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NeoGreen

(4,031 posts)
Fri Nov 10, 2017, 09:30 AM Nov 2017

Electric cars are greener than gas, literally everywhere

https://www.treehugger.com/cars/electric-cars-are-greener-gas-literally-everywhere.html




Electric cars are greener than gas, literally everywhere
Sami Grover, November 8, 2017

I was going to write a post this morning about a study produced by advocacy group Transport & Environment that says electric cars produce fewer emissions everywhere in the European Union, even coal-dependent Poland. I mean, check out these eye popping numbers:


Then I came across a just released study by Michael Sivak and Brandon Schoettle from the University of Michigan that furthers this argument. Snappily titled Fuel Sources for Electricity in the Individual Countries of the World and the Consequent Emissions from Driving Electric Vehicles, the study finds that electric cars produce fewer emissions than their gas powered equivalent in every country in the world, even Botswana and Gibraltar which produce 100% of their electricity from coal and oil respectively. But just how green they are varies a staggering amount. Here's how Forbes reported on this study:

...since Albania generates 100% of its electricity from hydroelectric power, any EV on the roads there is a 5,100-MPG champ. On the other end of the spectrum lies a country like Botswana. Since it gets all of its electricity from coal and oil, any electric vehicle there is like a 29-MPG car, a bit better than the average new vehicle in the U.S. Speaking of the United States, the average EV here gets 55.4 MPGghg.


That said, a couple of things should be noted about this study: It doesn't take into account emissions created during manufacturing (which are higher for electric vehicles), and it appears to be looking at average vehicle emissions—meaning small, low range EVs are being pitted against big, fat SUVs.

Which brings me to a rather over dramatized headline in the Financial Times: Electric cars' green image blackens underneath the hood. Here, the FT cites an MIT study that finds large electric cars—like the Tesla Model S 100D— can produce 61,115 kg of CO2 equivalent over the course of 270,000km of driving once manufacturing emissions are taken into account. This is compared to 51,891 for a small, gas-powered car like the Mitsubishi Mirage. Thats assuming—however—that the car is driven in the relatively coal-dependent US midwest, and that the cars' lifespans are the same (a questionable assertion given the relative mechanical simplicity of an electric vehicle).

The message here—as the Financial Times itself points out—is not that electric cars are dirtier than gas cars. After all, a BMW 7 series produced nearly twice the emissions of the Tesla in the same study—and electric cars are always greener than equivalent sized non-electric cars. It's that putting an electric drivetrain in an oversized car and giving it more range than it needs is not the greenest way to fix our transportation problems. Instead, we need a multi-pronged approach that goes something like this:

1) Switch all vehicles to electric drivetrains.
2) Clean up the electrical grid so they on renewables.
3) Encourage the use of smaller vehicles with only as much range as is realistically needed.
4) Promote ridesharing and alternatives to car ownership, so manufacturing emissions are spread over a greater number of passenger miles.
5) Rethink planning and transportation so that cars aren't necessary.

(Note: This list was updated to include the importance of cleaning up the grid.)

I write a lot about electric cars. I drive two plug-in vehicles. They offer a significant improvement over their gas- and diesel-powered equivalents. But they are by no means a panacea.

We can do better.
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Electric cars are greener than gas, literally everywhere (Original Post) NeoGreen Nov 2017 OP
Good point about the reduced complexity of an EV but a question about your analysis? Finishline42 Nov 2017 #1
Solar panels over the parking lots of workplaces are a more direct solution. hunter Nov 2017 #2

Finishline42

(1,091 posts)
1. Good point about the reduced complexity of an EV but a question about your analysis?
Fri Nov 10, 2017, 11:46 AM
Nov 2017

Good point about the reduced complexity of an EV vs an IC driven car but a question about your analysis? What if the owner of an EV has solar panels on their property?

One of the main narratives against EV's is that they use electricity generated by coal. Having a solar PV system allows an EV owner to do what an owner of gas powered vehicle can never do - own the means of producing the fuel for their car.

The issue with your point 3 is that few people that I know have a life simple enough for this. Although I do know a lot of people that have multiple cars so that at least one EV would be good match for their needs.

The main way to reduce the use of cars is the development of safe and efficient public transportation.

hunter

(38,317 posts)
2. Solar panels over the parking lots of workplaces are a more direct solution.
Fri Nov 10, 2017, 01:21 PM
Nov 2017

Drive to work, park under the solar panels, plug your car in... There are many workplaces in my city that have installed parking lot solar.

A better solution would be to reduce automobile commuting and to denormalize car ownership. This could be done by creating attractive walkable urban areas and higher density suburbs, places where few people want to deal with the hassles of car ownership.

When my wife and I met we were Los Angeles commuters, suffering every working day an hour or more of stressful freeway traffic that averaged 15-20 miles per hour or less.

By some planning and greater good fortune we've managed to avoid the automobile commuter lifestyle since the mid-eighties, but we still live in a place where functional adults are expected to own cars.

I have a niece and a nephew living in San Francisco. Whenever they need a car for occasional trips out of town, they rent one.

Currently the cost of an electric car plus the solar panels requires to keep it fully charged are beyond the economic reach of middle class U.S. Americans.

I drive an $800 car (I've got some mechanical skills) and I top up its gasoline tank about once a month. It's going to be a long time, if ever, before electric cars and solar panels fall into that price range.

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