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Hillary Clinton is Blowing Up Her Own Campaign Against Bernie Sanders CNN (Original Post) Blue State Bandit Feb 2016 OP
Revealing interview. AtomicKitten Feb 2016 #1
No -- from my perspective, she has lost to a better candidate -- Bernie. I don't have to validate Akamai Feb 2016 #14
my mind & my heart are also hopemountain Feb 2016 #16
A-effing-men!! Go, Bernie!!! Akamai Feb 2016 #17
I'm a big fan of Bernie's contemporary new deal. AtomicKitten Feb 2016 #18
As I see how Hillary is campaigning now and remembering how/what she INdemo Feb 2016 #2
I think the Establishment would be perfectly happy with a GOP win rather than lose control... Hydra Feb 2016 #5
This. What you wrote. TexasMommaWithAHat Feb 2016 #8
He'll embrace it. He's sealed much more than a Hoover already. Blue State Bandit Feb 2016 #11
He'll embrace what? Hydra Feb 2016 #12
Lead, follow, or get out of the way. Blue State Bandit Feb 2016 #20
Confirms what we knew and some of what was suspected. Dustlawyer Feb 2016 #10
The WH panicking about a Sanders victory and that they are displeased that it's a movement Hydra Feb 2016 #3
A very illuminating discussion, thanks for posting. appalachiablue Feb 2016 #4
He actually also says she is "so qualified" to be president, so his comments are tblue37 Feb 2016 #6
Paranoia, insistence on loyalty, victimized or damaged, and being abnormally appalachiablue Feb 2016 #7
Exactly! What a good post... oregonjen Feb 2016 #13
I don't know about Hillary. Rod Beauvex Feb 2016 #15
That definitely has 2 leave a mark. Though not interested in "the White House" determining my vote. highprincipleswork Feb 2016 #9
"Terrible Judgment" EmperorHasNoClothes Feb 2016 #19
 

AtomicKitten

(46,585 posts)
1. Revealing interview.
Sun Feb 7, 2016, 11:52 PM
Feb 2016

Let's be clear though. Hillary lost the nomination and presidency when she mishandled classified information as SOS. And when she sold arms to dodgy countries as SOS that made sizable donations to the Clinton Foundation (quid pro quo?) And when put her thumb on the scale as SOS favoring the bloody rightwing Hondruran coup. And when she voted in favor of preemptive war with the Iraq War Resolution. etc. etc. etc.

 

Akamai

(1,779 posts)
14. No -- from my perspective, she has lost to a better candidate -- Bernie. I don't have to validate
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 02:30 AM
Feb 2016

the other stuff.

Bernie's ideas are by far more supportive of all of us, and also the planet. I don't need to look at the nooks and crannies of all of the other reasons not to vote for her.

Go Bernie! Only possible savior of the planet!

 

AtomicKitten

(46,585 posts)
18. I'm a big fan of Bernie's contemporary new deal.
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 04:54 AM
Feb 2016

And his sane approach to foreign policy. I also am adamantly opposed to Hillary Clinton on a number of issues, not the least of which are her neoliberal views on foreign policy. She has demonstrated poor judgment and a reckless disregard for life, the law, and transparency. In my view, she would be as bad or worse than any of the Republicans. I will joyfully vote for Bernie with all the above in mind.

INdemo

(6,994 posts)
2. As I see how Hillary is campaigning now and remembering how/what she
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 12:04 AM
Feb 2016

did against Obama and how downright dirty she was then and how she is now..She really wants this thing and she will do whatever it takes..
So with that said,I am believing more more as this campaign goes on that she probably had a hell-of-a-lot of power and influence when Bill was President and this is actually Hillary's 2nd try for her 3rd term as President but she will not win.
Obviously the White House and all Establishment Democrats fear that Sanders will not defeat the Republicans or is it more factual that Sanders will defeat the Establishment and bring our Democracy back to the people that is rightfully belongs to?

I believe they fear Sanders because Sanders wins he brings more progressives to Congress

Hydra

(14,459 posts)
5. I think the Establishment would be perfectly happy with a GOP win rather than lose control...
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 12:15 AM
Feb 2016

...of the message and the party. The Obama WH seems particularly afraid of an FDR moment that could relegate Obama's tenure to a Hoover status.

The fact that there is that level of open narcissism and greed in play is a bad sign for where our political process stands.

Blue State Bandit

(2,122 posts)
20. Lead, follow, or get out of the way.
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 10:03 PM
Feb 2016

If Obama's worried about his legacy, he will see the writing on the wall. This is his revolution too. He helped sow the seeds, and gave us enough space to germinate (sort'a). He was restricted by circumstance, but Bernie can push beyond, and not "maintain" -her word- Obama's achievements.

If you nominate Hillary, you -by default- start with half-ish the country against you. Bernie doesn't have that burden. Yes the pukes will attack., that's all they know. But the guys that live in fear of being primaried from the right, when campaign reform is brought back with a vengeance, they will be swayed.

Think of Obama as completing Lincoln's full Presidency, and would make a monumental Supreme Court Justice the likes not seen since Beef Supreme!

Dustlawyer

(10,495 posts)
10. Confirms what we knew and some of what was suspected.
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 01:03 AM
Feb 2016

I could do without of the drivel, Hillary is "passionate!" She is only passionate about winning the election! Not one bit about what it means for Bernie's number 1 issue. Hillary is the perfect opponent for Bernie. Hillary is the epitome of what money in politics, campaign contributions, and how cozy politicians are with these guys. She represents what he is trying to stop. She cannot apologize her way out of this. She will never release the transcripts and her campaign will rot.

Bernstein is so close to the players and the game that he cannot see this. He reflexively toes the Establishment line and wouldn't know an average American if one slapped him in the face!

The CNN drone cannot report on Bernie and his policies in a serious way, and so she struggles to come up with a description that is not an outright attack on Bernie. All reinforcing that Bernie is not to be taken seriously.

Hydra

(14,459 posts)
3. The WH panicking about a Sanders victory and that they are displeased that it's a movement
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 12:12 AM
Feb 2016

Speaks volumes about what's really going on in Washington. They don't want or think they need our input- just our money and silent consent to whatever they want to do.

tblue37

(65,360 posts)
6. He actually also says she is "so qualified" to be president, so his comments are
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 12:21 AM
Feb 2016

Last edited Mon Feb 8, 2016, 05:20 AM - Edit history (1)

not entirely negative about her.

My concern with Hillary is encapsulated in the Alan Alda/Meryl Streep/Julie Harris movie The Seduction of Joe Tynan , about a decent, idealistic young political rising star whose only goal is to get into a position of power so that he can do good work to benefit the people of the country.

Unfortunately, along the way up the ladder he has to keep making deals and compromising, until by the time he finally does get into the powerful position, he is hemmed in on all sides by the constraints his compromises and deals have created for him. He can't do any of the good things he has always has wanted to do, always intended to do, because he now has no choice but to play the game according to the same corrupt rules that everyone else plays it by.

I fear that is what might have happened to Hillary. I also fear that her suspicious nature, bordering on paranoia--as well justified as it certainly is, considering all the unfounded attacks that she has suffered from what really and truly is a vast right wing conspiracy--leads her to make such unforced errors as refusing to provide those speech transcripts, thus allowing people to imagine worst case scenarios.

Many of her worst political choices were made because she was afraid that doing anything else might undermine her political future. The IWR was such an error. She, like many other Dem office holders, was deliberately painted into a corner by the Republicans, and most of them voted for the IWR because they were terrified, especially after 9/11, of being painted as weak on defense in an election year. As a woman, she especially felt she needed to prove herself tough enough to make the hard choice to go to war if necessary.

(Needless to say, people like Bernie stood on principle, though, and made the right choice, even if it might harm them politically.)

I believe many of Hillary's hawkish positions derive from that same sense of needing to prove she can be tough and send troops to war.

Her sense of being under siege also leads her to surround herself with unquestioning loyalists whom she has known for years, but loyalists all too easily become yes men and yes women. If they think she is headed in the wrong direction, they won't rock the boat by disagreeing with her, but even worse, they might have surrendered their own mental independence to the point of seeing everything through Hillary colored glasses, so that they don't actually have independent points of view.

Quite apart from that risk, though, there is also the fact that many who have proved their loyalty, so that she is willing to take their advice, simply give lousy advice. I am thinking of people like Mark Penn, who apparently isn't working with her campaign this time, but who was widely blamed for some of the worst missteps of her 2008 campaign.

I don't doubt that in Penn's absence she relies on other long time friends whose advice she doesn't question enough, even if it is not exactly good advice. Loyalty seems to be her first concern, not whether the person has good judgment about how to run a campaign.

I like Hillary in many ways and will certainly support her if she is our nominee, but I honestly don't trust her judgment, and I also worry that her high negatives/low positives (even among those who would normally vote Dem) will hurt her in the GE, even as the hatred for her on the right brings the rabid right wngers out in droves to vote against her.

appalachiablue

(41,133 posts)
7. Paranoia, insistence on loyalty, victimized or damaged, and being abnormally
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 12:49 AM
Feb 2016

determined to succeed can be associated with classic type A driven personalities, people who've been hurt, and badly in their professional or personal life, and other scenarios. It seems to me at least. Not saying all this fits her particularly but for people in general and to varying degrees of severity of course. Just my 2 cents.

oregonjen

(3,338 posts)
13. Exactly! What a good post...
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 01:30 AM
Feb 2016

"because he now has no choice but to play the game according to the same corrupt rules that everyone else plays it by."
I haven't seen that movie, I will try to find it online.


Bernie is now changing the game, and the 99% are awake and ready to fight, which must be so frustrating and shocking to her after all these years.

EmperorHasNoClothes

(4,797 posts)
19. "Terrible Judgment"
Mon Feb 8, 2016, 01:16 PM
Feb 2016

That pretty much sums it up. Terrible judgment as a Senator and terrible judgment as a candidate (in both 2008 and 2016). Why should we expect her to have good judgment as President?

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