Israel/Palestine
Related: About this forumUN Rights Expert’s Boycott Call Angers U.S. And Israel
By Agence France-Presse
Thursday, October 25, 2012 17:47 EDT
UNITED NATIONS The United States and Israel on Thursday slammed a call by an outspoken UN rights expert for a boycott of companies helping Israels settlement expansion in the Palestinian territories.
US Ambassador to the United Nations Susan Rice said the boycott appeal by Richard Falk would poison the environment for peace. An Israeli spokeswoman criticized the distasteful sideshow.
Falk, the UN special rapporteur on human rights in the occupied Palestinian territories, said the UN General Assembly and civil society should boycott international firms that help expand Israeli settlements.
He singled out Caterpillar, Hewlett Packard and Motorola of the United States, Veolia Environment of France, G4S of Britain, Dexia of Belgium, Volvo Group and Assa Abloy of Sweden, Ahava, Elbit Systems and Mehadrin of Israel, Riwal Holding Group of the Netherlands and Cemex of Mexico.
MORE...
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2012/10/25/un-rights-experts-boycott-call-angers-u-s-and-israel/
oberliner
(58,724 posts)The United Nations Human Rights Councils special rapporteur on Palestinian rights is being criticized for re-posting an anti-Semitic cartoon on his personal blog.
The cartoon, posted by Richard Falk, depicts a dog wearing a shirt labeled USA and a yarmulke marked with a Star of David devouring a bloody human carcass. Lady Justice stands by blindfolded, holding the dogs leash as it urinates on her foot.
http://forward.com/articles/139561/un-palestinian-rights-official-posts-anti-semitic/#ixzz2ALwnjwC9
Wow, same guy.
LeftishBrit
(41,208 posts)He has accused Israel of 'genocide' and 'planning a Holocaust' of the Palestinians, and has endorsed a book by Gilad Atzmon.
That being said, a boycott of the settlements and of companies involved in building them would make much more sense than a general boycott of Israel. However, Falk cannot be for one minute trusted as a level-headed or reliable organizer of such a movement.
holdencaufield
(2,927 posts)... to find a job anywhere in the world ... can always find a home at the UN.
As long as they hate Israeli.
Purveyor
(29,876 posts)holdencaufield
(2,927 posts)... I don't hate Israel enough. It's a job requirement.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Firstly, there's no job requirement that anyone hate Israel. Secondly, rational people understand that criticising Israel does not mean hatred of Israel.
What is a job requirement for working at the UN is qualifications up to the eyeballs in international relations and being able to speak a zillion languages fluently...
I'm curious. Do you agree with the Israeli, US and Canadian govts that there shouldn't be boycotts of the Israeli setlements in the West Bank?
shira
(30,109 posts)We all know it. There's no point denying it and pretending it's only about leftwing concern for Palestinians.
Falk should have been booted from the UN years ago. That he's still there goes to show how disgusting that bigoted body is.
Not that anything less should be expected. The UN commissioned Falk because they hate Israel and its Jews every bit as much as he does, and that's why they support terror (Hamas, Hezbollah attacks) they label as "resistance" or armed "militant" attacks by all available means.
2. Reaffirms the legitimacy of the struggle of peoples for independence, territorial integrity, national unity and liberation from colonial and foreign domination and foreign occupation by all available means, particularly armed struggle;
UNGAR A/RES/3246 (XXIX), Nov 1974.
3. Reaffirms the legitimacy of the peoples struggle for liberation form colonial and foreign domination and alien subjugation by all available means, including armed struggle;
7. Strongly condemns all Governments which do not recognize the right to self-determination and independence of peoples under colonial and foreign domination and alien subjugation, notably the peoples of Africa and the Palestinian people; (4)
See also UNGA Resolution A/RES/34/44 (23 November 1979), UNGA Resolution A/RES/35/35 (14 November 1980), UNGA Resolution A/RES/36/9 (28 October 1981) and many others like it.
Now with all those UN resolutions in mind, it's easier to understand this:
Richard Falk and these "leftists" support Hamas' right to resist, via armed struggle, and by all available means. IOW, they support Hamas 'militants' they view as freedom fighters.
So back to the OP:
Falk and his fellow neo-nazi, Jew hating pigs can take their bigoted boycotts against the Jews and shove them.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Read the OP. It'll help clear up yr confusion. I'm not interested in yr incessant attempts to distract attention away from criticism of Israel...
Oh, and I wish you'd stop taking it upon yrself to speak on behalf of us all. You don't, and you've been told so many times I really have to wonder why you still do it. If you insist on replying to my posts, at least have the courtesy to respond to what I say, and don't just tack random stuff there that has nothing at all to do with what I said...
shira
(30,109 posts)As is evident in the last post, it goes FAR beyond legitimate criticism of Israel.
It's as ugly as it gets.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Scroll up. Right to the top. Read the article. It's about a call to boycott the settlements. It's not rocket science...
I'm curious. Do you oppose calls to boycott the settlements?
shira
(30,109 posts)I oppose boycotting the settlements.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)I'd be interested in hearing yr reasons for believing it's wrong to boycott the settlements...
shira
(30,109 posts)Personally, I believe the BDS movement is composed of terror supporting Jew hating bigots who want Israel destroyed.
I'm against helping them in any way.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)I've got little to no respect for anyone who opposes boycotting the settlements. In refusing to boycott them, they're adding their support to the settlement movement, who are terror supporting Arab hating bigots who want Palestine destroyed...
Most people are capable of making a decision on whether to boycott something or not based on their feelings of right or wrong when it comes to the issue, not irrational hatred of some movement...
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)so in other words you support settlement products?
shira
(30,109 posts)I'm not sure Israel can do any better than their offers in 2001 and 2008.
What's ironic is those most against the settlements happen to also be against both peace deals in 2001 and 2008 that would have ended both the occupation and settlements.
Turns out they're the ones supporting occupation and settlements.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)you have been shown over and over why that was an empty deal do you need reminding-again? I'll be more than happy to repost the links for you
shira
(30,109 posts)...thought very highly of Olmert's offer?
Gee, maybe?
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)did he refuse it as you have claimed or are you changing up now?
but here is a link to where I lay out explicitly why Olmerts plan was empty, including Netanyahu saying he would not honor any peace plan of Olmerts and that part of the plan was that it could not be initiated while Hamas was in power in Gaza
http://upload.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1134&pid=6380
shira
(30,109 posts)RAMALLAH, WEST BANK In comments that may stir Israels election campaign, Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas said on Sunday that he and Ehud Olmert were two months away from a peace deal before Olmert had to resign as Israeli prime minister.
With Olmert lately cleared of several graft charges and considering a challenge to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu at the Jan. 22 parliamentary election, supporters have highlighted Olmerts efforts to make peace with Abbas in negotiations which later foundered under Netanyahus right-wing coalition.
Speaking to Israeli politicians in the West Bank, Abbas said: I worked hard with Olmert. Unfortunately, he suddenly retired. We discussed the borders, the exchange of territories and traded maps. We were close and reached many understandings.
Asked how close the pair were to a deal in 2008, Abbas replied in English: Im sure if he continued, two months.
Read more: http://forward.com/articles/164262/abbas-olmert-was-close-to-peace-deal/#ixzz2AhXMtn4S
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)when if one follows the thread I posted you were claiming Abbas had turned down the deal and had been on numerous occasions prior to that, when in fact he did not?
shira
(30,109 posts)Obviously, that was not the case.
But nice try running interference for Abbas' rejectionism.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)ah it seems you were the one claiming it was not do you honestly think because a couple days have past .......??????
shira
(30,109 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)but a valiant effort on your part none the less kudo's
Shaktimaan
(5,397 posts)It's a call to boycott any companies that sell products to the settlers. So it is boycotting those who refuse to boycott the settlements... a very different thing. One is a boycott directed at a group for specific actions they take. This is a boycott against companies for not holding/supporting your same political views wrt I/P.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Susan Rice must have spotted something I've missed if she's seeing an 'environment for peace' lying round. There's no environment for peace, and those who claim there is right now are usually just fans of the inertia that results in Israeli settlements going on without any disruption...
Response to Violet_Crumble (Reply #4)
Purveyor This message was self-deleted by its author.
shira
(30,109 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)shira
(30,109 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)in the past, but please share with us where J-Street is specifically against a boycott of Israeli settlements because what I've found is that they reject BDS against all of Israel and this article is not about that at all but it seems you do not separate the 2 Israel and the settlements
shira
(30,109 posts)She asked, I provided.
Now if you'd kindly read the link in #29 you would find J-Street opposes specific boycotting of the settlements.
J-Street opposes boycotts just like the USA does under Obama.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)U.S. law (found in the Export Administration Act -- EAA; the official reference is: 48 C.F.R. 652.225-71) "prohibits compliance by U.S. persons with any boycott fostered by a foreign country against a country which is friendly to the United States and which is not itself the object of any form of boycott pursuant to United States law or regulation," and imposes criminal penalties on those who do comply with such boycotts.
U.S. law (found in the Tax Reform Act -- TRA), penalizes those who participate in such boycotts (as defined under the EAA) by denying them certain tax benefits.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lara-friedman/israel-boycott-law_b_898317.html
but here is what they said they feel that restricting the boycott to settlements is positive
We note positively that some groups promoting BDS tactics are trying to narrow the scope of boycotts or divestment initiatives to oppose simply the occupation and not Israel itself. The Palestinian Authority, for instance, does not call for a boycott of Israel itself or Israeli goods, but of settlement products, unlike the all-encompassing boycott of Israel promoted by the global BDS Movement. J Street, however, will not participate in targeted boycott or divestment initiatives. We are focused on creating the political will and atmosphere necessary in the United States to promote strong American leadership to achieve a two-state resolution to the conflict.
http://jstreet.org/blog/post/the-boycott-divestment-and-sanctions-bds-movement_1
Response to azurnoir (Reply #41)
azurnoir This message was self-deleted by its author.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)shira
(30,109 posts)Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Like I said, I'm at a loss as to how anyone who claims to be LW can oppose boycotting the settlements.
If I ever come across anything that's made in the settlements, I'll refuse to buy it. There's no way I'd do anything to show support of the settlers...
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)but it seems some don't understand the difference between Israel and the settlements
shira
(30,109 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)they also called the narrowing of the scope of BDS a positive development
see post # 50 above
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)In true Conservative form, they're enraged that anyone dare suggesting doing anything that might show less than 110% support of everything and anything Israel does, including the settlements in the West Bank...
UN Palestinian rights envoy unapologetic in face of Canadian calls for his resignation
OTTAWA - A diplomatic spat has broken out between the Conservative government and a controversial UN special rapporteur after the latter endorsed a boycott of companies that are profiting from Israeli settlements built on occupied Palestinian land.
In strongly worded comments, Foreign Affairs Minister John Baird and Immigration Minister Jason Kenney this week accused rapporteur Richard Falk of bias and alleged he is undermining efforts to achieve peace in the Middle East.
Falk has dismissed the government's "irrational" response as little more than an effort to attack the messenger rather than dealing with what he says are Israel's efforts to take land that rightfully belongs to the Palestinians.
"I would hope that there would be a less irrational response that focused on me, rather than on the issues," Falk said in an interview from New York City.
Read more: http://www.canada.com/Palestinian+rights+envoy+unapologetic+face+Canadian+calls+resignation/7454944/story.html#ixzz2AY5fpFYR
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)keep the attention focused on various personalities rather than the actual issue at hand
King_David
(14,851 posts)Do you consider Barack Obama to be in
" true conservative form " too?
News update , the Democrats in the USA support The Jewish State 110% too
What a ridiculous statement .
shira
(30,109 posts)They cannot stand him.
Check out CounterPunch, EI, and Mondoweiss by googling them along with Obama. They prefer Bush over Obama.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Even if all that bunch didn't like Obama (which I highly doubt), isn't it incredibly hypocritical of you to think that's an issue, seeing a lot of the folk you admire and agree with can't stand him either? In fact, I recall you saying many times at DU2 when people picked you up on yr habit of using RW sources that we were deflecting and we attacking the messenger and apparently we were supposed to overlook their political leanings...
On edit: Here's just one example of where you chided people at DU2, this one was when you peddled Derschowitz...
Shira: 'Focus on the quote, not the author, and allow that to sink in for at least a few moments. Imagine the outright nerve you need to muster in order to be dismissive of the message.'
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=124&topic_id=309113&mesg_id=309342
shira
(30,109 posts)Are you just as upset at rightwing democrats like Obama as you are WRT Canada?
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Their stance on Israel is NOT the same as Obama's. They're RW extremists who unlike Obama support Israel 110% no matter what it does and totally support the settlements.
I'm at a total loss as to why you expect me to be just as upset with Obama as I am with a bunch of hatefilled RW extremists. In case you missed it, this is DU where we're all supposed to be LWers, and we're opposed to RWers like the Canadian government...
shira
(30,109 posts)Seems your problem is not only with Canada but also with the Obama administration as well.
I'm at a loss as to why any LW'er wouldn't have a problem with someone as loathsome as Falk.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Now that you admitted you oppose boycotting the settlements, it makes sense that yr exerting so much energy trying to attack Falk rather than focus on the calls to boycott the settlements...
And to be honest, it gets tiresome the way you continually respond to attacks in this forum on RWers by making out that DUers should attack Obama the same way...
shira
(30,109 posts)And of course you're not concerned about Falk.
Not surprising.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)I'm figuring for some reason yr sensitive about criticism of the Canadian govt, but I have no idea why. It's incredibly sensitive to think that adding an article to a thread about calls to boycott the settlements being criticised by the US and Israel is 'singling out Canada'. I don't really know or care who's leading what, and have been consistent in strongly supporting boycotting the settlements. I doubt you read the OP, but the excuses the US gives for opposing any boycotts of settlements is absolutely ridiculous. They pretend there's some peace process that might be damaged, but there's nothing
shira
(30,109 posts)...off the USA as well for being just as bad as any right wing extremists.
Turns out Egypt and Iran thought Falk's assessment was fair and balanced.
------
Just curious, but do you usually side with Egypt and Iran vs. Canada, the USA, Obama, and almost all Democrats?
Also, do you think the USA's criticism of Falk is ridiculous?
You support Falk?
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)I did nothing of the sort, so knock it off. The way you try to put words in peoples mouths is irksome and imo a dirty debate tactic...
That 'question' is revolting and offensive. What on earth would possess you to say something like that here at DU?? People who support Iran and who don't support the Democrats aren't welcome at DU and are shown the door. I support the Democrats and don't support Iran, and anyone who's honest and has read my posts knows that already. If you did make an honest mistake, I'd ask you to delete that post, because it is very ugly, and if you did that intentionally knowing full well that I don't support Iran, then there's no appealing to yr better judgement...
Also, not sure what you think yr achieving by going on and on and on and on about Mr Falk. Do you think that going on like that will make someone go 'oh! I see now! Boycotting the settlements is inherently evil!'? Because it's just not working with me. I'm going to continue to boycott any goods that come from the settlements...
shira
(30,109 posts)Is there a reason you feel you cannot criticize him?
After all, that's what Obama's officials are doing:
Mr. Falks recommendations do nothing to further a peaceful settlement to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and indeed poison the environment for peace, she said in a statement. His continued service in the role of a UN Special Rapporteur is deeply regrettable and only damages the credibility of the UN.
Seems you don't have a problem with Falk.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)That's what most people would do when caught out trying to tell a complete untruth about another person the way you did. Instead of doing the decent thing and apologising for making up that crap and claiming I support Iran, you ignore it and pretend noone objected to that completely dishonest claim.
So, stop making up complete and utter bullshit about other DUers like myself. It's ugly, unbecoming, and puts anything you have to say at all into doubt, as if you'd make up something like that about me, everything else is tainted as well...
Do you understand?
King_David
(14,851 posts)Do NOT support the Falk bigot and nor his message .
That much is clear and there is nothing ugly about that .
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)That was an ugly and dishonest thing to say. Or do you agree with Shira when she claims I don't support the Democrats and do support Iran?
shira
(30,109 posts)And WRT the I/P situation, settlements, and boycotts your views appear closer to those of Egypt and Iran than Obama and the Democrats. I could be wrong and that's okay.
It's why I asked.
I apologize regardless.
So what do you think of Obama's representatives ripping into Richard Falk?
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)It was the 'do you usually side with' bit that made the question offensive, and I do appreciate that you apologized. My views are mine and mine alone, and I don't care who does or doesn't agree with them. It certainly doesn't mean I side with everyone who might hold one view that I happen to hold. An example of what I'm talking about is where both Iran and Israel voted for Australia to have a spot on the SEcurity Council. Doing that doesn't mean they side with each other or support each other. It means that on that issue they both held the same opinion, and they came to thei decisions for their own and probably very different reasons.
I don't really care about who ripped into Falk. I'd be interested if it was criticism of calls to boycott the settlements, though.
King_David
(14,851 posts)'The Obama administration slammed UN special rapporteur Richard Falk's call for a boycott of private companies that are profiting from the Israeli settlement enterprise.'
http://www.jpost.com/Headlines/Article.aspx?id=289448
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)nothing more nothing less
King_David
(14,851 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)King_David
(14,851 posts)If you say so.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Do you oppose boycotting the settlements?
Oh, and seeing you seem to have no problem understanding that I support Democrats and don't support Iran, maybe you could try explaining that to Shira, who seems intent on claiming the opposite?
King_David
(14,851 posts)"yr fixation with Mr Falk"
This OP is ALL about Falk.The bigoted one the Obama administration has criticized and rebuked harshly.
(Take a look at the 1st post )
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Take a look at the OP. Read it. Then look at the incessant attempts by someone else in the thread to make it all about Mr Falk, rather than about the issue of the settlements themselves. That behaviour is definitely fixating...
King_David
(14,851 posts)Yes the Governing party ,including the openly Gay Foreign Minister is a bunch of right wing loons (nothing compared to Republicans though), but policy with respect to Israel is almost the same for all 3 parties :
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NDP (official opposition and LEFT wing party ) Leader Thomas Mulcair I am an ardent supporter of Israel in all situations and in all circumstances. [
je suis un ardent supporter de toutes les instances et de toutes les circonstances dIsraël.]*
~Thomas Mulcair, quoted in Canadian Jewish News, May 1st, 2008
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Liberal Party Leader Bob RAE : OTTAWA Liberal leader Bob Rae made the following statement today on Israel Independence Day:
Today, we celebrate the founding of the State of Israel.
We also celebrate the contributions of the Jewish community to Canadian society, as well as the strong and deep ties between Canada and the people of Israel.
As I reaffirmed to Prime Minister Netanyahu in our February meeting, the Liberal Party continues to be steadfastly committed to Israels right to exist and flourish within secure and recognised borders, and remains in solidarity with the people of Israel as they face continuing threats to their peace and security. I look forward to being able to share these same thoughts with President Shimon Peres on his official visit to Canada the first week of May.
On behalf of the Liberal Party of Canada and our parliamentary caucus, I extend my best wishes to all those celebrating the 64th anniversary of the founding of the State of Israel. Yom Haatzmaut sameach!
http://www.cija.ca/israel-advocacy/statement-from-liberal-leader-bob-rae-on-israel-independence-day/
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Just curious, but what has the foreign minister being gay got to do with anything? It's kind of creepy how you brought that up out of the blue like that. He's a RW extremist, Muslim hating piece of shit. That's all that matters about him...
King_David
(14,851 posts)country Canada is,in that Baird is in the most right wing party in that great land.
we could only wish the USA or Australia were that liberal or progressive .
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Whether he's gay or not is totally irrelevant to that, though I can imagine that people who have problems seeing criticism of the current extreme RW Canadian govt might try throwing in little bits of this and that to try to garner any praise at all for them
King_David
(14,851 posts)I can only wish .
But that's for another thread and another forum .
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)And one with a woman as Prime Minister. But yeah, save it for another time to tell me how much more progressive Canada is under its current bunch of RW lunatics than Australia with a Leftwing Labor government and the Greens holding the balance of power in the Senate. It should be amusing!
King_David
(14,851 posts)At the whim of the left or right leanings of the flavor of the government of the day.
Gay rights , Gay marriage, Gay adoption rules all remain intact weather it's a left or right government in power.
Australia ? Not so much .
( and that makes me sad for my land )
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)It doesn't matter what they claim to think on LGBT issues, nor where you get the strange idea that LGBT issues are the only ones that matter. There's a whole lot of issues that are important, not just that one.
The Canadian govt is a bunch of fucking bigoted conservative critters. I'm not sure why yr objecting to people daring to criticise them here at DU. The Australian govt is LW, as are the Greens in the Senate. It's clear you have little to no knowledge of Australia, and I'd suggest if you genuinelly wanted to learn about my country, you visit the Australia forum and learn something. Australia's a whole lot more than someone who took a two week holiday and visited Bondi Beach would believe it is, just as an example
I'm not sure if I'm supposed to feel sad that you feel sad for Canada. I feel sad for Canada whenever I listen to Nickelback, so I guess I can sorta feel yr pain....
King_David
(14,851 posts)But I was talking about the law of the land not the government .
But you right I do love Bondi Beach ... One of my favorite restaurants , Mi Vami , is there with excellent Israeli Jewish cuisine and there's also a spa there selling Ahava bath products that my skin loves so much.
The actual beach is pretty cool too .. Fun fun fun...
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)You throw random things in that have nothing to do with what's being discussed. For examp,e you say yr going on about the law of the land when what you were responding to was me pointing out that the current conservative bigoted Canadian govt were doing their usual blind and unthinking support of Israel's settlements.
Yeah, tourists do have a thing for bondi beach, I've noticed. Some think after spending a week or two in Sydney they become experts on Australia.
Btw, do you oppose boycotting the settlements? I asked you in another post but you must have missed it
King_David
(14,851 posts)I will try read it again later when I get some time and respond then.
( if necessary )
I do appreciate the reply though , thank you .
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)It doesn't take more than the most basic comprehension skills to understand it.
If you really are struggling to understand simple sentences, I'd suggest you get someone with time and patience to sit and explain it to you. Or you could explain to me what's confusing you and I'll attempt to write it in an even more basic way
King_David
(14,851 posts)Are THE most important litmus test of progressiveness , respect for human rights , credentialing , or whatever you want to call it, for any western civilized country in the last 2 decades . AS important as women's right were before it.
And that's fact .
Have you been to many other western civilized countries ? Because ill tell you that to my chagrin , when I speak with Australians daily they don't seem to get the above notion.
If a country does not provide equal LGBT rights including Gay Marriage and Adoption to its populace it is NOT progressive nor liberal .
The USA is moving in that direction ,so is Israel , Canada has moved.
Australia ? Not so much, and in my day to day interactions with "regular Australians" including those who consider themselves left wing ,they just don't seem to get that this is probably the most important step in Human rights presently ( anecdotally ).
Of course that is in Western Civilized countries . In other countries like Iran , Gaza, Saudi Arabia etc they need work on the very basic human rights including LGBT rights.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Yr own personal opinion doesn't make something fact. And trying to overlook right wing extremism or bigotry against other minority groups by using the excuse that they support gay rights is really stupid. Women's rights are still important, as are the rights of refugees and the rights of minority groups. For example if we were to get a RW govt that supported marriage equality, would you think that's all that matters even though that govt could be making abortion illegal, stripping rights from workers, discriminating against Muslims and inciting hatred of 'illegal immigrants'? That would be really stupid.
Edited to add - just in case anyone alerts on this post, I just want to point out that I'm a strong supporter of marriage equality, as is most other LW Aussies I know..I just don't believe in placing it above all other human rights issues as no reasonable person expects others to choose one human rights issue and turn a blind eye to others.
King_David
(14,851 posts)found anecdotally among ordinary Australians ( even those who consider themselves progressive or left wing)
There's a way to go here .
( and with that I will leave this LGBT diversion as the thread has veered off topic albeit in a very revealing fashion )
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)In fact, there's very few people who turn a blind eye to, or condone bigotry and the fight for rights for other minority groups because they only care about one group...
Next time you yet again try to create some off-topic LGBT diversion in this group, you might like to consider that. It beats doing the lame thing and implying that anyone who dares to attack RW extremists like the Canadian foreign minister is by extension homophobic. I'm sure there's some troll somewhere who'll jump on yr bandwagon, though
King_David
(14,851 posts)Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)azurnoir
(45,850 posts)I found this quote disturbing to say the least
AS important as women's right were before it..
so women's rights are no longer important? IMO both Gay and Women's rights are important and in my country that would be the US both are quite endangered at the moment
King_David
(14,851 posts)LGBT rights are yet to achieve what women have successfully achieved in the civilized world .
oberliner
(58,724 posts)The LGBT rights fight seems to get muddled for certain folks because of their stance on I/P.
If you see someone use the term "pinkwashing" you know what I mean.
King_David
(14,851 posts)On a left wing progressive site such as DU .
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)The recap so far is you try to defend a RW extremist Muslim-hating Canadian politican by mentioning he's gay. My reponse is so what? That's got nothing to do with him being a fucking bigoted RW piece of crap. You make some bizarre claim that LGBT rights are the sole litmus test and make an incredibly telling comment about how little respect you have for women's rights. I point out the bleeding obvious that the human rights of one group can't be placed above all others and give you examples. You say yr leaving (again) and huff a bit about *me* (wtf?) diverting the thread by talking about LGBT issues. Then you swiftly return when someone who clearly has difficulty comphrending the concept of human rights blunders in to agree with you...
But I know what you mean about seeing weird things on a left wing progressive site such as DU. Why, back at DU2, I remember the time someone insisted that saying that they hate Muslims isn't Islamophobic at all. Pretty disgusting that bigotry like that show it's face at DU...
King_David
(14,851 posts)But it has nothing to do with my reply to Oberliner .
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Last edited Wed Oct 31, 2012, 09:13 AM - Edit history (1)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=124&topic_id=358701&mesg_id=358866btw, my response had everything to do with yr reply to a reply that had nothing to do with what I originally said...
So, how are you going with getting round to answering the question you were asked about whether you opposed a boycott of the settlements? Let me know if yr still having trouble understanding the question. I'm sure there's other DUers who'll be happy to help out and break it down a bit more for you
King_David
(14,851 posts)...who the Homophobic turds are , or what culture or religion they arise from...
if they are Queer hating homophobes ...
FUCK THEM...
And I am proud to say that...
Got a problem with that ?????????????????????
( and Oberliner is right , I am one queer that has always refused to be bullied )
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)And you defended his hatred by saying it wasn't Isalmophobic. He was talking about Muslims, who aren't 'homophobic turds'. It's extremely bigoted For someone to say they hate Muslims, Jews, women, gays or any other minority group. Sorry, but there's no justification for someone saying they hate an entire minority group. It doesnt matter who they are.
It looks like you've changed yr mind now and no longer stand by what you said only two posts back.
You and oberliner can play yr game without me. If you think yr being bullied, alert and go and take it to Meta, but you aren't being bullied because people you don't agree with dare to disagree with you when you imply they're homophobes.
King_David
(14,851 posts)oberliner
(58,724 posts)That's one of their primary tactics. Helps them deal with the cognitive dissonance.
Stay strong!
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Y'now, like the one calling me a white supremacist and the one who told me I support Iran and don't support Democrats. That's just inane nonsense rather than bullying. I haven't seen any pile-ons in here for a while, so I'm not sure who 'they' are or why you appeared earlier on to be making some nasty implication that I was homophobic. If yr accusing me of bullying that poster, then you should back up the thread and take note that they were the one who replied to my post first, and they're the one who's been implying in more than one post that I'm a homophobe. You don't think that's bullying, yet can see bullying in something that's not?
on edit: have I done something wrong, Oberliner? It's just you've been popping up making some pretty nasty implications. I'd prefer to stay out of that sort of stuff and just discuss the I/P conflict. Are you in?
King_David
(14,851 posts)I applaud you turning over a new leaf.
Thanks ....
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)I'll make the same suggestion to you as I did to Obie. If yr not interested, then that's fine with me, but I thought I'd give you the chance...
Getting back to the topic, are you opposed to boycotting the settlements?
King_David
(14,851 posts)that of the vast majority of the Democratic party representatives as well as Susan Rice and the official party platform.
Look it up.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)I didn't ask you who or what you think you agree with because I'm not interested in anything but what you think.
I hope at some point in the future you do decide to participate in a civil and respectful way in this group, because running round throwing ugly and false accusations round and refusing to discuss the conflict when asked to is pretty disruptive behavior. I won't waste my time any more responding to you or yr buddy who came up with the fantasy that I'm somehow bullying you, and you can both continue yr pile-on without me.
Have fun
King_David
(14,851 posts)And the Democratic Party here on DU?
(Gives my head a shake )
oberliner
(58,724 posts)People are taking a POV that is diametrically opposed to that of President Obama and the Democratic Party and then accusing those on the other side of being disruptive.
That's the irony of all this.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)Don't let yourself be fooled. There is a pattern with the posts that is unmistakeable. No new leaves have been turned, believe me.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)We were getting on fine prior to me leaving the group for a few months, but since I returned a few days ago, you've made nasty and untrue accusations about me, been really unpleasant, and now have taken to attacking me by getting into a pile-on with another poster. If yr concerned about bullying, you might want to stop doing that stuff, because it's really making this forum suck.
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)Yr very difficult to understand. Maybe you could try rephrasing whatever it is you want to say?
King_David
(14,851 posts)No need for me to do any such thing.
(Quite the rude post btw , but that's fine )
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)I'm at a complete loss as to what statement I'm supposed to have made that was ridiculous. Seeing that yr unwilling to say what it was, I'll make the safe assumption there was nothing wrong with my scathing criticism of those wanker Conservatives in the Canadian government...
btw, there was nothing rude about my post. Yr post made no sense and I asked you to explain. You say that to people all the time. Why don't you consider it rude when you say it? Like in this case http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1134&pid=16451 Now, that WAS rude and snarky!
King_David
(14,851 posts)Taking my ball and leaving you to play by yourself.
I woke up in a good mood unlike some other grumpy people..
Violet_Crumble
(35,961 posts)I guess if I'd got caught doing that, I'd imply that the person who pointed it out was Mr/Mz crankypants, pretend I was in a chipper mood, and then tell everyone I'm taking my bat and ball and going home, and then reappear further up in the thread