"There has not been in American history a more important leak than Snowden's" -Daniel Ellsberg

[Triana]

In my estimation, there has not been in American history a more important leak than Edward Snowden's release of NSA material – and that definitely includes the Pentagon Papers 40 years ago. Snowden's whistleblowing gives us the possibility to roll back a key part of what has amounted to an "executive coup" against the US constitution.

Since 9/11, there has been, at first secretly but increasingly openly, a revocation of the bill of rights for which this country fought over 200 years ago. In particular, the fourth and fifth amendments of the US constitution, which safeguard citizens from unwarranted intrusion by the government into their private lives, have been virtually suspended.

The government claims it has a court warrant under Fisa – but that unconstitutionally sweeping warrant is from a secret court, shielded from effective oversight, almost totally deferential to executive requests. As Russell Tice, a former National Security Agency analyst, put it: "It is a kangaroo court with a rubber stamp."

For the president then to say that there is judicial oversight is nonsense – as is the alleged oversight function of the intelligence committees in Congress. Not for the first time – as with issues of torture, kidnapping, detention, assassination by drones and death squads –they have shown themselves to be thoroughly co-opted by the agencies they supposedly monitor. They are also black holes for information that the public needs to know.

MORE...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jun/10/edward-snowden-united-stasi-america

Ellsberg just tweeted this article, written by him, with the comment: "There has not been in American history a more important leak than Snowden's"

http://twitter.com/DanielEllsberg

[graham4anything]

1. I always loved Andy Warhol. He was 100% correct. nt

[Astrad]

2. You mean when he said

"They always say time changes things, but you actually have to change them yourself."

[Mnemosyne]

3. Waiting for the Ellsberg denigrators to show. Thanks Triana. nt

[Triana]

4. In the overall scheme of things, he's right.

Whether you think what Greenwald & Snowden have revealed is new info or old info or a combination (personally it's mostly old news to me and the outrage *now* is puzzling) - the effect it has or may have is what is important.

Since 9-11 (and before really), our gov't has been well-known to secretly spy on its own people without due cause. And no matter whether it's done under a Repub or Dem Pres and administration - it's wrong and a violation of our constitutional rights as American citizens.

I am suspicious of Greenwald and Snowden's motives in this though. Maybe for no reason or maybe there is a reason. I don't know yet. But this crap has been going on in one form or another for 12+ years. I can understand their wanting to burn light on it and change it - we should all want that and most of us probably do to some extent or other. But why now - at this moment? Is that their only objective? Who are they associated with politically and otherwise? If we followed money and connection from both of them, where would that lead?

Is it a big deal that we found out the name is "PRISM" and didn't know that before? But most of us knew what they were doing, whatever they called it.

I get that it's a "big f*cking deal" - but it was before, too. And it needs to change - IMO the OHS needs to be busted apart and any agencies that were lumped under it (FEMA for instance) need to be once again restored to independent agencies. And, the "Patriot Act" needs to go in the trash bin - and not the recycle bin either. So, in that regard, whether these two exposed anything revelatory is actually secondary to the fact that some people who were (obviously) not paying attention to this issue before ARE PAYING ATTENTION NOW - and maybe that will help change things.

I get sick of folks trying to pin it on Obama -- because this is bigger than him and has been going on longer than he's been in politics. This isn't just an Obama problem.

If the Teabillies wanted to re-expose this and sensationalize it to emphasize how "big government" is bad, and I can see that might be their particular objective. I can see and hear them with their torches and pitchforks and AK-47s and AR-15s now....idiots.

I don't think big government is bad - I think big, secret government owned and controlled by big corporations and a few rich bastards (rather than actual common human voters and actual human populace it governs) is bad. Maybe this will put a big chink in that oligarchic bullshit and if it does, that would indeed be a "big f*cking deal".

Oh hai, Carlysle Group - Good Day and kiss my ass.