Would Turkey Be Justified in Kidnapping or Drone-Killing the Turkish Cleric in Pennsylvania?
TURKEYS PRESIDENT RECEP Tayyip Erdogan places the blame for this weekends failed coup attempt on an Islamic preacher and one-time ally, Fethullah Gulen (above), who now resides in Pennsylvania with a green card. Erdogan is demanding the U.S. extradite Gulen, citing prior extraditions by the Turkish government of terror suspects demanded by the U.S.: Now were saying deliver this guy whos on our terrorist list to us. Erdogan has been requesting Gulens extradition from the U.S. for at least two years, on the ground that he has been subverting the Turkish government while harbored by the U.S. Thus far, the U.S. is refusing, with Secretary of State John Kerry demanding of Turkey: Give us the evidence, show us the evidence. We need a solid legal foundation that meets the standard of extradition.
In light of the presence on U.S. soil of someone the Turkish government regards as a terrorist and a direct threat to its national security, would Turkey be justified in dispatching a weaponized drone over Pennsylvania to find and kill Gulen if the U.S. continues to refuse to turn him over, or sending covert operatives to kidnap him? That was the question posed yesterday by Col. Morris Davis, former chief prosecutor of Guantánamos military commissions who resigned in protest over the use of torture-obtained evidence:
That question, of course, is raised by the fact that the U.S. has spent many years now doing exactly this: employing various means including but not limited to drones to abduct and kill people in multiple countries whom it has unilaterally decided (with no legal process) are terrorists or who otherwise are alleged to pose a threat to its national security. Since it cannot possibly be the case that the U.S. possesses legal rights that no other country can claim right? the question naturally arises whether Turkey would be entitled to abduct or kill someone it regards as a terrorist when the U.S. is harboring him and refuses to turn him over.
The only viable objection to Turkeys assertion of this authority would be to claim that the U.S. limits its operations to places where lawlessness prevails, something that is not true of Pennsylvania. But this is an inaccurate description of the U.S.s asserted entitlement. In fact, after 9/11, the U.S. threatened Afghanistan with bombing and invasion unless the Taliban government immediately turned over Osama bin Laden, and the Talibans answer was strikingly similar to what the U.S. just told Turkey about Gulen:
https://theintercept.com/2016/07/18/would-turkey-be-justified-in-kidnapping-or-drone-killing-the-turkish-cleric-in-pennsylvania/
tonyt53
(5,737 posts)citood
(550 posts)But the question is intriguing.
onecaliberal
(32,895 posts)FBaggins
(26,758 posts)Justified, perhaps, but also a stupid idea... since the US is far more powerful and can retaliate for (and likely block) any such attempt.
sabbat hunter
(6,835 posts)we had proof linking OBL to 9-11, there is none with Gulen and the attempted coup.
jakeXT
(10,575 posts)marble falls
(57,208 posts)Igel
(35,356 posts)1. It's a war zone.
2. There's explicit permission given by the controlling authority, i.e., the country's government.
3. There's implicit permission given by the controlling authority, where we launch from that country's airbases as part of an effort that they know about and could easily stop.
A notable exception is the bin Ladin raid. That was a real pickle (mixed pickle, I think) for the Pakistanis because they were officially engaged in a manhunt for him, had said they supported his capture or killing, and then had him found very close to military HQ. They were offended either that it happened, that we knew more than they did, or that we didn't tell them ahead of time. Depends who you interviewed and the time of day you interviewed the person. (Also who did the interviewing. Local sources, Islamist sources, Western sources, secular sources ...)
Nitram
(22,879 posts)brief incursion into the Swat Valley). The Tribal areas where the Taliban and Al Qaeda hide out are off limits, but they are not considered a war zone. And Pakistan does not give explicit (that is "public" permission for every strike.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)I'm still waiting for proof that Gulen had anything to do with this... Nevermind the fact that he's making the classic apples/oranges comparison...
Greenwald little news site would be better served by pretending he's a real journalist for once in his life and finding the real story behind the coup attempt... (Hint: It stinks from multiple directions, but you all know that by now)...
But fuck it -- much, much easier to get his obligatory anti-U.S. shots in while he moves on to something else...