49er fan sues NFL for $50M over playoff tickets

[alp227]

Source: AP

RENO, Nev. (AP) — John E. Williams III has been a San Francisco 49ers fan since John Brodie was throwing touchdown passes at Candlestick Park in the 1970s. So he was excited about the prospects of scoring a ticket to make the trip to Seattle in January to watch the rivals battle in the NFC Championship Game.

But the Las Vegas man says in a $50 million lawsuit against the NFL that his hopes were dashed by the league and others he accuses of engaging in "economic discrimination" with an illegal ticket policy limiting credit-card sales to selected pro-Seattle markets. His lawsuit filed in U.S. District Court in Las Vegas says it was part of an effort to keep 49er fans away and further promote the Seahawks' boisterous home-field advantage at CenturyLink Field.

"They're always boasting up there about their 12th player and everything else," Williams told The Associated Press on Friday. "But by allowing the NFL to decide who can or cannot attend the games, you make it an unfair game. Seattle fixed it."

Williams, who works as a promoter in the entertainment industry, said that because the NFL relies heavily on public subsidies and money from taxpayers to build stadiums. it should not be allowed to deny ticket sales to individuals on the basis they are "not from an area determined by the team — or the NFL — to be fan of that team."

Read more: http://pro32.ap.org/article/49er-fan-sues-nfl-50m-over-playoff-tickets

[lumberjack_jeff]

1. Which taxpayers... specificially... built Centurylink Field?

Once those taxpayers have purchased all the tickets in their stadium that they wish to, those left over should go to anyone else.

[jmowreader]

10. That would be the taxpayers that don't live in San Francisco

And those taxpayers don't seem to have much of a problem packing the Clink to the rafters.

[Xithras]

11. I can see a potential 14th Amendment issue in that argument.

The 14th amendment says that all American citizens, not taxpayers, have to be treated equally. If this is truly a taxpayer funded resource, then denying citizens access to an otherwise public venue may indeed be a violation of Equal Protection. I haven't read the suit itself, but it will be interesting to see if this guys arguments go anywhere.

Interestingly, by the way, this kind of discrimination would be flat-out illegal in California. Under the terms of the Unruh Civil Rights Act, any business discriminating against a person merely based on their address can be shut down by the state, fined by the government, and sued civilly by everyone impacted by the ban. I get that Washington is probably a bit backward compared to California when it comes to these types of civil rights issues, but the Unruh Act probably explains why Californian's are so quick to sue over this sort of thing.

[yeoman6987]

26. That is federal not state

I actually like the idea of making sure the home team population has first pick. Why allow people in other states get the first pick.....we would really have the 1 percenters going to the games then and the welder who contributed to the community gets shut out.

[Xithras]

28. Last I checked, the Constitution applied to all levels of government.

States can't regulate the press any more than the fed's can. And Equal Protection cases have a long history of enforcement at the state level.

I'm not actually sure that Equal Protection would apply in this case because the tickets were sold by a private third party, and the argument that private businesses have to comply with Equal Protection guidelines if they operate in taxpayer subsidized facilities isn't exactly established. But if the subsidies DO qualify the Super Bowl as a "government sponsored event", the state/federal delineation would not really matter the case.

[groundloop]

2. Good luck with that....

There's a lot wrong with the NFL, with it's tax exempt status being at the top of the list. But this suit has zero chance.

[olddad56]

3. probably not the first frivolous lawsuit ever filed.

[laurent]

9. Lawsuits per 100,000 people by country.

Australia...... 1,542

Canada........ 1,450

Japan.......... 1,768

France......... 2,416

U.K. or
England....... 3,681

USA............ 5,806

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&frm=1&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CDQQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.law.harvard.edu%2Fprograms%2Folin_center%2Fpapers%2Fpdf%2FRamseyer_681.pdf&ei=8ptdU77yCMGBPcS1gNAP&usg=AFQjCNEO7QwIUcjI_F9iBABw6GwOEgK7lw&bvm=bv.65397613,d.ZWU

[greiner3]

19. And your point is.........................................................

[alp227]

20. Welcome to DU.

Fixing your link: http://www.law.harvard.edu/programs/olin_center/papers/pdf/Ramseyer_681.pdf

[laurent]

30. Merci. (no message)

[LanternWaste]

27. Probably not the first time a person pretended to know what was or was not a frivolous lawsuit.

Probably not the first time a person pretended to know what was or was not a frivolous lawsuit.

[unblock]

4. if anything, the public funding would suggest that they *should* discriminate against non-taxpayers

i'm not taking a view on the overall case, but i don't see how public funding provided by the city of seattle and/or the state of washington makes a compelling argument that people from san francisco should shouldn't have limited access.


if the nfl really benefited from federal tax breaks, the this would be a much better argument. but that isn't really the case. the federal tax breaks are trivial compared to state and local tax breaks:

http://www.ctj.org/taxjusticedigest/archive/2014/02/does_the_nfl_need_a_billion_do.php#.U12RGvldV8E

On the federal level, there has been a lot of attention paid to a push by Senator Tom Coburn to remove the NFL's (and other sports associations’) tax exempt status, which he claims allows the league to receive millions in unwarranted tax breaks. In truth, the tax exempt status only applies to the league's organizing entity, which actually reported losses in recent years and is not currently being utilized as a "tax avoidance mechanism" according to tax experts.

Even if changing its status would cause the league to pay some additional taxes in the future, this amount will be a pittance compared to how much it receives in tax breaks from state and local governments, where the real tax avoidance is taking place.

[tularetom]

5. There is no question that what he is alleging took place

But he'll have a hard time proving damages.

[tarheelsunc]

12. Unless he's a scalper, but that would bring bigger problems upon himself. eom

[LeftyMom]

24. Ticket scalping is legal in CA as long as you don't do it at the venue.

And I've never even seen that provision enforced. Hell, I've bought tickets from scalpers and sold them my extras with cops standing right there, both at Candlestick and at AT&T (though they were outside the lot on Jamestown and on the third street sidewalk, respectively, which might be just over the line of police interest.)

[Mr.Bill]

6. Even if he's right,

I don't see how missing a football game is worth 50 million dollars. When people sue for ridiculous sums like this, it makes their whole premise sound frivolous. At least to me, anyway.

[muriel_volestrangler]

7. While the amount is ridiculous, I can see his point about the restricted states and provinces

If city or state money have supported the team (eg in the stadium), then you might be able to justify giving residents from there priority. But why should someone from Hawaii, or Alberta, be able to buy tickets when someone from Nevada can't?

[Bigredhunk]

8. It was bullshit that SEA did this (shouldn't be allowed by the league)

But a big $$ lawsuit is dumb as hell.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

18. Denver did the same with the AFC championship game

[Bigredhunk]

21. It's bullshit that they did it too

At your home stadium, you're obviously going to have a majority of the fans be for you. Gaming the system so fans of the opposing team can't buy tix (if their billing address is in another state) is ridiculous.

I think it's really funny from Seattle's perspective, given how much they brag about their "12th man." If your fans are so great, you shouldn't need to cheat to stack the deck more in your favor.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

22. Please read my post below about the NFC championship game

SF fans were not shut out.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

13. Sports teams do this all the time

Off the top of my head, the Washington Capitals will not take ticket orders from certain cities, specifically whom they are playing in the playoffs.

[rep the dems]

16. The Nats started doing the same thing before they even made the playoffs.

Got tired of Phillies fans (like myself) making the park our own until they realized they needed our money

[rep the dems]

14. This guy takes "sore loser" to a whole new level

Thinks his team lost because there weren't enough Niners fans there (even if he'd gotten to go he'd be completely outnumbered) and now wants 50 million dollars for it? Oy...

[chknltl]

15. Regarding Seahawks Stadium and a possible lawsuit

Dennis Miller, (yeah THAT Dennis Miller*), suggested that patrons attending games at our stadium could consider seeking damages for hearing loss. I don't know if any hearing loss suffered at one of our games has the potential for permanency and it is not like everyone doesn't already know before they choose to attend the game about our 12th Man's reputation for getting LOUD. Maybe Dennis Miller is on to something or maybe he is just on something, (the way he and his assistant host giggle live constantly suggests the latter), regarding a lawsuit directed at Seahawks Promoters.

*(No I am NOT a fan of Dennis Miller. If it were up to me Dennis Miller's received trickle down economics would come as a golden shower. The only reason I am aware of his lawsuit proposal against the Seahawks Promoters is that for a while I had no access to any TV or internet and the ONLY media I had access to was in the form of a radio channel that gave me Stephanie Miller, Dennis Miller, Thom Hartmann and then some other conservative goon. Their idea of 'fair and balanced' I suppose)

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

17. Denver did the same thing with the AFC finals game

Seattle has a waiting list for season tickets. Season ticket holders are given first chance to buy playoff tickets. There are maybe 2000 tickets left after that. There was nothing preventing this guy from buying tickets on the secondary market. I was at that game. There were many 49er fans in the crowd.

Seriously even if he has a case which I doubt there's no way in hell he's due $50 million in damages.

[LeftyMom]

23. I think Seattle didn't want people who know better calling bullshit on their piped in fan noise.

at their oh-so-devoted fans who just got distracted from soccer or whatever three seasons ago, when their team quit sucking.

[Blue_Tires]

29. seriously?

[dembotoz]

25. when demand is greater than the seat count folks get disappointed--simple math

you can not put 13 eggs in a 12 egg carton