

21. How would you bring about the end of the state of Israel?

is it even possible barring genocidal war?

[peacebird]

27. As I stated in another post, I don't expect an end to Israel as a country, but perhaps we should

stop giving them a ton of financial aid. It's not like their leader is a good partner with our president either.

[King_David]

32. You never said " get rid of Israel's leader or government "

What you said is:

"many people now begin to wonder whether Israel should continue to exist..."

[cali]

33. ugh. I'm hardly known as being in the pro-Israel camp, but your post is disturbing

well, it's kinda beyond that.

[Harry_Scrote]

26. Oh?

Oh.

[GitRDun]

28. Highlights the essence of the problem

Two sides, doing everything they can to destroy each other. Sometimes overtly, other times cloaked in alleged good deeds.

A pox on both their houses.

[leftynyc]

34. Precisely why the BDS movment

will go nowhere in the US.