Germans probe 2nd spy case reportedly involving US

[Omaha Steve]

Source: AP-Excite

By FRANK JORDANS

BERLIN (AP) — German authorities are investigating a second spy case reportedly involving the United States, a week after the arrest of a German intelligence employee cast a new shadow over relations between the two countries.

Federal prosecutors said Wednesday that police raided properties in the Berlin area on "initial suspicion of activity for an intelligence agency." They did not elaborate or specify what intelligence agency was involved, but said they had not made an arrest.

"We have investigations in two cases of suspected espionage, a very serious suspicion," government spokesman Steffen Seibert later told reporters in Berlin. He declined to provide further details, citing the ongoing investigations.

The daily Sueddeutsche Zeitung reported, without naming sources, that the man being investigated worked at Germany's Defense Ministry and is suspected of spying for the U.S. News website Spiegel Online reported, also without naming sources, that the man worked in a department dealing with international security policy and had aroused the suspicion of Germany's military counter-intelligence agency because of his close contacts to alleged U.S. spies.

FULL story at link.



The German defense ministry is pictured through a fence in Berlin, Germany, Wednesday, July 9, 2014. German authorities are investigating a second spy case reportedly involving the U.S., a week after the arrest of a German intelligence employee cast a new shadow over relations between the two countries. The daily Sueddeutsche Zeitung reported, without naming sources, that the man being investigated worked at Germany's Defense Ministry and is suspected of spying for the United States. Defense Ministry spokesman Lt. Col. Uwe Roth declined to confirm the reports, but said the case fell "into the ministry's area of responsibility" and that Defense Minister Ursula von der Leyen had been informed. (AP Photo/dpa, Maurizio Gambarini)


Read more: http://apnews.excite.com/article/20140709/eu--germany-us-spying-6dbebc5f4b.html

[Fred M]

1. Do. Not. Mess. With. The Germans.

Theirs is one economy that isn't going to crash, and we may very well need that. Soon!

[cosmicone]

2. The first spy they captured is obviously singing like a canary

and may end up giving the whole network to the Germans.

[JDPriestly]

3. Who is in charge in our government?

The Suddeutsche Zeitung reports that Obama appears to have been in the dark about the existence of the spies in Germany.

Obama and Merkel (and while we are at it, her first name, Angela, is pronounced a bit like, on-gay-la) spoke on Thursday of last week about Ukraine, but this spy never came up. Yet the suspect, perhaps the first one, appeared before a judge on the day of the call. The article suggests that he appeared as the call was taking place.

Angela Merkel did not mention the judicial proceeding during the call although she probably knew of it since the suspected spy was arrested the previous day.

(My translation of the following German.)

In a discussion with the New York Times, an unnamed member of the White House
staff suggested that they are angry because the CIA did not keep the White House in the picture.

"Im Gespräch mit der New York Times erklären anonyme Mitarbeiter aus dem Weißen Haus, sie seien verärgert, weil die CIA sie nicht ins Bild gesetzt habe."

http://www.sueddeutsche.de/politik/obamas-unwissen-in-spionage-affaere-gefaehrlicher-brandschutz-im-weissen-haus-1.2038360

The Suddeutsche Zeitung suggests that the president is protected by a firewall from learning certain embarrassing things.

That is very troubling to me. It sounds like the CIA and the NSA are running our foreign policy to the embarrassment and loss of the country without even bothering to tell our President what they are doing.

Has there been some sort of silent coup? Is all the secrecy a way to cover it up? When did it happen if it happened? Gradually over a period of many years? Were the Nixon revelations just a bump in the road for these overzealous, power-hungry people? What has happened since Nixon? Did Reagan, in an Alzheimer's haze just give the control of our foreign policy over to secret groups in the government and our country?

Was there more to Benghazi? Was the CIA doing something the White House and the State Department and Congress did not know anything about? This story about the spy in Germany and Obama's ignorance of it even after the affair about the tapping of Angela Merkel's home phone raises a lot of questions.

Another good source for news from the German-speaking world. There are several others. There is also Die Presse. Die Presse and Der Standard are Austrian papers. There is also the Frankfurter Allegemeine (http://www.faz.net/) and of course Der Spiegel.

http://derstandard.at/2000002885254/Deutschland-hat-einen-zweiten-US-Spion-im-Visier

[jakeXT]

4. The same old problems

The very word "secrecy" is repugnant in a free and open society; and we are as a people inherently and historically opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths and to secret proceedings. We decided long ago that the dangers of excessive and unwarranted concealment of pertinent facts far outweighed the dangers which are cited to justify it. Even today, there is little value in opposing the threat of a closed society by imitating its arbitrary restrictions. Even today, there is little value in insuring the survival of our nation if our traditions do not survive with it. And there is very grave danger that an announced need for increased security will be seized upon by those anxious to expand its meaning to the very limits of official censorship and concealment. That I do not intend to permit to the extent that it is in my control. And no official of my Administration, whether his rank is high or low, civilian or military, should interpret my words here tonight as an excuse to censor the news, to stifle dissent, to cover up our mistakes or to withhold from the press and the public the facts they deserve to know.

http://www.jfklibrary.org/Research/Research-Aids/JFK-Speeches/American-Newspaper-Publishers-Association_19610427.aspx

[JDPriestly]

5. Have you heard or read the rest of the speech?

If I remember correctly, it does not so strongly support openness.

But Kennedy's assassination, the investigation into it and the many doubts and conspiracy theories about the truth regarding that assassination strongly support an argument that excessive secrecy is dividing our country and sowing unhealthy distrust in leadership of all kinds.

[Xolodno]

6. I'm reminded of a movie called Independence Day.....

Quote: President: Why wasn't I informed about this? Response: Plausible Deni-ability.

Real question is, how much do other nations view the President with "Plausible Deni-ability" and how does that factor in their negotiations.

[JDPriestly]

7. Yes. There is a problem when the president is not informed about what is going on in foreign

intelligence gathering and policy. Our allies cannot depend that what he or she says is informed and reliable. That puts our nation at a disadvantage.

Our president may be sincere and intelligent and may give his word. But does his word matter. Does he even really know what our intelligence agency is doing?

Who is in charge?

And to what extent can a president move into the White House and move the moles from the previous administration out?