Fort Ross Energy Project:

[AnotherDreamWeaver]

Check this out:
https://gualalariver.org/news/big-oil-targets-sonoma-coast-and-marine-sanctuary/

An oil and gas drilling company from West Virginia is proposing to build a major energy storage project in rural West Sonoma County on part of our beloved Fort Ross State Historic Park, including building a rock breakwater within the Greater Farallones National Marine Sanctuary adjacent to our California State Marine Protected Areas. Join us on Monday, July 17 at 9 am in the Sonoma County Board of Supervisors Chambers for a public hearing on our Local Coastal Plan, which enables our community to defend our coast from ill-advised destructive proposals like this one….

[intrepidity]

1. Yeah I just read about this

Local govt around here says there's no way this will go forward.

I like the concept, in general though if the location is suitable.

[AnotherDreamWeaver]

2. The proposed project goes through a fault zone. nt

[intrepidity]

3. I know. Crazy.

But it will not go forward.

[Think. Again.]

4. Seems odd...

...that an oil & gas drilling company from West Virginia would come up with this wind sourced hydro/gravity storage plan all the way out in California.

[AnotherDreamWeaver]

6. I didn't see "wind sourced"

I read they would pump up at night off the grid when rates were cheap, then let the sea water down to turn the generators during the day when rates are high. there are no high voltage lines to take power anywhere.

[Think. Again.]

7. Third paragraph from the article...

"The pumped storage installation at Fort Ross is far from any existing major electrical transmission infrastructure, but the planned floating offshore wind turbine generating project near Humboldt Bay has been actively evaluating southward subsea cable routing corridors, so the Fort Ross project is thought to be potentially a result of offshore wind industry activities further north."

[AnotherDreamWeaver]

5. this is no place to build 500,000 new homes,

Some properties have no water, the area is hilly, roads are narrow and it's a severe fire prone area.

[Think. Again.]

8. I didn't see any mention of 500K new homes...

This is the article linked in the OP: https://gualalariver.org/news/big-oil-targets-sonoma-coast-and-marine-sanctuary/

Are you using a different source of info? Could you post it?

[AnotherDreamWeaver]

9. KRCB 104.9 was the source.

This came to me as part of an email, and I haven't been able to copy it and paste into DU.

here is another article on the project: https://gualalariver.org/news/big-oil-targets-sonoma-coast-and-marine-sanctuary/

[hunter]

10. There are several reasons to oppose these sorts of projects.

Pumping salt water above sea level isn't wise. The smallest sorts of leaks will contaminate fresh groundwater, possibly over large areas if the leaks remain undetected for long periods.

The floating wind farms and all the ridiculous engineering projects required to integrate them into the existing gas powered grid will only increase the price of electricity and do nothing, absolutely nothing, to reduce the total amount of greenhouse gasses humans eventually dump into the atmosphere.

That this project is proposed by an oil and gas drilling company ought to be a clue...

These large scale wind and solar projects will only prolong our dependence on fossil fuels, especially natural gas. They won't save the world.

I invite everyone to observe the actual behavior of California's electric grid on sites like this:

https://app.electricitymaps.com/zone/US-CAL-CISO

In the past thirty days forty percent of our electricity here in California comes from gas. The most profitable operation of a pumped storage project like this won't be achieved by limiting it's recharge to wind or solar power, instead it will be recharged whenever the demand and price of electricity is low, which frequently occurs when the wind isn't blowing and the sun isn't shining.

California already has a very large capacity to both source and sink electricity for grid stabilization utilizing the fresh water in its extensive water projects, for example the Castaic Power Plant.

If we feel we must build these sorts of projects to support our solar and wind follies we'd be better off using fresh water that's already been diverted from natural ecosystems for human use.

[Think. Again.]

11. Just a note...

The evidence you provide to support your theories are actually DISproving your theories.

For example, you present the theory: "The floating wind farms and all the ridiculous engineering projects required to integrate them into the existing gas powered grid will only increase the price of electricity and do nothing, absolutely nothing, to reduce the total amount of greenhouse gasses humans eventually dump into the atmosphere"

And then you present evidence provided by https://app.electricitymaps.com/zone/US-CAL-CISO which shows that the amount of CO2 emissions stays consistent with energy consumed from natural gas sources, and additional energy consumption from solar sources adds minimal CO2 emissions.

The result being increased energy consumption with minimal increased CO2 emissions.

You also present the theory: "In the past thirty days forty percent of our electricity here in California comes from gas. The most profitable operation of a pumped storage project like this won't be achieved by limiting it's recharge to wind or solar power, instead it will be recharged whenever the demand and price of electricity is low, which frequently occurs when the wind isn't blowing and the sun isn't shining. "

Obviously, the only purpose of storing electricity is to have it available for use when electric generation is not available, OR for leveling out supply and demand during 'peak' demand periods (as the information you provided on the Castiac Power Plant clearly states).

(I hope it is agreed that) reducing CO2 emissions while providing needed electricity is our goal. To eliminate consistent electric generation from CO2 emitting gas and replace it with inconsistent electric generation from non-CO2 solar, storage will be necessary.

Using a small amount of stored gas sourced energy to allow us to use a larger amount of solar sourced energy is a net gain in non-CO2 sourced energy.

And finally, you write: "California already has a very large capacity to both source and sink electricity for grid stabilization utilizing the fresh water in its extensive water projects, for example the Castaic Power Plant."

Yes, the concept has been proven to work, thank you for pointing that out.

[hunter]

13. Furthermore...

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100218089470#post29