Is public shaming fair punishment?
You play the judge: How would you sentence a man who spent 15 years picking on his neighbor and her handicapped children?
A Cleveland judge sentenced just such a man, Edmond Aviv, to jail, community service, anger management and mental health counseling and to spend five hours alongside a busy street on a Sunday in April with a great big sign branding him an intolerant bully.
The 8th Amendment bans cruel and unusual punishment. Is this either one? Or can justice be fairly meted out in something other than years and months behind bars?
In 2012, a different Cleveland judge gave a woman a choice of going to jail or spending two days standing on a street corner with a sign reading: "Only an idiot would drive on the sidewalk to avoid a school bus." The woman chose to hold the sign.
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-0525-morrison-sentencing-shame-judges-20140525-column.html
Scuba
(53,475 posts)bemildred
(90,061 posts)And it's cheap and transitory and very effective when it is effective. I auppose you could present them with options: the stocks in a public square or jail? And then put the ones who choose jail in the stocks. But that would be figured out and gamed quickly. Still, for many things, it's probably a better option that jail
Incarceration is such a stupid way to punish crime. It's like sending them to crime schools when they show atpitude.
Faux pas
(14,690 posts)and maybe, just maybe, the offenders will actually think twice about their actions before they do it again.
Jefferson23
(30,099 posts)/mental health services would be a better means to help teach empathy. Would go
much further than shaming a person..why we are so about punitive measure sometimes
freaks me out..it is such a dumb and short term answer. When you make the effort
to better social ills it spreads around..this one person eventually has a positive impact
on others in the community, which should be the goal.
bemildred
(90,061 posts)It seems clear violence is cultural, learned behavior, a lot of it, and we should be working hard to unlearn it. So I can agree that way.
A divided society is a weak society, and such unity cannot be compelled, so you better teach people to get along, it's not really that hard..
Jefferson23
(30,099 posts)Seriously, I think you can accomplish both goals simultaneously..short and long term.
Agreed, violence is cultural, learned behavior. Too often we foment violence while presuming we'll curtail it
by punishment via incarceration. In the case of the bully neighbor, I don't know the details, but 15 years of
that bullshit tells me the community locals don't know how to invest in being proactive for the more vulnerable among us.
Society must be concerned first for the victims rights, and I like the idea of compensation because it can
translate into something tangible..meaning assist the victims lives for the better in short order. The assets
of the bully and how it is determined by the judge and the willingness of the perpetrator to come to a
reasonable agreement..well he could decide to hire an attorney and fight his charges, but in the end, if he has
half a working brain, he'll negotiate to stay out of jail. The second tier is important, must receive anger
management/mental heath help. In the end, he learns to get along with people in the best scenario and at
worst he learns boundaries where he keeps his nasty inclinations in check and is now on notice by the state
you have an opportunity that came with support to change, best not to fuck up. Community service is a
healthy way for him to use his new learned skills, the state gets feedback on how he's doing. I like mental
health workers/social workers..we can do much better..they're a pretty dedicated group, overall.
I do like this judge here: Broadman seems to have taken that to heart. He sentenced an illiterate woman to learn how to read. Another offender had to donate his car to a battered women's shelter. And much ahead of his time Broadman impounded the cars of repeat drunk drivers.
Here too I sympathize with him although I understand why the ACLU freaked out over it:
*Yet Broadman triggered a national tripwire in 1991 when a woman came before him with a long criminal record and a felony child abuse conviction for beating her young daughters. The woman was pregnant with her fifth child and, to protect her "un-conceived" children, Broadman gave her a choice: prison or probation using the birth control device Norplant for five years. The woman took the deal but changed her mind and brought in lawyers.
There is much we can do to encourage a healthy state, this of course only scratching the surface but it is
a worthy undertaking and an important conversation. Prison rehabilitation is non existent for the most part
in the US and it is a terrible use of tax dollars.
I attended a friends commencement ceremony yesterday, at Bard College. One of their out reach programs
I was not aware of involves educating prisoners. The one young man who made it through and participated
in the graduation ceremony was evidently released from prison and now has a chance of moving on with his life,
but he is the rare exception because all that soft stuff on bad people never works, or so they say.
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)they are incapable of experiencing shame.
PatrickforO
(14,592 posts)we might keep bullies like this from going too far.