Ukrainian soldiers cross border into Russia

[Omaha Steve]

Source: AP-EXCITE

By LAURA MILLS

MOSCOW (AP) — A Russian border security official said Monday that more than 400 Ukrainian soldiers have crossed into Russia, although both sides gave conflicting accounts as to why they had decided to cross the border.

The Russian official said the soldiers deserted the Kiev government and the Russian side opened a safe corridor. A Ukrainian military official, who did not give a number for the soldiers involved, were forced into Russian territory by rebel fire after running out of ammunition.

Pro-Russian separatists in eastern Ukraine have been battling the Kiev government since April, a conflict that has claimed at least 1,129 civilian casualties, according to a U.N. estimate. Ukraine and Western countries have accused Russia of providing the rebels with equipment and expertise, a claim that the Russian government has repeatedly denied.

The West has also accused Russia of most likely providing the insurgents with surface-to-air missiles that may have been used to shoot down a Malaysia Airlines passenger jet over rebel-held territory on July 17, killing all 298 people on board.

FULL story at link.



A man walks past a pro-Russian rebels army's agitation poster, left, in the city of Donetsk, eastern Ukraine, Monday, Aug. 4, 2014. The poster reads 'Protect the Republic!'. (AP Photo/Dmitry Lovetsky)


Read more: http://apnews.excite.com/article/20140804/eu-ukraine-68cc8b1f99.html

[daleo]

1. Both explanations seem a bit contrived

I can't imagine 400 Ukrainian soldiers deserting and defecting, unless they were troops local to the area, of ambivalent loyalties. But then, you would expect them to just join the rebels.

As for Ukrainian troops fleeing rebels, and escaping across the Russian border to do so, that seems awfully desperate, given the assumption that the rebels are supplied by and abetted by the Russian military. From the frying pan into the fire. But if your life is in peril...

Maybe the truth will come out in a few days.

[bemildred]

2. Yeah.

Interesting that we have Ukrainian forces under duress seeking refuge in Russia.

[ColesCountyDem]

3. Neither explanation passes the 'smell test'. n/t

[DeSwiss]

4. If you can't feed, cloth nor equip your army.....

...I doubt if they'll stay.

- I'm no expert, but it seems reasonable......

K&R

[Igel]

5. There's a third narrative.

They were low on ammo and Grad fire kept them from moving in nearly any other direction--or being resupplied. The only recourse was the retreat across the border.

The Grad fire, they said, was coming from Russia. It's sort of a PR coup for Russia, and follows after a couple smaller such "desertions" (in which the soldiers promptly returned to Ukraine).

This makes no sense, of course. Until you look at the border and realize that it's got such a strange shape that you can fire 90 degrees across the border and hem people in between the strip you're covering by fire and the border. It's sort of a little rectangle that juts into Russia. It's been the target of a lot of hostile fire from both sides (with video showing Grad fire from the Russian side).

It used to be a major resupply point for the rebels. They want it back. It's hard to resupply the southern flank if the tanks and other armor has to go north, cut across the river, and then take back roads back to the main highway.

Snegir'yov, an activist with an informant network in LPR-territory, claims that they've gone to using railroad transportation for troops and arms. The greater the Ukr gains, the more Russia "deescalates".

The current "fear" in the Ukr press is an old one resurrected. With the appearance of armored vehicles and trucks labelled "peacekeepers", the suspicion is that Russia's seeking some hint of approval for a peacekeeping force. It's asked the UN for one, it's tried to say that the various agreements signed have validity for unilateral enforcement by Russia, it's trying to get Yanukovich declared to be the only legitimate leader of Ukraine, it's trying for humanitarian excuses ("genocide" is all the rage), repeatedly claims of use of weapons illegal under international law (for use in international military conflicts). Otherwise the reports are wondering why there are all these engineering units with mobile pontoon bridges building up in one particular part of the border. A part that just happens to be delineated along a smallish river. Russia just says "air force exercises."

Could just be "big brotherly intimidation" and "friendly bullying" that the Great Russians seem to enjoy so much. Or just desensitization prior to a repeat of Russia's 1939 unilateral invasion of Poland. (Or the same with the Baltics.)

[amandabeech]

9. Your narrative seems to make the most sense.

There certainly are twists and turns in the border, and it would be possible to get cut off and "marched back" by russian misssils and artillery fire.

When the Israel/Gaza situation calms down, and it looks like it might, perhaps more news organizations will refocus on Ukraine. I really would like to see some of the better foreign correspondents on the ground in Eastern Ukraine.

[DeSwiss]

10. That sounds like a very militarily thought-out explanation....

I commend you on its apparent logic, even though I have no way of judging it. However it doesn't explain why the Ukrainian government setup a website where the Ukrainian people can purchase needed army supplies directly through public donation? A sort of Amazon.com of war suppliers.

- But which money oddly, isn't reaching the suppliers nor the troops. And the people are getting pissed......

[roamer65]

6. Looks like an old Soviet poster.

[reorg]

7. encircled, no ammunition, no fuel, no food

Lack of ammunition, food, fuel and clear orders from the command on how to act in the condition of encirclement has made the Ukrainian troops cross the border, Major Vitaly Dubinyak, a battalion commander, told Itar-Tass news agency.

“For two weeks, we were fighting back without ammunition and fuel. I didn’t have the opportunity to feed my men for almost two weeks. We even ran out of first strike ration. The personnel were more exhausted by despair than by the actual shelling,” Dubinyak said.

“Other than giving us a command to ‘hold on,’ Kiev provided us with no other assistance. And during the last week, they’ve aborted all communication. They’ve simply given up on us,” he added.

http://rt.com/news/177956-kiev-abandons-ukrainian-soldiers/

The 72nd Brigade for all intents and purposes has ceased to exist due to ammunition and food rations running out. They held on while they still had resources and then began to exit into the territory of the Russian Federation – at first in separate groups, followed by the surviving remnants of the once full-fledged brigade.

[davidpdx]

8. RT Headline: Ukraine Illegally Invades Russian Sovereign Territory

Wouldn't that just be fitting.

Are those phone numbers to rat out your neighbors? How red of them.