Hillary Clinton
Related: About this forumHow pissed were you in June of 08?
I was looking at GDP and its descent into madness, and as I was thinking about rebuttals to the many anti-Hillary threads, I had a nagging feeling that I can't judge these people harshly, because they reminded me a little of myself in 08 when Hillary was losing. I am not excusing the extreme "blow it all up" assertions; helping Trump in that way is incredibly self destructive. But deep down I see the humanness of their reaction. I also know that when they calm down, someday, they'll see this thing more clearly, as I do now. Some of them never will, and they aren't a true part of this process anyway. They exist only on the sidelines.
This last bit of clinging to the email "scandal," a classic anti-Clinton GOP imagined attack, is particularly sad to witness. It's the most focused on issue right now solely because it is their last hope of winning. And yet because of what's at stake, Sanders defeat, they can't see it was a GOP fake scandal all along.
What about you? What were you feeling in June of 08?
BootinUp
(47,179 posts)As far as other things that happened in the campaign, I thought they were pretty standard types of occurrences in a close primary contest for President.
LisaM
(27,827 posts)Ours was so awful that I actually went to Kinkos (didn't have a home computer at the time) and started a thread about the bullying and the unfairness of it! I then went home all pissed and my sister called me later that day and said that I'd gotten tons of responses and it made it to the Greatest Page (only time ever for me, I think!)
BobbyDrake
(2,542 posts)I get what you're saying, but as someone who took the time to learn from that campaign, and who supports the candidate who also took the time to learn from that campaign, I can't say I have much sympathy for the side who refused to even entertain the very idea that there was anything they didn't already know.
No one forced Bernie to run a version of 2008's losing campaign. He did that on his own.
LisaM
(27,827 posts)I think the only thing that bothered me - and this was more with my friends - was peoples' refusal to engage in any sort of reasoning about Obama's stance on the issues, which I thought were slightly to the right of hers. I also learned back then that the big "rock star" kind of rally is part of a campaign style that really turns me off. The other thing that annoyed me was that he'd promised to serve out a full term in the Senate and didn't and no one seemed to think that it mattered.
I was enormously disappointed and I'm sure I pushed back at times - mostly at the ageism, which was rampant then (don't see that so much now, eh? snicker!)
OTOH, I didn't start 10 threads a week trashing Obama. I knew that people responded to Obama's charisma and that they liked being part of an exciting movement (not my style, but so be it). I scarcely dared to hope Hillary would run again and I was thrilled when she did, but I never thought the attacks would double down this time.
And I never, ever said I wouldn't vote for Obama and in fact never considered such an option.
gwheezie
(3,580 posts)I preferred her to Obama by a hair and went back and forth several times before I voted. So by the time Obama was nominated I was thrilled to be able to vote for him in the GE. I thought puma was ridiculous.
Freddie
(9,273 posts)And would have happily voted for either. Was a little disappointed that PBO did not choose HRC for his running mate, but Joe proved to be a great asset. As did she as S of S!
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)not happy with Hillary during that time period.
But, I got over it. She showed grace and a team mentality after the voting was done. A bar I do not expect her opponent to clear.
Cha
(297,516 posts)riversedge
(70,282 posts)tears that day.
Cha
(297,516 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)... the nomination, I supported Obama. It wasn't a difficult choice for me, and I certainly wasn't distraught over it. Maybe if I'd been active with an online forum like this one, I might have felt differently ... but I can't imagine being angry or wanting to do anything to maliciously harm the party or the party's nominee.
It must just be an online phenomenon ... I know several Sanders supporters and they are NOTHING at all like the typical ones encountered here. The ones I know are ordinary rational and reasonable people. They have their own reasons for supporting Sanders, but they aren't the angry and aggressive "Hillary-haters" who'd rather have Trump in order to "punish Democrats".
Bernie was their first choice, but they'll happily support the party's choice anyway. Online Bernie supporters are a very strange group of people.
Alerter: These are my personal opinions based on my personal observations.
realmirage
(2,117 posts)group who tried to be reasonable about the situation. Even regular BS supporters here are being terrorized by the fringe
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)OKNancy
(41,832 posts)I liked Obama a lot. In fact, as I recall my feelings... the more I heard him the more I thought " OK, I can get behind him"
ismnotwasm
(41,998 posts)I wanted a Democrat.
DemonGoddess
(4,640 posts)We had two great candidates that year, and the one I didn't support won. It didn't matter, because I liked him as well, and voted for him in the fall. I didn't see a reason to get angry over the FACT that he knew what to do about winning delegates. Obama ran a fantastic campaign, and deserved his win.
Kaleva
(36,327 posts)Stand and Fight
(7,480 posts)realmirage
(2,117 posts)Only about 20 percent are really pissed about Sanders defeat and hate Hillary. But Hillary had her PUMAs, none of them here today?
anamnua
(1,119 posts)realmirage
(2,117 posts)anamnua
(1,119 posts)Last edited Thu May 26, 2016, 07:59 PM - Edit history (1)
from my '08 PUMAness.
However, in contrast to the Hill '08 campaign when we had legitimate reasons to feel screwed over, the Bernista outrage is all a mirage -- self-conjured and self-validated.
Mind you if you think the current GDP is bad you should have been around for the glory days of the '08 Clintonista/Obamabot spitefest; I still carry the scars!
What would really interest me would be a breakdown of the orientation (Hill or Bernie) during this primary cycle of the '08 Obama primary supporters.
realmirage
(2,117 posts)I think their heads would all simultaneously explode.
When you say orientation, what do you mean..
anamnua
(1,119 posts)By the way have any of the Bernistas in GDP actually said they would support Trump over Hillary -- as opposed to merely abstaining? If so that is an expellling offence.
stopbush
(24,396 posts)who ends up getting the Dem nomination.
Which is why I haven't lost any sleep worrying that Hillary wouldn't get the nomination - I picked her early this time and my track record is excellent.
SharonClark
(10,014 posts)riversedge
(70,282 posts)Response to realmirage (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
ProudProgressiveNow
(6,129 posts)but still worked to get Obama elected...
anamnua
(1,119 posts)by the Florida/Michigan disenfranchisement.
realmirage
(2,117 posts)LisaM
(27,827 posts)Especially when people I was friends with got all up in arms about it, especially one whom I knew didn't like Hillary and frankly, I knew his anger stemmed from not wanting her to get votes. I still think it was wrong, but people move past it.
realmirage
(2,117 posts)human nature usually pushes people to choose winning. Your friend who wanted to disqualify Florida, if the shoe was on the other foot, guess what he'd be saying?
LisaM
(27,827 posts)People always say that they don't want Iowa and NH to have so much influence, but when anyone tries to actually change it, it's a dead end.
Well, that's water under the bridge now. Note Hillary didn't file a bunch of lawsuits, though, which Sanders certainly would have done (heck, if someone reminds him about it, he'll probably go file one now!)
realmirage
(2,117 posts)And Michigan was a bit more controversial since BO wasn't on the ballot.. thank God that election is in the past
SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)I supported President Obama (couldn't vote in the primary/election due to age), but I wasn't mad that Hillary was still in the race. Her actions didn't bother me as much as Sanders are now.
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)I don't remember the exact date, but I teamed up with a few other Obama people and tried to mend some fences with folks. But it was nowhere near as insane then as it is now.
There are quite a few people here I used to respect that I will have a hard time trusting ever again, even if they calm down, tbh.
realmirage
(2,117 posts)bravenak
(34,648 posts)I felt like the folks who had a serious committment to the candidates should fight it out. She said some stuff that pissed me off, I was going to vote for her. Then he pissed me off so I couldn't decide. I get pissed off easily. But I was happy to vote AGAINST my governor being VP.
book_worm
(15,951 posts)Hekate
(90,773 posts)It doesn't get better, in my mind.
riversedge
(70,282 posts)Hillary in my state. But I was so proud of her when she put all aside and nominated Obama (still sad). Then I canvassed for him in the fall.
Seems so long ago. So much has happened and changed in the US and the world.
sarae
(3,284 posts)I didn't vote in the primary I honestly couldn't decide between them because I liked them both, so I was fine with whoever won. And I was so excited about Obama in the months before November, and thrilled after the election.
Maybe I don't remember because I didn't pay nearly this much attention to the 2008 primary, for the above reasons, but I don't remember this much nastiness. I know everyone says it was awful! But the way Hillary really rallied behind Obama once he won the nomination is something I just can't see Sanders doing.
Speaking of '08 can you imagine if Hillary had gone around Obama and tried to set a debate up between her and McCain? She would have been CRUCIFIED. I'm really angry at what BS has done even if there ends up being no debate, the optics of what he's done is HORRIBLE.
realmirage
(2,117 posts)He is assuring the DNC he is going to endorse Hillary, and all this stupidity of his is him trying to gain more leverage in the negotiations over the platform. He knows bc of his age this is his last hurrah so he's trying to do as much as possible to get any leverage. Honestly it is ruining his image.
sarae
(3,284 posts)but then he publicly makes these disrespectful gestures. I don't know what to believe. Either way, it certainly doesn't publicly promote party unity, so I'm not sure what he's trying to do...
realmirage
(2,117 posts)on the manager of Safeway because the deli sliced her turkey too thick? Yeah it's one of those kind of deals
In other words, he's petty as f'k because it's all trivial BS.
SO TRUE.
Nonhlanhla
(2,074 posts)For not getting out of the race when it became clear she was not going to win, and for some of the things she had said. I was a huge Obama fan. But Hillary won me over at the convention, and this time around I started supporting her fairly early on (after an initial start of being neutral). And now I'm far more annoyed at Bernie for not getting out or at least toning things down - this time around the winner is far clearer, and his aggression in his attacks on her is far worse than anything she ever did. And I'm skeptical about his ability to be gracious in defeat like Hillary was back then.
peggysue2
(10,839 posts)I was a Hillary supporter on 2008 and was pissed at the way things went down. I got over it. What I never could understand were Hillary supporters who became pissed at Hillary when she agreed to serve as SOS. And stayed pissed as if she had betrayed some secret handshake or sold her soul to the enemy.
That being said, I believed then as I believe now that she'll make an outstanding President. She's proven her loyalty to the Democratic cause and worked tirelessly for President Obama. I'm betting her first 100 days will be historic in scale. She's had a long time to think and plan her vision for the country's renewal. Can't wait until she's able to start initiating. And when I get to say, "Thank you, Madame President."
NastyRiffraff
(12,448 posts)I strongly supported Hillary in that primary. But I always said that I would vote for Obama in a heartbeat if he won the nomination, and I did. Hillary's concession speech and behavior at the convention went a long way towards moving the more stubborn to vote for Obama. Plus, between Obama/Biden and McCain/Palin there was no contest.
Note: I love Obama now! I never hated him, but I think he's been a great president.
MattP
(3,304 posts)Half my family went for Hillary this time we are all with her in Cali, and my friend voted first time in the primary for her today by mail
ronnykmarshall
(35,356 posts)Not pissed at all.
I was ready to get behind Obama.