Reconciliation Demands the Temple Mount Be Closed to Jews

[Israeli]

Prayer is not what's in the mind of extremist rabbis who encourage their flock to visit the Temple Mount.

Sefi Rachlevsky Oct 15, 2015

Safed’s state-appointed Rabbi Shmuel Eliyahu is a very influential rabbi. He almost became Chief Rabbi and his impact is greater than a chief rabbi’s, certainly in the political arena. Two weeks ago, prior to participating in a Temple ceremony held under the auspices of the Jerusalem municipality, he ruled that “it is feasible and necessary to erect an altar on the Temple Mount today” – in other words, to effectively inaugurate a new Temple.

“The government should tell Muslims occupying the site that they have been keeping it for us up to now and that they can now leave for Syria,” the rabbi said. “Now the people of Israel are here.”

The terror attacks aren’t just about concerns for the Al-Aqsa Mosque, but Palestinian concerns for their mosque aren’t groundless. Rabbis who send their disciples to the mountain – in contravention of common religious rulings – aren’t interested in prayer, certainly not while showing respect for Al-Aqsa. They are interested in building the Temple, while removing the Muslims and their mosques. They are convinced that the violent Muslim reaction to their provocations will unite Jews in a struggle against Muslims. The violent Muslim reaction to the provocation will show everyone how dangerous and vicious they are, thus advancing their removal.

There is planning and logic at work here, and the plan is working. Just as the massacre committed by Baruch Goldstein in the Cave of the Patriarchs in Hebron, the second-holiest Muslim site in Palestine, was designed to achieve the goals of bringing about the take-over of Hebron’s center by Jews, its “cleansing” of Arabs and the derailing of the Oslo peace accords. And, with the Muslim reaction it evoked – which included bus bombings – he succeeded in achieving his goals.

http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.680484

[Israeli]

1. continued.........

Let’s try to imagine a messianic-racist-apocalyptic Muslim group that wants to blow up the Western Wall, expel Jews from the area and erect a Muslim wall there, since the place abuts the Al-Aqsa Mosque. Despite a Muslim religious ruling against approaching the wall, the messianic group with its explosive objective fights for its right to enter the plaza in front of the wall, claiming that all it wants to do is to innocently worship there. Would they be let in? Of course not.

It is the same story with regards to the Jews fighting for their right to enter the Temple Mount compound. The rabbis who permit them to enter are of a mind with Rabbis Dov Lior and Shmuel Eliyahu. Their aim is a messianic and ultra-nationalistic one: rebuilding the temple and removing Al-Aqsa and the Muslims.

The issue of the Temple Mount is critical. In effect, and contrary to conventional wisdom, it is the easiest one to resolve. There are only two possibilities: If Israel has become a messianic-racist entity that aims to erect the Temple and expel Muslims, as advocated by Lior and Eliyahu, there is logic in Israeli government policies that allow these people to approach the compound. It’s not for naught that Rabbi Lior chose Minister Uri Ariel, a determined visitor to the Temple Mount, and placed him at the political summit. Their hope is that this time, in the apocalyptic war with more than a billion Muslims that will occur after the mosques are blown up, God will be with the Jews, in contrast to what transpired in the Holocaust or when the first and second temples were destroyed.

But if there is any of the original Zionism left here, with its revolt against messianic views and extremist rabbis and its striving for down-to-earth pragmatism, the converse must hold. In reality, the place where sacrifices were once made in the Temple is now occupied by the Al-Aqsa compound where Muslims pray. According to non-messianic Jewish religious precepts, Jews are forbidden from going to the compound, making do with praying at the wall. There is no other alternative. Not even for the non-messianic extreme right-wing.

Therefore, and not as a concession to violence, Israel must announce that Jews are forbidden from entering the compound and that Israel opposes the construction of a Third Temple. Since in practice this is a Muslim site, there should be joint sovereignty with Jordan and the Palestinians, and no joint policing for now. Reconciliation should start at the Temple Mount. There is no other choice. It’s either choosing life or the Messiah.

Source: http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.680484

[geek tragedy]

2. that's what this has always been about, give the Israeli radicals an inch and they annex a mile nt

[Mosby]

3. so you would support barring Jewish and Christian tourists

From the Temple Mount?

Is that the Progressive position?

[geek tragedy]

4. Until things settle down there, probably no tourists at all.

It's been used exclusively as a Muslim holy site for over 1000 years. It hasn't been used as a Jewish place of worship for 1900+ years.

The Knesset should pass a law codifying that status quo, at the very least by explicitly banning any kind of encroachment, construction of new structures or demolition of old ones, without the consent of the waqf.

Israelis have been professing outrage that Palestinians accuse them of wanting to disrupt the status quo. Ok, then put your money where your mouth is and put that promise into law.

One day, when there's no longer an apartheid state in the West Bank, when Palestinians have been emancipated from Israeli occupation, maybe open up that can of worms. But any changes will and would need to be cleared with the waqf.

[Mosby]

5. thanks for the honesty

You are OK with Muslim intolerance against people of other faiths and think this intolerance should be codified by law.

[geek tragedy]

6. No, I also don't think Muslims should be allowed to pray in St. Peters.

That area stopped being an area of Jewish worship 1000 years before Genghis Khan was born, which happened to be the last time the Christians used it.

At least you're honest and don't pretend that it's libelous for Muslims to accuse Israelis of wanting to change the status quo up there, since you're explicitly arguing for changes to that status quo.

So, it appears their fears are very well-founded.

[Mosby]

7. there is a Jewish site up there

The outcropping in the dome of the rock is where Jews believe the Akedah happened.

Pretty significant event in Jewish religious history.

So it's not just a muslim site.

I fully support religious freedom on the Temple Mount, but Israel should make it clear that no one is going to build a Temple and/or destroy the alaksa mosque.

[geek tragedy]

8. tell you what, when Israel honors the right of Palestinian refugees to return

to the homes of their parents and grandparents, then by all means we should discuss equal access based on the past rather than the present.

[King_David]

9. Do you consider yourself a spokesman for the Palestinian people?

Do you have the authority to promise those things?

[grossproffit]

10. What's the opposite of hasbara? Have we come up with a name yet?

[King_David]

11. There's a couple of posters in this group that actually consider themselves spokesmen for

The Palestinian people... The other one more than this one....

This ones actually the more reasonable one.

[geek tragedy]

12. No one here is a self-appointed spokesperson for the Palestinians.

I would be more than happy to trade not giving a shit about Israel/Palestine in return for . . . having the luxury of the United States not getting entangled in that mess, and not having Israel/Palestine be a domestic political issue.

Israel is playing with fire on the temple mount/haram al-sharif.

You will have to spare the rest of the world, not just the Palestinians, if they find Israeli protestations that they would never contemplate doing anything to change the status quo there, given their past 50 years of indulging the neofascist, ultranationalist extreme rightwing zealots.

No one trusts the Israelis to say no to their own extremists.

With one side of their mouth, the Israelis say, oh no no, we're absolutely committed to maintaining the status quo.

On the other hand:

http://www.timesofisrael.com/temple-mount-activist-to-mark-botched-assassination-attempt/

Activist and would-be Likud MK Yehuda Glick, who seeks to promote greater Jewish freedoms at the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, is planning to hold a public event Sunday marking the one-year anniversary of a failed attempt on his life in which he was badly injured. Senior government ministers plan to attend the event, during which activists who have promoted Jewish access to the contested holy site will be honored.

...

Public Security Minister Gilad Erdan — a member of Netanyahu’s security cabinet — Science and Technology Minister Ofir Akunis, Knesset Speaker Yuli Edelstein and Deputy Foreign Minister Tzipi Hotovely are scheduled to speak at the event, titled “Survival and Celebration,” along with Jerusalem Chief Rabbi Arye Stern.

In addition to speeches, “music, dancing” and screenings of a film called “A Jerusalem Hug from Heaven,” which Glick prepared especially for the evening, the event will also commemorate the 850th anniversary of Maimonides’ ascension to the Temple Mount, according to the press release. A group called Callers of Zion “will recognize those who have strengthened and organized access to the Temple Mount.”

Israel's public security minister is attending a "blow up the status quo" conference.

Do you think that's going to calm things down?