Obama: Social Security Checks Will Stop When Debt Ceiling Is Reached

[Cali_Democrat]

Source: Huffington Post

WASHINGTON -- President Barack Obama said Thursday that while it's bad members of Congress have allowed a government shutdown, it would be worse if they failed to increase the government's borrowing authority later this month.

First and foremost, he said, retirement and disability benefits for millions of Americans would be at risk.

"In a government shutdown, Social Security checks still go out on time," Obama said. "In an economic shutdown, if we don't raise the debt ceiling, they don't go out on time."

More than 57 million Americans receive monthly benefits from the Social Security Administration. The average monthly check for retirees totaled $1,224 in September.

Read more: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/03/social-security-debt-ceiling_n_4037870.html

[dgibby]

1. Same with military retiree checks. n/t

[CarrieLynne]

2. my roommate is a 3 tour Iraq vet, now in reserves....

...and he was supposed to go to Drill this weekend but due to the shut down he will not be going and wont be getting paid for it either....he was looking forward to that extra money since he is only working part time for $10 an hour....

I was looking forward to that extra little bit of back rent as well LOL

[madrchsod]

6. three tours in iraq and he`s part time making 10.....

that`s really supporting the troops isn't it.

[CarrieLynne]

29. IKR! he hasnt had alot of civilian work....

so hes had a hard time finding work - hard to make his very accomplished and decorated Army Infantry resume into something civilians understand...

between him and my hubby - its clear that military training doesnt translate over to civilian life quite as much as they tell you when you sign up lol

[libdem4life]

3. That's a shot across the bow that will get most everyone's attention...payee or not. Few people

don't know or love someone getting a check from the SSA. To take it further, the loss of income/financial security will have to be filled in by the family or friend's savings accounts and ripples out to supercede other plans, investments, retirement etc.

[Cali_Democrat]

7. What's crazy...

is that so many teabaggers are on SS, yet these same teabaggers are the ones pleading with the Republicans to shut down the government and not raise the debt ceiling.

There is a serious disconnect and much of it can be traced back to Fox News, Drudge Report and Rush Limbaugh.

They've been thoroughly brainwashed. Meanwhile people like Rush are making millions off this brainwashing.

[Plucketeer]

9. What was that famous utterance???

Keep your government hand offa my Medicare!

[libdem4life]

13. I'm seriously hoping that due to social media, more of the family concerned, the Millenials

now the live media coverage...at some point even Fox will have to start caving. I'm so glad PBO is holding firm and getting more and more in their political face.

I wish that someone would get Reid's "permission" to do a real Educational Presentation, equal time so to speak, on the House floor to explain, show graphics, phone numbers, have local helpers/organizations submit contact information. Just promise not to read Green Eggs and Ham. LOL

[abelenkpe]

30. My teabagger/birther

parents and uncle have been happily rooting for more cuts than the sequester and are happy about the shutdown. Wonder if they'll change their tune if their social security checks stop?

[PatrynXX]

47. I get SSI/SSD

so I'm fucked if these stupid assholes don't get a brain between now and the 17th.. I'll be praying the Republicans figure this out...

[pangaia]

38. They have no idea that their SS checks come from the gov.

[freshwest]

56. They think it will only happen to 'other' people. The Preppers are loving this, too.

[Hydra]

4. Bumpy ride ahead... n/t

[madrchsod]

5. 57 million americans will be pissed off...me included.

although the knuckle draggers will blame obama the rest of us know who to blame.

this will be settled long before the checks go out.

[Paladin]

11. It damn well BETTER be settled.

I don't think even Ted Cruz is stupid and self-possessed enough to risk this happening.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

24. He is that stupid (and his collaborators are too). Card from Harry Reid's wallet:

I was there, fighting the fight, one of the 12, voting against Medicare, because we knew it wouldn't work, in 1965.

-- Senator Bob Dole, Republican

Now we didn't get rid of it in round one because we don't think it's politically smart. But we believe (Medicare) is going to wither on the vine.

-- House Speaker Newt Gingrich, Republican

Medicare has no place in a free world. Social Security is a rotten trick. I think we're going to have to bite the bullet on Social Security and phase it out over time.

-- House Majority Leader Dick Army, Republican

[Katashi_itto]

62. Yes he is. He WANTS Default to happen.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

12. When the vote on a clean CR comes, Boehner will lose. Drive the point home:

This the Republican Shutdown of government under the control of Boehner who will not (yet) allow a clean vote on the Continuing Resolution for Congress to pay the bills they have already approved and spent.

Boehner won't allow a clean vote because it would pass in an instant.

Thus it is Boehner and the Republican caucus who back him who are responsible.

[RebelOne]

75. It better be settled because I depend on SS. n/t

[Bernardo de La Paz]

8. Capitol Police injured while working without pay. Boehner & Republicans paid while not working. nt

[libdem4life]

14. Send that to some news media...that's it in a nutshell.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

27. They know. They feel it is not their job to "sell" the facts. nt

[libdem4life]

34. Yes, but I loved the way you caught it so clearly and succinctly anyway.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

36. Thanks! I try to be direct and cogent. Ben Franklin has a great quote:

"I have already made this paper too long, for which I must crave pardon, not having now time to make it shorter." -- Ben Franklin

He (perhaps indirectly) took it from Pascal the French philosopher and mathematician who wrote:

"Je n’ai fait celle-ci plus longue que parce que je n’ai pas eu le loisir de la faire plus courte." -- Blaise Pascal

which would translate as

"I have made this longer than usual because I have not had time (or leisure) to make it shorter."

http://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/04/28/shorter-letter/

I like to follow this guideline from a famous American author, where "mint" would be the metaphor of a coin factory that mints coins:

"The greatest possible mint of style is to make the words absolutely disappear into the thought." -- Nathaniel Hawthorne

In short:

"Brevity is the mint of style."

[ConcernedCanuk]

73. "Brevity is the mint of style." - that's my style - I like that

.
.
.



Anyone who follows my postings here may have noted they are not elongated, jammed together sentences that fill the screen.

I find it difficult, and sometimes annoying to try to read screen after screen of text, even when I am really interested in the subject/topic.

With this in mind, I tend to make my paragraphs shorter as my post/reply unfolds.

Lots of spaces, so easier to read imo.

"Brevity is the mint of style."

yep



CC

[kestrel91316]

10. If the Repukes do this, they could guarantee the end of their political party.

[LiberalElite]

68. I wish they'd DIE already -

[7962]

15. If SS is self funded, then why would checks not go out if the debt ceiling isnt raised?

If this OP from last week is correct, then there should be no delay in checks going out regardless of the debt ceiling showdown.
So which is right?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023712142

[jeff47]

16. SS's funding stream is federal bonds

The Social Security trust fund buys US government debt. It uses Social Security taxes and the interest from those bonds to send out checks.

If the debt limit is hit, the federal government can't pay interest on those bonds. With no interest, there is not enough money to send out the checks.

And there is no mechanism by which the Social Security administration can prioritize the checks. Nor is there a mechanism for them to send "partial" payments covered by Social Security taxes.

So while Social Security doesn't make the Federal deficit worse, it would be stopped by the debt limit.

[Angleae]

28. I believe SS is running surplus currently.

Otherwise it wouldn't be able to purchase more bonds. The interest earned on those bonds is minimal.

[7962]

52. Agreed. And so the checks should go out because only the surplus is in bonds.

So unless we're both wrong, and I dont think we are, then the President just showed he's not above playing the fear game either. I hate it, but it seems to happen more and more. The fact that the GOP does it is no excuse to do the same thing. But just the mention of SS scares people, so there it is.

[Angleae]

57. The checks won't be going out because there is no one to send the checks.

Non-essential federal employees are furloughed and on their way out the turned off the lights and computers.

[7962]

66. The President made his statement while talking about the debt ceiling

saying that the checks wouldnt go out if the debt ceiling wasn't raised. If what you say is correct, then checks wouldnt be going out NOW, and they are. He even says that in the OP. Well, direct deposit, i dont think they actually send paper checks anymore. He's not being honest; its just fear mongering. Tit-for-tat I guess. Par for the course in Washington.

[RebelOne]

76. Well, I will know if they are still going out

on the third Wednesday of this month, which is the 16th.

[7962]

79. My neighbor got hers yesterday, but your date would be a better indicator.

[Kingofalldems]

65. Obam's fault again eh? First it was the monuments

and now it's SS. What else is his fault?

[7962]

67. No, its NOT his fault. Its just a show.

As I've said in other posts, I don't like my Pres/Rep/Senator dropping to the level of the stupid crap that the GOP does. It's so easy to spot it. Let THEM make fools of themselves, as they usually do. I'm not going to just blindly sit by and watch just because its my side doing the misleading. Either what he said in the OP is wrong, or what most people here think about the SS fund is wrong. Which is it?

[jeff47]

70. Nope, sorry.

Social Security sends out more than it receives in tax receipts. It's currently able to buy more bonds only because of the interest on the bonds it already owns.

[7962]

71. Great. So we're more screwed than I thought we were.

[jeff47]

69. Only due to interest on bonds it already owns.

It's "in the red" counting only tax receipts.

[sulphurdunn]

17. Because the people

who collect the taxes and send out the checks will be out of work. Because the Treasury will not be paying interest on SS debt anymore than it will be paying any other debt obligation.

[Lasher]

19. A very good question.

I need to think about this. Exactly what spending would continue, and would payroll tax revenue be diverted from Social Security to cover other costs? I hope it would not. But if so, this would backfire on Obama. I'll be watching for more about this.

[7962]

26. When I answered that other OP, I caught hell from some when I said "theres no money in the fund"

There's just IOU's (special issue bonds). So everyone who insulted me for saying it should read THIS op. And learn just where our money does go.

[Lasher]

55. There's no money in your checking account.

It's all just IOUs. And not even on paper. Your bank might honor those IOUs. Might not. For that matter, money is just an IOU. If nobody will redeem your dollar bills, they're good to light cigars with and that's about it.

Why do you single out the Social Security trust fund to define it as IOUs?

[7962]

64. Because you cant compare a dollar bill with a bond.

The bonds have to be redeemed en masse in the future. With tax dollars. They're not the same. If they were, there would never be any talk of "redemption". I can buy a car with a sack full of cash. If I give the dealer a govt bond, he'll turn me away. If everyone wants to equate special bonds in the SS fund with the "money" in your checking account, then the game is already over and we're all screwed. Don't know how old you are, but I'm 52 and assuming I live as long as my parents, I'll be around to watch this train wreck.
Why raise anybody's taxes? Its all IOUs anyway, right? Why send anyone a tax refund check? Just send them an IOU! Lets just raise the debt limit to 100 trillion, since its all just fake! Then we wouldnt have to go through this again till Hillary's SECOND term.

[Cali_Democrat]

20. One poster above nailed it perfectly

The fund uses income from SS taxes and interest payments to send out checks.

If there are no interest payments, then there's not enough money to honor the SS recipients.

[quakerboy]

48. Self Funded in the same way your checking account is self funded

IE, you had the money, and you handed it to someone for safekeeping, and now expect them to save it back. Only real difference is we handed it to the US government, instead of a bank.

The lockbox idea doesn't look like such a bad idea sometimes, in comparison to the "lets hand it over to republicans and let them do whatever they want with it" plan that they actually went with.

[redstatebluegirl]

18. I hope all those over 65 teaparty folks can live without their SS checks!

I doubt they thought of that possibility. Oh I forgot, that isn't an entitlement, they paid into it all these years. Of course they draw out tons more than they put in, but hey the truth doesn't matter to that group.

[Shrike47]

21. Their screams will be heard throughout the land.

And somehow, it will all be Obama's fault.

[Worried senior]

40. I am no teapartier

and there is no way we could live without our SS, that is our income. I might be able to borrow a month's worth of bills from our daughter but that would be it and leaves us with another bill to be paid back.

I want PBO to stay strong but I am terribly worried about this as are many others.

[redstatebluegirl]

42. I totally understand and would never

Make light of how much SS is needed. My point is most of the TPs are SS age and hate the govt. I want the safety net but the people they elect do note want it and do not care if it goes away.

I hope this works itself out too or we will have to help
Mother in law for sure.

[quakerboy]

50. Its a fine pickle

One aspect for consideration.. This particular "showdown" is supposedly about trying to prevent the Obamacare legislation from being enacted.

But if the Republicans walk away from this believing that it is a winning strategy, the next time it will be something else. SNAP benefits will surely be taken up. They can do this every year or two, and will if they think it will enable their destructive goals. It would be shocking if medicare and Medicaid both did not receive the same treatment. And eventually, the SS program itself. They have made their intent to kill all of these programs clear for a great many years.

[Purveyor]

22. Those checks stop then the National Guard will need to be deployed to maintain order. Just saying.

[yuiyoshida]

25. REPUBLICANS CALL THESE "entitlements"

and as for people who are on Social Security, or Military Disability, nothing for them. If they want money, they should
pull themselves up by their own bootstraps just like their rich Daddies did. This is their hatred of programs like this, because all those people should just go out and "Get a job!" Even if you lost both legs and arms in a war.. which rich Republicans refused to go fight.

Republicans bastards.

[Cali_Democrat]

31. Yes they are

Welcome to DU

[yuiyoshida]

32. Thank you!

[freshwest]

58. Welcome also. Very impressed by your posts that I've seen so far. Glad to have you here.

[yuiyoshida]

60. awww

[RebelOne]

77. Definitely agree.

I have been paying into SS a majority of my life and I am ENTITLED to that money.

[libdem4life]

35. Entitlements means "them". We earned it means "us". I have asked well-off people who have pensions

sometimes two or three would they consider not collecting their SS checks...they look at you horrified...of course not, I earned it.

[yuiyoshida]

37. Its like asking the rich to pay more taxes..

They hug their wallets and say "MINE!! mine!!"

[libdem4life]

81. Especially when they claim they "did it themselves"...well, except for inheritances, government

loans, subsidies, tax breaks...surely I missed a few.

[pangaia]

39. Right on.

But, something I never understood- How can one 'pull oneself up by one's own bootstraps? Think about it. It I am standing on the ground, wearing boots, and I pull up on the straps (assuming my boots even have straps) I can not lift myself off the ground.

[yuiyoshida]

44. I have no idea where that came from...

its an Americanism .. something someone thought up .. maybe I can use Wikipedia to find out.. so many phrases taken for granted these days..its often good to question them.


here :
Meaning

Improve your situation by your own efforts.
Origin

The origin of this descriptive phrase isn't known. It refers of course to boots and their straps (laces) and to the imagined feat of a lifting oneself off the ground by pulling on one's bootstraps. This impossible task is supposed to exemplify the achievement in getting out of a difficult situation by one's own efforts.

It was known by the early 20th century. James Joyce alluded to it in Ulysses, 1922:

"There were others who had forced their way to the top from the lowest rung by the aid of their bootstraps."

A more explicit use of the phrase comes a little later, from Kunitz & Haycraft's British Authors of the 19th Century:

"A poet who lifted himself by his own boot-straps from an obscure versifier to the ranks of real poetry."

Some early computers used a process called bootstrapping which alludes to this phrase. This involved loading a small amount of code which was then used to progressively load more complex code until the machine was ready for use. This has led to use of the term 'booting' to mean starting up a computer.

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/290800.html

[pangaia]

45. Domo arigato gozaimasu. I never expected you to go to

all that trouble.
But thanks. I actually am familiar with the Joyce use, but that was it.
The most interesting thing to me is how the phrase morphed into booting up a computer.
I will never be able to hit the power button, er boot button, again without thinking about that.

Cheers..

[yuiyoshida]

46. Kochira koso

yeah that surprised me too ..I always wondered why they called it Booting up a computer... but now we know!

[pangaia]

49. Kochira koso? Wakarimasu, ne.

Nihongo ga sukoshi wakarimasu. :&gt )

Years ago I was, not fluent, but could get around Japan, carry on good conversations, read enough to find the sushi bars, get on the right trains, etc..

[yuiyoshida]

59. kochira koso meaning

mainly this mean "me, too" (polite form)

ex. When someone says to you, "thank you-
'arigatou' (in Japanese), you could say 'kochira koso' instead of saying dou itashimashite (you're welcome), it has the same meaning of 'the pleasure is mine,' under the situation

[pangaia]

72. domo arigato

[yuiyoshida]

82. dou itashimashite!

[Katashi_itto]

63. +10000~!

[JoePhilly]

33. See, Obama plans to kill Social Security!!!!

Just in case ...

[sakabatou]

41. Fuck. No income for me.

[RebelOne]

78. Ditto. Same here.

I have a few thousand in savings, but that would only last me for about 3 months.

[quadrature]

43. the money is there, in the trust fund

why not send it out?

[Igel]

51. Others have said this nicely enough.

The money is not there in the trust fund. They're bonds.

What's interesting is what's missing.

Those who insist that the SS trust fund bonds are public debt. That would be the first priority in paying out from current receipts.

However we have this idea that any debt by the government must be "public debt", as though when the guy getting a car filled with gas is equivalent to an interest-bearing public bond issued under Congressional authority. Confuse the two kinds of debt and you get the idea that spending can't be prioritized.

If an office has the budget to buy $1200 in paper this month for printing its newsletter and it's needed for the interest that's going to help pay for the SS checks this month, well, they're equally "public debt."

If it's possible to pay 1 million and 3 SS benefits but there's not money for the last 1000, it's better not to pay any.

We've been down this path before. Paying something on time now to avoid late fees when in two weeks you know you'll need the money for something else much more important. And begging that one's hands are tied because the authority wasn't explicitly given--and, if passed in a bill, would be vetoed--by Congress.

The idea is that it's better to make the situation worse because if it gets bad enough and enough suffer, then maybe it'll get better. Both want to win more than to do good--because both are convinced that if the other guy gets his way, it'll be worse.

Sad, really. It's been rotten for a long time, though. It's like an apple. There may be bruises, but what really ruins the apple is the rot from the core.

[Cha]

53. This is so freaking scary.. as if it isn't bad enough

now!

Thanks Cali

[freshwest]

61. Yes and the GOP has been planning this for a long, long time. That's what makes it so scary. Social

and economic collapse for many millions of Americans from which, I dare say, they will NFVER be able to recover from. That is the intent. The Death Panel is the Tea Party, They worship Ayn Rand and want to do away with minorities, the poor, etc.

I've been hearing their rhetoric full-blown for over a decade. They are loving this. Too many of them have already made their fortunes and moved out of the country, or out in the rural areas, and have armed themselves to shoot to kill when they say others will be looking for food.

This is not the circles most people at DU are familiar with. I try to avoid them. This is not a joke for them, they have arranged their entire lives around this. And the GOP knows that the people on SS cannot get out in the street, and can't hold out, and can't lobby. To them, they are the refuse of society who need to go for their vision of the future.

There is a great difference between a government shut down and the debt ceilling not being raised. It will cancel out all social programs, and the GOP is determined to allow the equality of the ACA to make a difference and lift people up.

[Incitatus]

54. Who cares about SS or healthcare, a war memorial closed!

[ConcernedCanuk]

74. I do not wish suffering on anyone, but maybe LIHOP could be a positive thing

.
.
.

in the long run.

I DO believe that the situation in the USA for its citizens will not improve greatly until there is a UNITED uprising from "We The People" to make their governments RESPONSIBLE to the people.

I believe that Barack Obama is doing the best he can possibly do without getting his head blown off.

JFK bucked the MIC et al gang too overtly - we know what happened there . . .

I remember the day, was in Grade 8 history class at the time -

My teacher wept openly.

I choked up - was well informed at the time about what was happening - had previously done a class "presentation" on the "Cuban Missile Crisis" - and how John F. Kennedy had prevented a war.

I guess me being a "ConcernedCanuk" started long ago - it just hit me . . . hmmmmm . . .

If voters would only spend more time educating themselves on their representatives, getting to know their rights -

heck, I don't know much about in the USA about Welfare/Social Assistance, but up here

- some of us on Welfare know more about laws/regulations/entitlements and so on BECAUSE WE NEED TO TO SURVIVE!!

USA ain't the only country that needs it's voters to become INFORMED voters.

Making one's decisions on what we see on the tube, internet or newspapers -

That ain't good enough.

Us Canucks need to educate ourselves, and PARTICIPATE so we can prevent people like our Harperslut running roughshod over us and our country.

I suppose we won't do much about him or his ilk unless we REALLY feel some discomfort.

Old saying - "In crisis, there is opportunity".

If people in the USA start suffering severely by the tens of thousands because of the "shutdown", -

there may be motivation by the people to make REAL change,

hopefully preventing people like Obama from being hogtied from ruling by the MIC/Big Oil/Big Pharma et al.

Hopefully . . . .

CC

[walkerbait41]

80. We have lost haft our income in the shutdown

On Oct.17 we may not get our S.S. What we want is for Pres. Obama and the Dems. to stand strong and not give into the tea-bagging first cousin marring PUKES.