Stolen passports on missing Malaysian passenger jet
Source: Irish Times
...snip...
Italys foreign ministry said today that an Italian man whose name was listed as being on board the Boeing 777 is travelling in Thailand and was not on the plane. A foreign ministry official confirmed Italian reports that an Italian national had reported his passport stolen last August.
Italian news agency Ansa said he called home after hearing reports that an Italian with his name was on board the missing aircraft.
Austrian foreign ministry spokesman confirmed that a name listed on the manifest matches an Austrian passport reported stolen two years ago in Thailand but he would not confirm the identity.
Read more: http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/asia-pacific/stolen-passports-on-missing-malaysian-passenger-jet-1.1717931
JimDandy
(7,318 posts)Abukhatar
(90 posts)Curious about your karma comment
JimDandy
(7,318 posts)and using it to board a doomed plane... unless I misunderstood the reporting.
Eta: Yup, the obvious implication, that the persons with the stolen passports caused the disaster, went right over my head.
Eta2: BBC is reporting that surveillance cameras captured images of the passengers with the two stolen passports, that they purchased their tickets at the same airline counter, and that the tickets had consecutive numbers.
MADem
(135,425 posts)Here's your faked passport, I will give it to you at a discount if you just take this package to my uncle for me....
but less likely, because the passports were stolen separately, many months apart from travelers of different nationalities.
Cleita
(75,480 posts)That wooshing sound was the missing connection flying right over my head.
barbtries
(28,811 posts)there would have been communications to that effect prior to the plane going down?
Cleita
(75,480 posts)immediately to the public, so we don't know. It could be that there was a target in mind if they hijacked the airplane, but the passengers took them down and the airplane crashed in the ocean instead. So many scenarios and so little information.
question everything
(47,534 posts)and there were reports that as the plane was diving, the captain said Allah Akbar (God is Great, in Arabic).
After the 9/11 attacks, all of a sudden this made sense.
But no one ever claimed responsibility for this.
MRadtke
(6 posts)Wikipedia article about flight 990:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EgyptAir_Flight_990
question everything
(47,534 posts)I obviously did not remember all the details, only the general information and I remembered how, after 9/11 we thought - aha.
EX500rider
(10,856 posts)"I rely on God." Which he repeated 7 times till he flew the plane into the ocean.
question everything
(47,534 posts)and how, after 9/11, it made more sense.
Gore1FL
(21,151 posts)I suppose it would provide a way to get past a no-fly list.
It also makes me wonder how many stolen passports are typically on such flights. For all I know, 2 might be average.
CJCRANE
(18,184 posts)or false or stolen passports may not be on the lists.
There always seem to be loopholes.
flamingdem
(39,321 posts)to fly on stolen passports?
They should have been invalidated.
FBaggins
(26,757 posts)Likely when they tried to contact the familes of the people onboard. Some mother said "he can't be dead... he just ordered seconds of my pot roast!" (or whatever the Malaysian equivelent is)
On edit - My mistake. Reportedly at least one of them was reported missing in August.
whopis01
(3,523 posts)jsr
(7,712 posts)AngryAmish
(25,704 posts)ChairmanAgnostic
(28,017 posts)Cleita
(75,480 posts)Wasn't there an episode where a passenger plane disappears without a trace, but was actually transported back in time to one of the dinosaur ages?
hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)totodeinhere
(13,059 posts)MADem
(135,425 posts)If this is terrorism, we'll be back to the "gate rape" days again in no time.
If the plane is missing, perhaps the passengers fought back...?
FBaggins
(26,757 posts)Probably need to plan on an extra hour or two for security and sacrifice my best nail clippers.
MADem
(135,425 posts)Bring as little as possible in the carry on--maybe a pair of drawers and a change of clothes, and keep the liquids in the plastic zip lock bag to a minimum, if at all. Tablets are easier than laptops--laptops have to be taken out and get inspected, tablets can just go through. Don't forget socks on your feet (because people do have athlete's foot) and slip on shoes, because the shoes are coming off if you're under seventy five!
I always wear stuff that has no metal, nothing to set off any detectors. During the Bush years, I either sent stuff ahead via a parcel service, or checked everything.
Enjoy Italy, even with the issues they're having with us lately. The food is to die for, really!
christx30
(6,241 posts)boots with zip up sides. Takes me 15 seconds to put them on.
But, yes to everything you said. There are ways to streamline your trip through security.
Beacool
(30,251 posts)Her underwire bra kept setting off the machine. I made a personal note to self: no underwire bras when flying. LOL!!!
MADem
(135,425 posts)Nothing like having strangers waving objects at a personal area of one's physique and having those noises go off so everyone LOOOOOKS!
Gaaah!
I hope this isn't a terrorist event...I just don't want to return to those suitcase tossing days.
Beacool
(30,251 posts)They took her aside and a woman patted down her boobies.
MADem
(135,425 posts)I've gotten the "full court press" myself--it's not fun. That's why I dress like one of those old mall walkers, in the sweat pants and hoodie and tee shirt--nothing to set off any alarms. I don't care if I look like a fashion victim, it beats getting the "gate rape" treatment (a term I learned from a flight crew--they can't stand it when they have to go through the full checks because that's a LOT of radiation over the course of a work year, but they don't particularly care for the fondling, either).
They have the ability to use electronic "noses" to sniff out illnesses--why can't they do the same thing with explosives? That will probably be the future, but I wish they'd hurry up and get to it...so long as the electronic nose doesn't jump on you like a retriever and burrow that nose where it doesn't belong....!!
Beacool
(30,251 posts)I travel several times throughout the year (both domestic and foreign). The whole thing is a major headache. We can thank the terrorists for the intrusions. I'm also not keen on turbulence. It didn't use to bother me much, now it does.
dionysus
(26,467 posts)Beacool
(30,251 posts)You think I can surround myself with them when the plane starts to shake? It can get scary.
Thank you for the lovely bankie.
dionysus
(26,467 posts)Beacool
(30,251 posts)CTyankee
(63,912 posts)then connecting to Florence.
Where in Italy will you be going?
FBaggins
(26,757 posts)Flying in to Rome, but driving from there to San Gimignano with day trips to Pisa/Sienna/Assissi... then back to Rome to meet the rest of the family group for ten days (with day trips all over)... then a couple days each in Venice & Florence... and a Med cruise with a Naples stop before flying back the middle of next month.
Make sure you have an extra day of clothing in your carryon... Alitalia lost our bags on connecting flights more than once over the years but has always gotten it to us a day or so later.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)my flights.
Your trip sounds lovely! Mine is less ambitious...just Tuscany with a small group of art lovers on the Piero della Francesca Trail...based in Anghiari, going to San Sepulcro, Arezzo, Monterchi where Piero painted in the 15th century...all medieval towns. Not much tourism in that little part of eastern Tuscany...
Beacool
(30,251 posts)I'm jealous. Have a wonderful time.
CTyankee
(63,912 posts)pangaia
(24,324 posts)Now I know where you will be... All the time..
Eh he he he....
But you will never know if I am watching....
Eh he he....
ChairmanAgnostic
(28,017 posts)hidden structural problems?
North Korea shooting a really long missile?
Aliens leaving their Pacific underwater base, without checking the traffic overhead?
MADem
(135,425 posts)There was no cockpit MAYDAY, either.
It's a curious situation. I feel for the families of those passengers; the news will likely not be good.
BeyondGeography
(39,379 posts)I do have a bad feeling about this. Blown up over the ocean where clues will be hard to come by. Gate rape, the sequel, will be the result if the worst is true.
MADem
(135,425 posts)dear old grandma" story, and the suitcase was made of/contained an explosive material.
Obviously the crew didn't even have time to shout Mayday--it was a catastrophic experience. Those poor people.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)I've flown back and forth between Korean and the US three times and have never had any problem. The lone exception was when I broke my ankle two weeks before flying to the US and had to wear a "boot". I actually volunteered to sit down and take it off and most of the time they didn't make me.
MADem
(135,425 posts)I was on the "Fuck With This One" list during the entire Bush administration.
I fly often enough in a given year, and I never was able to fly after Nahn Wun Wun without getting the full court press. It was psychologically exhausting, it was deliberate, and it never--not even once--failed to happen. If I was flying, I was getting harassed. I'd use my retired military ID card as ID, that didn't make a difference. I was "on the list" and Fuck Me Very Much!
Shortly after Obama took office, I approached the ticket counter to get my ticket (because I could never print out a ticket or get one at a kiosk--that just wasn't "on" for me, so I stopped trying), prepared for the sidelong look, the "Unnnnnnh....wait just a minute...." and then the issuance of the "different" ticket with the huge letters/checkerboard/red coloring/other markings that indicated "CRIMINAL!! DANGEROUS!!! BAAAAD!!!" and was issued my "regular" ticket with ... no bullshit.
I stood there, shocked, for a moment. When you're in "gird your loins" mode and nothing happens, it can be stupefying!
I went through the first level of security, and got "Have a nice day." I thought I'd fallen through the looking glass! When I reached the "Stand By And Get Molested" area, I thought, "Oh, they'll get me here--this is probably just a 'lighter touch' by the new administration," and through I went, without a hitch. No one noticed me, pulled me aside, asked me questions...nothing!
Since then I've started travelling with a carry-on again (I stopped doing it because they'd toss the thing and leave my stuff all over the place, and I could never quickly pack it back properly). I fly more, too. I probably drove a couple of dozen times during the Bush regime when I otherwise would have flown, just because I hated the experience at the gate.
I don't know why I was put on the list (I have suspicions, but I don't "know" and I don't know why I was taken off, but I do know that it sucked when I was on it.
uppityperson
(115,679 posts)louis-t
(23,297 posts)I don't even wanna think about who they were sold to.
amandabeech
(9,893 posts)China claims that the attack was committed by a group of Uiygers (sp), Muslims from western China that the Chinese government has been trying to minimize or wipe out similar to what it has been doing in Tibet.
I'm wondering if the knife attack and now the airplane crash are related.
Redford
(373 posts)I wonder if it is terrorism will the truth be told or will it be kept hush-hush to keep the terrorists from getting credit.
brooklynite
(94,727 posts)Renew Deal
(81,871 posts)Religion has been no boundary for violence.
hack89
(39,171 posts)amandabeech
(9,893 posts)and as other posters have pointed out, Muslims are victims of terrorist attacks throughout central Asia and the Middle East.
Religious crazies are, in fact, crazy, no matter which version of God they worship.
They give all decent, reasonable people of faith a bad name.
And I believe that many people of faith are decent and reasonable.
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)Unless these so-called "good Christians" are members of State Legislatures in AZ, ND, SD, TN, KY, PA, OR, WI, IL, MI, KS, OK, TX, MS, AL, GA, FL, NC, SC, OH, CA, UT, CO, MO, WY, ... trying to ram their phony "religious liberty" down on everybody with their heinous "Right to Discriminate" bills.
Some might want you to believe that Christians aren't all like that, but facts, history, and Christians' past misdeeds say otherwise...
seveneyes
(4,631 posts)If this airplane mishap turns out to be terrorism, I wonder what the odds are it was Christians performing the acts of terror?
What percentage of recent terrorist activities have been Christian?
Agschmid
(28,749 posts)But it's a stretch at this point to assume anything.
amandabeech
(9,893 posts)I'm not saying that this terrible incident was terrorism, but with the world what it is today, I don't think that it can be ruled out.
I look forward to hearing that this was a tragic equipment failure, rather than a terrorist attack.
cosmicone
(11,014 posts)Air India 182 from Montreal to Delhi via London was lost in the sky near the coast of Ireland. Cause? Bomb planted by Sikh terrorists. (June 23, 1985)
Pan Am 103 - a 747 from London to JFK was lost over Lockerbie, Scotland. Cause? Bomb planted by Libyan/Syrian agents. (December 21, 1988)
EgyptAir 990 from Los Angeles to NY to Cairo was lost over the Atlantic on October 31, 1999. Cause? Apparently a severely distressed and psychotic first officer purposely ditched the plane when the pilot left to use the restroom.
Air France 447 - An Airbus A340 was lost over the Atlantic on a flight from Rio de Janeiro to Paris. Cause? Pilot error in the face of catastrophic weather. Distress signals were received.
On both AI182 and PA103 cockpit voice recorders, there was normal chatter followed by a sudden silence. The planes were blown up to bits in mid-air and no one could even react.
Since in this particular case, no distress signals were received at all, probability of it being a terrorist act is very high. Actually, I'd venture a guess that it is a terrorist act unless proven otherwise. The Sikh terrorists in the Air India case were trained by a certain intelligence agency of a terrorist country that tries to pretend it is civilized. The same agency's hand has been slapped by the Chinese a few times for providing help to the Uighurs (pronounced "weeger"s).
The days of stolen passports will be over now. Each passport will contain biometric data that will be mandatorily matched wherever the passport is presented to officials of any country.
Cleita
(75,480 posts)we flew over the ocean a lot instead of overland. Since I had a fear of drowning, I questioned the adults who made me do this. They told me that if we crashed it was safer to crash in water and that's why our seats were also flotation devices.
It seems I was lied to.
cosmicone
(11,014 posts)A random water landing is probably safer than landing on a non-runway but only if done skillfully at the right velocity with the right orientation of the plane, in generally calm water and with help nearby. The Sully Sullenberger landing in the Hudson was textbook and everyone survived. I doubt they would have survived landing over an ocean of there were 6' or more waves.
Cleita
(75,480 posts)spill in the Sully/Hudson landing. If in fact that oil spill discovered off Vietnam was from the airline crash wouldn't that cast suspicion on a bomb going off in air before a crash?
whopis01
(3,523 posts)No wide body aircraft has survived a water landing. 50 out 175 survived the flight 961 crash - but that's the only wide body water landing with survivors ever.
cosmicone
(11,014 posts)it is preferable with better odds than say landing on 5th Avenue or in Yosemite.
MADem
(135,425 posts)Beacool
(30,251 posts)I think that unless they can prove a catastrophic mechanical failure, it more likely than not, was a terrorist attack.
Those poor people.
jtuck004
(15,882 posts)I bet we don't stop all of them. And there are thousands of other places with varying security around the world.
It might seem more surprising if there wasn't one, and I suspect on a purely statistical basis that a couple probably pop up on international flights periodically.
Could be something else, but I don't see even a couple of people going up just so they can drop a plane unseen into the ocean without any marketing for their cause.
Could have been a bomb of course, but something shipped incorrectly that blew up (like oxygen in what should have been empty canisters that start a fire) could do this too.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)One would think if it was that those responsible for it would be wanting to claim a "victory" for their cause. Then again, I don't think it would be a good thing to piss off China.
uppityperson
(115,679 posts)"Only a handful of countries worldwide are taking care to make sure that persons possessing stolen passports are not boarding international flights," Interpol Secretary General Ronald Noble said Sunday. His organization confirmed that at least two stolen passports were used to board missing flight MH370, which lost contact with air traffic control shortly after leaving Malaysia's capital, Kuala Lumpur, en route to Beijing.
Interpol said no country has made any checks on those passports since they were reported stolen in Thailand an Austrian one in 2012 and an Italian one in 2013 adding it's unable to say how many other times they might have been used.
"It is too soon to speculate about any connection between these stolen passports and the missing plane," Noble said. Yet he said their use is a "great concern" and should prompt countries and airlines to check Interpol's data before allowing passengers to board.
seveneyes
(4,631 posts)That might cause an airline to lose a ticket sale! But yes, all passport checks should bounce the unique passport number off the central database before allowing it. What good is a database if it's not used!
uppityperson
(115,679 posts)jsr
(7,712 posts)Missing Malaysia jet: Passenger with stolen passport identified
By Barbara Demick and Julie Makinen
March 10, 2014, 3:56 a.m.
BEIJING -- Malaysian authorities have identified one of the two men who used stolen passports to board the missing Malaysia Airlines jet, the nations inspector general of police told local media Monday, as international search teams continued to look -- so far unsuccessfully -- for wreckage from the jet.
"I can confirm that he is not a Malaysian, but cannot divulge which country he is from yet," Tan Sri Khalid Abu Bakar told the Star, a major Malaysian newspaper. He added that the man is also not from Xinjiang, China -- a northwestern province of the mainland home to minority Uighurs. Uighur separatists have been blamed for a knifing rampage in southwestern China this month that left 29 dead.
Meanwhile, a Taiwanese official said national security officials received an anonymous tip last week warning that terrorists were targeting Beijings international airport. But the official, Cai Desheng, chief of Taiwan's national security bureau, told Taiwans official news agency that the call received last Tuesday was not likely to be linked to the mysterious disappearance four days later of Malaysia Airlines Flight 370, which was headed from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing.
Nevertheless, the anonymous call was one of dozens of possible clues investigators are examining as they struggle to explain how the flight, carrying 239 people, simply vanished. As of Monday evening in Malaysia, investigators have found no confirmed wreckage of the airliner despite an intensive search by more than 40 ships and nearly three dozen aircraft off the southern coast of Vietnam.
brooklynite
(94,727 posts)countryjake
(8,554 posts)http://www.nbcnews.com/#/storyline/missing-jet/iranian-bought-tickets-fake-passport-passengers-report-n49016
The tickets used by the fake passport carrying passengers aboard the missing Air Malaysia Flight 370 bought their tickets through a travel agency in Pattaya, Thailand, according to a report in a British newspaper.
The tickets were booked through an Iranian middleman known as Mr Ali a Thai travel agent told the Financial Times newspaper.
The newspaper quoted Benjaporn Krutnait, owner of the Grand Horizon travel agency in Pattaya, as saying the Iranian had asked her to book the two men to travel to Europe on March 1, specifying only that she find them cheap tickets.
She initially booked them on two separate flights - one on Qatar Airways and another on Etihad airline - but the tickets expired before she heard again from the Iranian, she said.
brooklynite
(94,727 posts)per CNN
countryjake
(8,554 posts)who he said wanted to return home to Europe.
The stolen passports
It is perplexing enough that a jetliner seemed to have vanished without a trace. Adding to the mystery is the news that at least two people on board were traveling on passports stolen from an Austrian and an Italian.
According to Thai police officials, an Iranian man by the name of Kazem Ali purchased the tickets for two friends who he said wanted to return home to Europe. While Ali made the initial booking by telephone, either Ali or someone acting on his behalf paid for the tickets in cash, according to police.
Rahman said Monday that authorities have reviewed security footage from the airport and said the men who traveled on the stolen passports "are not Asian-looking men."
Response to brooklynite (Original post)
uppityperson This message was self-deleted by its author.
EX500rider
(10,856 posts)...as it makes a nice wide field of floating debris....seat cushions, life vests, luggage, dinner trays, bodies, etc..
Then you are more likely looking for a more intact but sunk plane i would guess.....maybe decompression knocks out both pilots after they dialed in a emergency descent but before donning masks....like Helios flt#522 but with more descent dialed in.
( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helios_Airways_Flight_522 )
brooklynite
(94,727 posts)The two men travelling on stolen passports on the Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 that mysteriously disappeared on Saturday have been identified as Iranian nationals.
A BBC Persian report quotes an Iranian friend of one of the men, who said he hosted the pair in Kuala Lumpur after they arrived from Tehran in the days preceding their flight to Beijing.
The friend, who knew one of the men from his school days in Iran, said the men had bought the fake passports because they wanted to migrate to Europe.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iran/10688861/Mystery-fake-passport-holders-on-flight-MH370-were-Iranian.html