Cell Phones Suck II: They're Listening...

[Liber-AL]

Source: Earthfirst!Journal

Rumor has it that cell phones aren’t very secure. Most cell phones nowadays have Global Positioning System (GPS) devices in them, and even older phones that don’t can still be easily tracked by triangulating their signals to towers. Every time you call someone or someone calls you, information about your phone, their phone, and the start and stop times of the conversation is recorded. Word on the street is that the feds can even remotely turn on the microphone in your cell phone and use it to eavesdrop on nearby conversations, in some cases even when your phone is turned off, all without you knowing. This is why Earth First!ers often take the batteries out of their phones before sensitive meetings. I’ve often wondered how much of this is true and how much is the product of paranoid, security-culture junkies. Turns out, it’s all true.


http://earthfirstjournal.org/article.php?id=303


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My curiosity about cell phone security peaked when I had to give my SSN over the phone to an IRS phone operator to verify something. A little research provided me with the above. In my wildest dreams I never imagined just how un-secure my cell phone is; and, in ways I never thought of. The prophecies outlined in the book 1984 have come to fruition through the devices we all love so well. Yes, that includes your computer with the ubiquitous spy cam built into it! But the cell phone is the most nefarious tool of all for keeping tabs on you and your associations without your knowledge!

[Arctic Dave]

1. Cell phones are not, nor have they ever been secure.

Why do you think this is one of the first services the US puts online after they invade a country.

[truedelphi]

2. And it is not just the government - any neighbor out there that

Has a baby monitor, has the potential to hear your conversations.

In my last decade of taking care of elderly people, often with the use of baby monitors to help out, I heard endless phone calls that people in the area made. Lovey dovey conversations. Family feuds. People offering up their credit card information to sales call-in lines.

I think people really don't understand this at all. But it convinced me that we would always have a land line. And we do.

[TheWraith]

3. Did you fact-check that statement at all?

Cell phone conversations cannot be intercepted by baby monitors. All cell phone conversations are encrypted, meaning that even if they're intercepted by someone with the right equipment, they cannot be listened to. You're confusing cell phones with 900 MHz cordless phones for landlines, the things that you think are secure and can't be listened in on. Although I suppose that's only appropriate for a thread that starts out encouraging people to emulate the actions of a fringe anarchist group.

[Liber-AL]

6. Thanks twice!

One for giving my "peace of mind" a boost when it comes to cell phone conversations. We buy them and use them without understanding how they really work. The word encryption was the key in your post that opened up a box of smiles.

TWO for your observation that the Earth First! Journal is a fringe anarchist group. I didn't know that! I just googled "cell phone security" and picked the site I thought was most informative about what I was searching for. I have no affiliation with the group.
Also, I will delete the OP if anyone is offended by it... Just let me know... All it takes is one person to ask and its gone!

[truedelphi]

12. You are right about my confusion. But the countless "apps" now on

Most users cell phones make that technology very "transparent" to the cyber criminal crowd.

[surrealAmerican]

8. You were probably hearing ...

... neighbors' conversations on cordless phones, not cell phones.

[truedelphi]

9. You are right about the cordless thing-ee.

But over the last 48 hours, the American public finds out that the Google corporation was intercepting via wi fi discussions and pertinent information that was being broadcast over wi fi.

Sorry I was technically wrong, and thank you for correcting me. But I think my over all message remains - there are many out there who are listening.

[freshwest]

4. You got the whole picture. Yes, science fiction is no longer fiction, it's the world we live in.

Communications are nowhere near as people hope, and never have been. I used to work with this stuff way back when, it was easy over thirty years ago, when we weren't so into wireless, but expanding microwave. Definitely not a rumor.

Anything through the air has always been surveilled. Things that weren't sent through the air and went through switching systems were recorded, and could be tapped in at multiple places, but the data was not held indefinitely like Google does with searches, or one's ISP does with keystrokes. With sufficient voltage phones on the hook could be tapped.

The on-board cam on the computer is taking in data, and if the sound input as well, if it isn't changed to require wired input. The view one sees on youtube when a person makes a video of themselves to share, is on every computer I've bought in recent years. They're standard, built in. When I booted mine up for the first time, I was on the screen, so I fixed that.

The push to make everything wireless, always online, is part of the system of control or connectivity that we willingly pay for each month. We like it even though it makes us vulnerable. We've been surveilled since the 1960's or maybe earlier, as you know.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Echelon_%28signals_intelligence%29

We've only become more aware because of abuses of trust. That's the issue for all of us using these and there haven't been any big abuses of that trust so far. I can see why people took the batteries out.

Good story there.

[Liber-AL]

5. Great information freshwest!

One thing you said bothers me.

ISP's use key loggers? How can we know if an ISP is doing that? I have been banking on line for years and have never had a problem with stolen passwords or hacked accounts. However, if what you say is true, the risk has always been there. I find that very unsettling.

[freshwest]

7. It was told me to early on, that the internet was like the old phone company's rural 'party line.'

In other words, everyone on the line could hear all that was being said, if they were quiet. You can set your browser to alert you every time you're entering an unencrypted domain or someone is trying to put cookies on your computer, and accept each one on a case by case basis, and delete afterwards.

There is encryption, but it can be hacked. I do some online purchases, but I don't bank online and I'm not wireless at home. But don't worry, I know plenty of people that do and have no problem with it at all. Just kept in touch with your bank if anything goes wrong or you suspect something.

I've also dealt with identity theft in the amount of tens of thousands of dollars that I had no knowledge of and had to prove it wasn't me doing it. So, I'm a little more paranoid than most people about this. I know other people who have much more serious problems than I ever had with it, so just don't leave anything anywhere and follow up if you apply for credit by mail, etc. That's what happened to me.

If I buy online I always use a credit card instead of debit, to have the bank stand between me and the merchant. I've been saved thousands of dollars of fraud charges that way, even when I thought my purchases were going to a reliable vendor.

That put me off buying online until I started up with Amazon, haven't had any trouble with them. I used to sign up for things in person and allow them to debit my checking, like a health club one time. They went out of business, but kept billing my account.

I made the effort to stop the bill and couldn't reach anyone. They'd contracted my information to a third party who was unreachable and vacuuming out a lot of people's accounts, I later found out. The bank refunded my charges, dispute the charges and they never answered back, so they blocked them.

The ISP thing, of course they know it all, but they may not keep a record, anymore than the phone company did. Or rather, the record would only be kept a short time. For them, it's about billing. But they certainly know where you've been and this will only increase in July of this year as they've agreed to turn over the computer data for those companies who are enforcing copyright. They will kept that data and turn it over just like they would for any legal actions.

The main reason the ISP knows a lot about you (not that they give a damn about what you're doing) is for billing. Our Social Security, phone, bank account numbers, addresses are all in their possession, but it's all mundane and not spying. We have to give that information to get a contracted service.

You have probably looked at the privacy statements that come with your accounts or utility bills like your ISP or cell phone. There are more ways for them to share your information, and less ways to opt out. Car insurance, health insurance, all these things are being taken into account for those who want to buy or rent or get a job. It's a lot of data out there.

And as far as being worried, concern, yes, but don't be afraid too much about this. You can take comfort in the fact that the banks, ISPs, etc. really do work to keep your trust and business. Just be aware that most things are not private, that we don't own these businesses whose services we are using.

Now if the Consumer Protection Agency ever really gets off the ground, which it has had a hard time doing with years of GOP control, and obstruction, you will have more redress, much as we used to until regulations were relaxed so much. Just enjoy the technology, minimize your exposure. continue to be aware. Didn't mean to scare you or anything.

[dipsydoodle]

10. You don't have that problem

with two bean cans and a piece of string. Its technology that's screwing us.

[bathroommonkey76]

11. And don't trust WiFi hotspots around your area.

I have a Wifi Pineapple that I use for penetration testing for college. You wouldn't believe how many computers I have gotten into at Starbucks, Barnes & Noble, and airports. The public are extremely naive when it comes to the security of public wifi.