Bernie Sanders Is Not A Socialist

[JudyM]

Democratic Socialism and Social Democracy Are Different Ideologies.
Brett Heinz in Ideas on Dec 8, 2015

Vermont Senator and Presidential Candidate Bernie Sanders has spent quite a bit of time recently defending his brand of "democratic socialism" from those who identify the concept of socialism with the Soviet Union. In a speech where he set out his vision, he described how both FDR's New Deal and Lyndon Johnson's Great Society were both criticized by conservatives as "socialist." In his view, we need to return to these types of progressive policies. By his definition, "democratic socialism means that we must create an economy that works for all, not just the very wealthy" and "that we must reform a political system in America today which is not only grossly unfair but, in many respects, corrupt."

These comparisons are revealing about how both Sanders and many of his followers think of democratic socialism. Just because conservative critics called the policies of FDR and Lyndon Johnson socialist doesn't mean that they actually were. As a matter of fact, many scholars have argued that the New Deal helped FDR in undermining the popularity of actual democratic socialists like Norman Thomas (who won 2.2% of the vote with the Socialist Party of America in the 1932 presidential election), thus preserving America's capitalist system...

...
Today, Bernie Sanders is ... arguing that police departments, fire departments, and public libraries are all "socialist institutions." One will often hear liberals making similar statements about how the highway system is fundamentally socialist, or that countries like Denmark and Sweden are socialist (even when the leaders of said countries say they aren't). This comes from a fundamental misunderstanding of socialism. Liberals, instead of arguing against conservative allegations that many government functions are socialist in nature, decided to accept them instead and then attempt to redefine the word "socialist" to their benefit.

A closer study of political ideology, however, tells us that Bernie Sanders is not a democratic socialist. The only presidential candidate who has accurately identified him is Marco Rubio, who associated his ideas with the ideology of "social democracy." These two ideologies- that of democratic socialists and that of social democrats- share significant historical overlap, but are in fact quite different.


http://theodysseyonline.com/appalachian-state/bernie-sanders-not-socialist/238167

[redstateblues]

1. Socialism would be some heavy baggage

For Bernie to carry in the GE if he makes it that far.

[JudyM]

3. Yes, it seems more un-American than the term social democrat.

Yet, if the author is correct, it would be strange to see a dialogue about this playing out between Bernie and Rubio, with Bernie being being schooled about his terminology.

[safeinOhio]

2. Words?

Neoliberal is not liberal.

[Blue_Tires]

4. Wait...

Exactly what the hell point is this kid trying to make again??

[JudyM]

5. That Bernie is a "Social Democrat" according to definition, not a Socialist. Nt

[Blue_Tires]

9. Which we should care about because??

[JudyM]

11. Alienating a sizable number of voters. Also accuracy.

It's easy to vilify, playing on stereotypes and fear of the unknown. Rethugs will swiftboat anything, as we've seen.

Plus the article lays out the significant distinctions between the terms and from everything I've read it appears to be correct. Google stats show that an enormous number of people have been looking to better understand the term socialism. Bernie's platform is not aligned with that, but instead with social democracy. Better that people read about what his political philosophy actually is, both for accuracy and because more people will connect with social democracy than socialism. We need to win over independents!

[FBaggins]

6. Of course he is

The confusion is in mistaking "socialist" for "communist". The current debate revolves around how much space there is between "socialist" and "democratic socialist"

A closer study of political ideology, however, tells us that Bernie Sanders is not a democratic socialist.

He sure seems to think that he is. Is he lying?

[JudyM]

7. Can't speak to his motivation but why would he lie about it, especially since it's not helpful

to his campaign? I'm wondering if it's an academic knowledge oversight. Which is also hard to conceive of.

[FBaggins]

8. I think we can assume that Bernie understands the difference...

...better than a college sophomore just completing his first poli-sci classes.

I'm a Sanders supporter, but I can't pretend that this won't be an issue in the general (assuming he wins). Whatever you choose to call him, he hasn't been a member of the Democratic party because he's to their left. "Socialist" is really just a label to tell people "we're on the right and the Democrats are on the left and we're both fighting for the center... but he's further left than the Democrats"

Bernie's victory cannot come in people arguing about nuances of words that all mean "farther left than the DNC" - it will come in convincing more Americans that they, too, are to the left of the DNC.

He may be better off saying "Yes, I'm a socialist, and you probably are too"

[JudyM]

10. The distinction centers on *reforming* capitalism to spread its benefits, rather than replacing it

altogether. As I hear Bernie, he is advocating just that, rather than extinguishing capitalism. Wikipedia entries on the topic support the definitions offered in the article.

[NorthCarolina]

12. The media labelled him that thinking it was their Ace in the hole to defeat him, so he owned it.

It's as simple as that. He's creating a movement where "labels" mean squat, and actions (both past and present) mean everything.

[JudyM]

14. Check out post #13, from a socialist DUer's perspective. Nt

[Odin2005]

13. I'm a Bernie supporter but as an actual socialist I am annoyed by his calling himself one.

He's not a socialist, he is basically a modern-day New Dealer. A Social Democrat is OK with Capitalism as long as the worst elements of Capitalist exploitation are eliminated and/or exported to the developing world. A Socialist like myself wants to do away with Capitalism entirely.

Trying to create a "kinder, gentler Capitalism" will always fail in the end.

[Douglas Carpenter]

15. Considering that Tony Blair calls himself a socialist - Sen. Sanders

is more of a socialist than that. He is as much a socialist as the mainstream "socialist" parties of Europe. Some of them also prefer the term "social-democrat." But many such as the traditional British Labour Party still prefer the term "socialist." Words do evolve in their definitions.

[JudyM]

16. Agreed, though the term socialist still excludes a capitalist approach, which Bernie embraces.

There's bleed-through to some extent but still, that seems like a remaining bright line, don't you think?

[cannabis_flower]

17. Something interesting is that...

Texas was a hot-bed of socialism during the early 20th century.

http://peoplesworld.org/no-texas-is-not-all-about-bush-lone-star-state-has-proud-socialist-past/

[JudyM]

18. That is interesting. Pity how times have changed. Nt