Cruz: 'It's appropriate that I only be American'
Source: Politico
Sen. Ted Cruz dodged questions on Sunday about whether his renunciation of his Canadian citizenship is about any ambition to run for president in 2016.
“Serving as a U.S. senator, I think it’s appropriate that I be only American,” the Texas Republican said on CNN's “State of the Union.”
Cruz, who was born in Calgary, announced last week that he would move to renounce his Canadian citizenship after a Dallas newspaper reported that Cruz technically remains a Canadian citizenship.
“There’s a lot of silliness,” he said. “I thought it was a reasonable question when The Dallas Morning News asked for my birth certificate so I gave it to them.”
Read more: http://www.politico.com/blogs/politico-live/2013/0
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Tx4obama
(36,974 posts)He isn't going to be able to wiggle out of this one
tofuandbeer
(1,314 posts)Tx4obama
(36,974 posts)
Nay
(12,051 posts)Canadian citizen, was not physically born in the US, and even possibly can apply for Cuban citizenship through his father if he so desired. And he had not immediately provided proof of his US citizenship. There's nothing silly about any of this, especially in light of the shit Obama went through with Mr Cruz's GOP continuing to claim that Obama is some Muslim-named non-citizen.
Personally, I'm glad he renounced his Canadian citizenship because Canada does not have many asshole citizens, and they just got rid of a big one.
DeschutesRiver
(2,354 posts)It isn't silly. And this little turdblossom knows it, of course.
The question is that knowing he is automatically not qualified, why does he pretend to be? And the answer is that he and those who back him are raking in cash by the boatload from people who are too low iq to understand that a man born in Canada is not able to run for the highest office.
He doesn't care, because he isn't after the office. He is after the cash. Should be a law against such overt fleecing.
Nay
(12,051 posts)a number of times on threads over the past week. All his parents had to do was submit an F-240 form, which certifies him as a US citizen born out of the country. But for him to think that it is "silly" to question his citizenship after all the shit Obama went through when he was born in Hawaii, well, let's just say if the birthers hated Obama they should REALLY hate Cruz. But somehow they don't.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)Nay
(12,051 posts)at all--thus there is no time limit; second, he was issued a US passport in high school, which is legal proof of citizenship for any reason and which is not just given away to anybody without documentation; third, if he needed an F-240 he could apply for one today, as an adult, and get one as long as a short investigation revealed that his parents were 1)married at the time of his birth; 2) one or both were American citizens; and 3) the US citizen parent had fulfilled the US residency requirements in effect in 1970. Ergo, the assumption is that a document similar to an F-240 was issued in order for him to get a US passport. We don't know this for sure, and the only odd thing about all of this is why he didn't just produce his F-240 or whatever documentation he used to get his passport.
It's certainly possible that his documentation is shitty, but that would be the fault of the State Dept/US govt. If I were he, I'd be digging for the docs that got me my passport. I also think that Cruz must be a pretty stupid fuck if he didn't think he was going to have to provide documents that he was a US citizen from birth after the moronic birther crap Obama had to go through. But then, IGIOKIYAAR.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)Nay
(12,051 posts)At the time of his birth his mother needed to have spent a total of 10 yrs in the US, 5 years which must have been after age 15 (I think).
He does have a US passport, so he is a US citizen, but it is now up to him to prove whether he was a citizen from birth (all req met) or was naturalized by some process to get that passport. It is certainly possible that he may not be eligible to run for the presidency. But he IS a citizen of both countries until Canada gets his renunciation of citizenship.
As I said, it is odd that he is unable to produce the required paperwork at once. It does make one wonder whether he's been trying to slip by and run for prez. I'd laugh all the way to the moon if this jerk was disqualified because he wasn't a citizen from birth.
DeschutesRiver
(2,354 posts)He wasn't physically born here, and hasn't produced a thing documenting that he has an American parent. Or has he produced the docs yet? To prove that he was born of an American parent isn't difficult.
I realize how murky/unresolved the natural born issue is, of course. This is the first one of these threads I've read completely/responded to; usually stop reading them because of too many inaccuracies.
Nay
(12,051 posts)when more knowledgeable folks cite the laws. It's especially irritating when some posters go on and on about something that has been definitively disproved through cut and paste of the actual relevant laws -- this is what RWers and nutcases do, not DUers. Or so I thought.
His mother's country of birth is on his Canadian birth certificate, but I don't think that means anything. When the hospital was issuing the birth cert for my son, they just asked us where we were born--we didn't have to show them our birth certs to prove it.
I also have not seen anything on whether his mother's US residency status at Cruz's birth was sufficient to win him automatic US citizenship, or whether his parents were married at the time of the birth. A look at Wikipedia's history of Cruz says his mom was in TX through college, so it would be hard for her NOT to have fulfilled the residency requirement, I would think. But this is where the researchers should concentrate, and I haven't heard anything, either.
I am closer to this stuff because I am a dual citizen and have gone through the process for myself and my son, so I know more about it than the average person.
DeschutesRiver
(2,354 posts)And in looking a bit further at a recent change in Canadian law, it appears I may in fact be a dual citizen and not know it. I mentioned this down thread a bit, but it appears to come down to whether my mom took the step of formally renouncing her canadian citizenship. If she never did, then it looks like I meet the rest of the requirements and am also canadian. Turns out the canadian gov doesn't care who grants her citizenship; until she formally renounced, she was still also canadian. And was when I was born here in the states. And still is now, though she doesn't know it.
Apparently, all I need to do is apply for proof of my existing candian citizenship and they will let me know. I am still in the early stages of making certain on this. But because of this, and being a lawyer, I know that it can take some unraveling to figure things out. I am not sure either that the mother status on his birth cert. is of any relevance. But the fact that he hasn't laid out the docs that lay this to rest speaks volumes to me.
If you have been following all these threads, you have a far stronger stomach than I. Congrats on becoming a dual citizen! I've enjoyed having relatives in 2 countries, though admit I would be shocked if it turned out that by operation of law, I'd always been a dualie.
Response to DeschutesRiver (Reply #72)
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HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)Sounds too "exotic" to be American. Plus, he favors tea....that is suspiciously furrin.
DRoseDARs
(6,810 posts)This has been established law for decades now. McCain was born on Panamanian soil BEFORE the law was established with retroactive application. So tired of hearing about this; don't need to hear more of it from our side.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)Not all citizens are eligible to be president.
DRoseDARs
(6,810 posts)No gold star for you.
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)Obama was born on American soil to an American mother and Kenyan father. This makes him an American citizen.
Ted Cruz was born on Canadian soil to an American mother and a Cuban father. He has a Canadian birth certificate.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)Laws which have varied considerably over time.
You are correct, he has a US Citizenship, but he may not be eligible for the presidency.
AND fuck 'em if they can't take the shoe on the other foot. The law is the law.
ProudToBeBlueInRhody
(16,399 posts)Have you been watching too much Faux News?
Unknown Beatle
(2,672 posts)Only native-born U.S. citizens (or those born abroad, but only to parents who were both citizens of the U.S.) may be president of the United States. Cruz's father, Rafael, is Cuban-born.
DRoseDARs
(6,810 posts)AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)Did it the year he was born?
Because that matters considerably.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)7962
(11,841 posts)So Cruz is an American. And if Obama was not born in Hawaii, he would still be too, by virtue of his mother.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)His status as a natural born citizen would be subject to the laws at the time, not the laws today.
They have changed.
7962
(11,841 posts)For persons born between December 24, 1952 and November 14, 1986, a person is a U.S. citizen if all of the following are true:[8]
The person's parents were married at the time of birth
One of the person's parents was a U.S. citizen when the person was born
The citizen parent lived at least ten years in the United States before the child's birth;
A minimum of 5 of these 10 years in the United States were after the citizen parent's 14th birthday.
He's a citizen.
The SCOTUS has never ruled definitively on the "natural born" status the "birthers" like to bring up so often.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)I was looking forward to throwing this in a couple co-worker's faces going into the next primary cycle.
7962
(11,841 posts)Because if Obama WAS born in Kenya, his American mother makes him as much natural born as Cruz. So either they admit they were wrong or they cant back Cruz.
AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)It would be so much more fun if Cruz was ACTUALLY ineligible.
Nay
(12,051 posts)in effect in the law in 1970; an F-240 is the gold standard document for that, and it looks like he has been unable or unwilling to produce that document.
Those who are digging into this simply need to find the documents that his parents used to get him that US passport. That document will tell us whether he was a citizen from birth or was a naturalized citizen.
It's possible he is a naturalized citizen, and the longer he flails around hollering he's a US citizen, the more suspicious the situation becomes. Where's the paperwork? Are his parents still alive?
Rules of citizenship have changed over the centuries and the Constitution has not. If Cruz would have been born in, say, 1830 he would not be eligible because he would have had only Canadian citizenship rather than dual citizenship. Sure, he could have become easily naturalized because his mother is American but naturalized citizens are not eligible to be President. So it looks to be a case of how absolute one takes the Constitution to be. If you believe the Constitution is a living document that accommodates changed circumstances then Cruz is clearly eligible. But if you take a strict construction view of the Constitution then you would conclude that his Canadian citizenship is superior to American citizenship making Cruz not eligible. As for myself, I believe the Constitution is a living document so the set of circumstances that fits Ted Cruz makes him eligible but I can also see others claiming that the original intent was to exclude people like Ted Cruz. There has actually been no court case to test the set of circumstance surrounding Ted Cruz. Perhaps it would be wise to kick this up to the Supreme Court for a definitive ruling.
cstanleytech
(26,293 posts)you just dont care one way or another but just want to sit back and enjoy the show while the birthers over Obama start fighting among themselves over if Cruz is eligible or not to be president?
Nay
(12,051 posts)might not be a US citizen from birth. The law in 1970 stated that several conditions had to be met--other posts contain those conditions, so I won't repeat them here. We don't know if those conditions were met because:
Cruz has not produced an F-240, certificate of foreign birth, issued by the US embassy or State Dept at his birth in Canada IF his parents bothered to file for one. It is not required, but it is recommended. If he has an F-240, he's golden.
Cruz has a US passport, which means he is a US citizen, but I don't think a passport has any distinguishing text that differentiates the passport of a citizen from birth from a naturalized citizen. So, the passport tells us he's a citizen, but probably doesn't tell us if he was one from birth.
The question still remains whether he is a US citizen from birth or from naturalization, and the documents that his parents submitted to get him a US passport when he was in high school should tell us which one he is. Why they have not been produced is a mystery. This is the sort of shit you have to keep forever, you know? Esp if you're running for Senate, etc.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)I have been told...and I think his mother did not live in the US after she was 14.
Nay
(12,051 posts)He is renouncing that citizenship now, for which Canadians are thankful.
He is a US citizen because he holds a US passport.
Period.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)Nay
(12,051 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)and until he does what is required...he is still a Canadian citizen.
Nay
(12,051 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)me thinks thou dost protest too much..
Nay
(12,051 posts)act as if I just told you that renouncing verbally was all that was required. Thus my statement about not putting words in my mouth. And Shakespeare, too. You are on ignore.
VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)You should put yourself on ignore.
DeschutesRiver
(2,354 posts)granted her citizenship decades ago.
And due to a change in Canadian law in the last few years, I may also be a canadian citizen because of this. I was born here and am an American citizen. But the US grant of citizenship to my mom did not change her Canadian status as a citizen. Only a formal renunciation would, and I suspect that never happened. All I would have to do is file for my proof of citizenship as a Canadian, and they will let me know if I am correct.
Until Cruz shows his docs, the only thing we know for certain is that he is canadian born. If he wishes to run for the presidency, he is the one who will need to show his eligibility.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)citizen father OR a US citizen mother is also a "natural born citizen" and may become President.
7962
(11,841 posts)Nay
(12,051 posts)his birth. I'm sure journalists are researching the hell out of that right now. We'll know soon.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)branford
(4,462 posts)construed as a conflict of interest? His primary constituency wants to him to disclaim any potential foreign entaglements? He doesn't want to be associated with those goofy Canadians and their socialized medicine? Does it really matter?
The allegations about Obama were absurd and made conservative look foolish, and similar allegations by our side makes us look equally unhinged.
Since his mother was a U.S. citizen and complied with all other relevant regulations at the time of his birth, Cruz is a natural born citizen. In the unlikely event that Cruz is the R nominee, complaining about his eligibility will help D's about as much as it helped R's in 2008 and 2012.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)it'll get ya real far here
branford
(4,462 posts)It matters only to him and his supporters. It is of no significance.
More importantly, the claim that Cruz is ineligible to be president is as ludicrous as the objections to Obama's eligibility, and those who choose to continually argue such claims will be rightfully met with the same success, lack of respect and outright derision as the birthers in the Republican Party.
There are more than ample reasons to oppose Cruz in the very unlikely event he receives the Republican nomination. I don't need to support ridiculous fringe theories and lose my dignity in order to oppose his candidacy.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)was Cruz 'grandfathered' in under revised citizenship laws?
branford
(4,462 posts)If you wish to complain that Cruz is ineligible to be president, it's most certainly your right and I cannot stop you.
If Cruz is selected as the Republican nominee, I will fight tooth and nail to oppose his candidacy and elect the Democratic nominee. I will not, however, raise or support the argument that he is ineligible. We have a great wealth of reasons to oppose Cruz, without resort to fringe legal theories.
Republican birthers made fools of themselves with respect to Obama, and I can only hope my fellow Democrats do not embarrass themselves with similar nonsense.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)why?
branford
(4,462 posts)and it would not matter to you in the least. Heck, I could write an entire legal brief (I'm actually an attorney in NYC), and it would have no effect.
We both oppose Cruz; let that be enough.
If you choose to object to his eligibility, that is clearly your right. I believe that we have far better and more substantive reasons to fight against Cruz.
I just would like to remind you of the derision heaped upon the birthers here at DU and elsewhere when it came to Obama. They are considered uninformed, fringe kooks. If you believe the Democratic equivalent of birthers will receive a better reception, I think you may be sorely disappointed.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)but understand this 'conversation' started with an off hand one comment on my part which was -
everything after that has been based on your own projections and assumptions, but mostly projections, period
LiberalFighter
(50,942 posts)Specifically for the purpose of becoming President? If you do then you need to do some research.
azurnoir
(45,850 posts)possibly, maybe might, could be, 3 years from now is from now is wasted energy
look back I made a one word comment, but watching the projections has been rather interesting, in a weird way
grasswire
(50,130 posts)So that could be weasely.
LiberalFighter
(50,942 posts)if they had to think about that.
snooper2
(30,151 posts)
MichiganVote
(21,086 posts)Demeter
(85,373 posts)Is it worth it? To give up one's best option for survival, just to run for President?
I don't think so.
Skittles
(153,164 posts)DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)
- Sorry Teddy, but once a Cubanadian anchor baby, always a Cubanadian anchor baby.
bucolic_frolic
(43,173 posts)with an attitude like Yosemite Sam
Mr.Bill
(24,300 posts)His idiocy will take care of that. If this country is ever stupid enough to elect him president, I think I will become a Canadian citizen.
rdharma
(6,057 posts)He's a TX Teabagger! And THAT is what should disqualify him from ever being the POTUS!
silvershadow
(10,336 posts)op-eds and such. Let them have him, by all means.
They_Live
(3,233 posts)no surprise there.
Octafish
(55,745 posts)My friends with dual citizenship absolutely love Canada.
treestar
(82,383 posts)
xfundy
(5,105 posts)The cancervatives wanted to ignore the law to get Schwarzzenegger into the White House.
Blue Owl
(50,391 posts)POS
