Grand jury to be seated in Ohio football rape case, will look at whether other laws broken

[maddezmom]

Source: AP

COLUMBUS, Ohio — A grand jury about to be seated in eastern Ohio will investigate whether other laws were broken in the case of a 16-year-old girl raped by two high school football players last year.

Nothing is off the table for the Jefferson County panel expected to be selected Monday in Steubenville, said Ohio Attorney General Mike DeWine.


“The grand jury is a very good investigative tool as well as a very deliberative body,” DeWine said. It will investigate everything that happened before and after the rape, he said.

Some of the outstanding questions in the case include whether anyone knew about the rape early on but didn’t report it and how dozens of teens attending a party that preceded the attack got ahold of beer and other alcohol.





Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/grand-jury-to-be-seated-in-ohio-football-rape-case-will-look-at-whether-other-laws-broken/2013/04/15/53ca1d34-a59d-11e2-9e1c-bb0fb0c2edd9_story.html

[davidpdx]

1. We'll see if they end up charging anyone beyond the two who have already been convicted

and given a slap on the wrist. I'm glad a grand jury has been called, but doubtful as to whether some of the other major figures behind the crime and cover-up will be charged

[Threedifferentones]

2. The way I feel right now those fuckheads better just plea.

The coach and parents who covered up this horrible crime, the students who mocked her online and of course the fucking rapists themselves...their names are public record now and if the state can't bring justice maybe someone else will have to.

[Pointy_n_sharp]

3. Coaches ..maybe.. Parents.. slap on the wrist...

Students who mocked and passed around photos.. nothing...

[Kelvin Mace]

4. This is one area of legal reform sorely in need of updating

Providing alcohol to a minor should be FIVE years NO parole.

I don't know too many adults who want to spend five years in the nick sharing a toilet just so the local team quarterback can get drunk.

And while we are at it, providing a firearm to someone not legally allowed to own one should be ten years. Life if the weapon is used to kill someone.

Again, NO parole.

[walkerbait41]

5. +1

Well said

[Comrade Grumpy]

6. Why be such a wuss about it? Give 'em the death penalty!

Seriously, I don't think more harsh mandatory minimum sentences for minor offenses is a good answer.

Providing alcohol to a minor is typically a 30-day misdemeanor.

You want the homeless guy who buys them a case of beer in exchange for a 40-ounce Hurricane to do five years?

You want the older brother who buys for his underage sibling to do five years?

You want the store clerk who fails to ask for ID to do five years?

Kids have been drinking forever. A better approach might be realistic alcohol education, beginning in junior high school, or even sixth grade.

[Kelvin Mace]

10. I don't support the death penalty

and even if I did it would hardly be appropriate.

You want the homeless guy who buys them a case of beer in exchange for a 40-ounce Hurricane to do five years?

You want the older brother who buys for his underage sibling to do five years?

You want the store clerk who fails to ask for ID to do five years?

How do I put this?

Yes, yes I do.

Once the word gets out that the penalty is this stiff kids will be hard-pressed to find any adult willing to supply them with alcohol. I have seen too many adults who take a "kids will be kids" attitude toward this. Somehow, the attitude is not appreciated by the parents of maimed/dead children. Giving alcohol to a minor is like handing them a loaded gun. For some reason I am supposed to be reassured by the fact that they seldom shoot someone or themselves?

Certainly a realistic education about alcohol would be useful, but as long as adults refuse to take the idea of supplying children with alcohol seriously, then we need laws like this to "sober" people up.

[Ash_F]

14. You need start your perspective from the fact the she was ruffied, not drunk

I'm not saying kids should drink alcohol or anything, but it's important to understand the huge difference between a date rape drug and booze. These young men bought the ruffies when they were stone-cold sober, and therefore made a sober decision to commit rape. A fact that makes it that much worse. I feel like media keeps bringing up alcohol to divert from their callous disregard for the victim and coddling of the perps. "Everyone makes bad choices when drunk right? Let's sympathize." Even the judge carried that tune.

I would have no problem with the guy who sold those boys ruffies, getting 5 years. Everyone knows what ruffies are used for, and he knew what they would do with them.

[Kelvin Mace]

15. Again, this ignores the problem

that when this type of thing happens, alcohol is almost always involved. You point to this one instance where it may not have played a role, yet every day alcohol provided to minors BY ADULTS cause rape, death and maiming.

Until ADULTS stop providing alcohol to teens, this problem will not go away. The only way to seriously cut down on adults providing alcohol to minors is to make examples of those who do with HARSH penalties.

Teen drinking is "harmless" until someone dies or is injured.

[Ash_F]

16. I have doubts about the veracity of that claim

That most rapes occur with un-spiked alcohol. I don't have statistics right now, but I would bet it is the other way around. It takes quite a bit of alcohol to render a person comatose and then they would likely be suffering from alcohol poisoning. No, I think most 'alcohol' rapes involve ruffies. They are unfortunately quite prevalent.

I think blaming it on alcohol is slanderous towards the victim, implying she is some kind of drunk, when it is highly likely that her very first drink was the one that was spiked and she was knocked out within the first couple of sips.

[Kelvin Mace]

17. Alcohol is used as an excuse

which is why I favor harsh punishment for providing alcohol to minors. It removes one more excuse.

I am not blaming the victim for their own rape, anymore than I would blame a pedestrian struck by a drunk driver. I have in NO way suggested, nor implied that the victim of rape is at fault because she consumed alcohol. You are putting your focus on the teens, I am focused on the adults who illegally gave them the alcohol. Again, giving minors alcohol is like giving them a loaded gun. The gun may not go off, and someone may not be hurt, but why tolerate the practice? Why punish the teens and allow the the adults to walk away with a slap on the wrist?

[Ash_F]

18. I too want the adults involved held accountable.

Last edited Tue Apr 16, 2013, 04:45 PM - Edit history (1)

I just didn't want people to lose sight of the fact that a powerful drug was used to commit this rape and many others by focusing only on alcohol. Ruffies are grimly refereed to as the 'date rape' drug after all. That makes them worse than heroin, really.

[Kelvin Mace]

19. A powerful drug was not used in Steubenville

Well, actually one was, it is called alcohol, a drug far more destructive than many other illicit drugs whose distribution results in seriously long jail sentences.

[Ash_F]

20. You are wrong.

It is just not possible for alcohol to sedate someone to that degree without also killing them or requiring hospitalization to save them. Rather than type out an extended post, let me call your attention to this article which is pretty thorough.

http://www.politicususa.com/tips-woman-steubenville-police-dept.html

Please read it in entirety. The Girl did not have alcohol poisoning. Again, this is slanderous towards the victim.

[Kelvin Mace]

21. I have seen people so completely out of it from alcohol

as to be insensate. One of the reasons I never drank.

Again, you claim I am attacking the victim, I most certainly AM NOT and resent the continued accusation.

I am talking about harshly punishing any adult who provided alcohol to minors and you keep accusing me of attacking the minors and blaming them for the situation.

[Ash_F]

22. Even the victim claimed that she was drugged. If you are so resentful, why do you claim otherwise?

All you calling her a liar too? And I am not going to have an extend discussion about biology here. Information is readily found online.

[Kelvin Mace]

23. Again, you seem to be deliberately missing the point,

in this particular instance alcohol may have played a minor role, or even no role. However, we cannot know this since no blood tests were done to determined blood alcohol level. We do have multiple witnesses who say that alcohol was freely available at the party and that she had been drinking. Consumption of alcohol to excess may cause blackouts and memory loss, even when you haven't been slipped a mickey. This is scientific fact, not conjecture.

And even then, this is beside the point. My point is that ADULTS provided alcohol to these minors. In so doing, they greatly endangered their health and well-being, not to mention the VIOLATED the law. IF any ADULT is held responsible for breaking this law, it will be slap on the wrist which in NO WAY will deter this crime in the future.

By making the crime punishable by five years, no parole, we severely discourage this type of behavior by irresponsible adults, and we stigmatize the conduct.

Why you keep harping on the false point that I am somehow attacking the victim is beyond me.

[Ash_F]

24. You were the one who said she was not drugged. How do you think she would feel about that?

How do you think she feels about the fact that media bobbleheads keep tip-toeing around the fact that roofies were used when talking about what happened to her?

It is an important distinction and it matters. It is extremely egregious that she was set up and attacked in this manner.

[Kelvin Mace]

25. Could you point me to any evidence that roofies were used?

Since the complaint was not formally made until days after the event, no tox screen was done.

Does that mean they were not used? No, but I can't prove a negative. However, there was plenty of evidence she was drinking heavily, and heavy drinking can lead to unconsciousness (so much so that teens have died from aspirating their own vomit).

If she was deliberately drugged and the person who provided that drugs can be ascertained, tried and convicted, then I believe their punishment should be far harsher than five years no parole. In fact, if it makes you happy I am willing to support a penalty of 25 years, no parole, for any adult who provides any drug that facilitates a rape.

The long and short of this so far is that the boys who raped the girl have been tried and convicted. The question is now, what about the ADULTS who are provided a venue for the rape, who provided alcohol to minors, and who helped destroy evidence of the crime after the fact?

I do not understand why you want to shield ADULTS from harsh punishment for illegally proving alcohol to minors. While some may argue about whether alcohol was a causative factor in the Steubenville rape, there can be NO argument that it is a causative factor on a weekly basis for the deaths/maiming of teens. An adult who provides alcohol to a minor does so knowing full well they are breaking the law, and knowing full well that there is considerable risk of death/injury to the minors so provided. In my opinion, anyone who is prepared to facilitate a child's death deserves to be punished severely.

Five years, no parole, is the least punishment.

Side note: While doing some reading on "date rape" drugs, i ran across this Justice Department study from 2003:

https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/201894.pdf

The long and short of the study is that Rohypnol and similar drugs may be detected in urine and hair up to a week/month after ingestion. Victims who suspect they may have been drugged now have a larger window for detecting these drugs after the fact than in the past, but many law enforcement agencies may be unaware of this study.

In a 2007 study conducted by the UK National Health Service and published in the Emergency Medical Journal tested women who claimed they had been drugged. While 19% tested positive for illicit drugs, none tested positive for rohypnol. However, 94% tested positive for alcohol in concentration 2-3 times the legal limit of impairment.

I do not distinguish between rape victims raped under the influence of alcohol or drugs. Persons under the influence of either cannot give legal consent to sexual activity. Unfortunately, American society tends to think women who get drunk have only themselves to blame, while a "drugged" woman is blameless. Thus, despite the fact that alcohol is the date rape "drug of choice", society prefers to excuse alcohol (and the people who provide it to minors) and blame rohypnol, since its shifts blame to a relatively hard to come by drug (compared to alcohol).

So, if I am a 15 year old girl who has ultra-religious parents with the typical misogynistic views that come with those beliefs, it is easier to claim I was at a party and drugged, than to admit I was at a party and drinking. The former will be excused and sympathized with, the latter blamed on me.

So, to sum up: Show me an adult who provides alcohol to minors and I will support five years no parole. If anyone is injured/raped then it is 25 years, no parole. Show me someone who provides Rohypnol to minors and I will support 25 years, no parole, or life if a rape actually takes place.

[Ash_F]

26. So are you calling her a liar?

Are you calling the woman in the other article a liar? I told you I wouldn't get into an extended discussion about biology. But I'll give you this: Being intoxicated enough to aspirate on your own vomit, or enough to be forceably anally penetrated, as in this case, without waking means that the person also must have consumed enough alcohol to have alcohol poisoning. She did not have alcohol poisoning. So something else must have sedated her.

You should continue to broaden you education on subject, but you should also learn how to interpret data or else you won't learn anything. For example, that study was of women who were brought to an emergency room from intoxication, not women who claimed they were raped. Do you understand why that makes a huge difference? If a perp were to drug and rape someone, do you think they would then immediately drive them to a hospital while they are still sedate? No they would leave them wherever, as was the case in Steubenville.

Therefore, the study does not address what we are talking about, at all. Also, though somewhat moot, 75 individuals is not even considered a scientific sample.

[Kelvin Mace]

28. No, but I am beginning to wonder about your facts

Could you provide me with a link to a news source where the young lady is claiming she was drugged? I had thought there had been some late development and this claim had just surfaced, since it is not in the trial transcript and I never read that the prosecution brought it up. All I can find on the subject is a lot of discussion on blogs that theorize that she was drugged, but no actual news stories reporting that she makes the claim.

Also, how are you defining alcohol poisoning and how have you determined the victim did not meet that criteria?

As to the study, the sample size IS scientific, based on the criteria. They tested all patients who claimed they had their drinks spiked, whether they claimed they had been raped or not, over a 12 month period. Therefore their sample size was 100% of the people who thought they had been drugged. Would I like to see more studies? Yes, I certainly would

Despite your thoughts on the matter, I DO know how to interpret data.

I do not drink and never have. As a result I spent a lot of time in High School and college dealing with and observing people who did and keeping them out of cars, making sure they got home safe, and checking on them the next day. I can tell you that when binge drinking, most could not recall the events of the previous night, and some had slept through being dragged around (these folks I called an ambulance for, or got them to the ER, since these people were possibly in medical distress, and better safe than sorry).

[Ash_F]

29. It is disgusting that you would choose to slander this girl, who has already suffered greatly.

She has shown great courage in facing her attackers, unlike the cowards who relish in victim shaming online and on tv. I am no longer replying for your benefit, but for anyone who may be hooked by your misinformation.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/16/steubenville-rape-case-teen-cant-recall-assault_n_2893398.html

If you had bothered to use the search term "steubenville roofies" you would have found this on the first page. I am not interested in hearing excuses as to why you missed this. I don't think you really are that dense and need your hand held from one post to another, but are just leading me on for responses.

Similarly, search terms such as "Alcohol Poisoning" and "Scientific Method" also provide sources on why you are wrong with your other assertions, but you are clearly not concerned with the facts. No you are concerned with blaming the victim for binge drinking, which is not only unsupported by the facts, but ruled out.


By the way, I don't imbibe either but it does not matter to this girl. I don't care what your motivations are, but if you think you can slander a victim to further your aims, you will get no support from decent people. Remember, this post was not for you. We are done. Have a nice day.

[Kelvin Mace]

30. How have I slandered the girl?

This is your characterization not mine.

She "suspects" she was drugged, but there is no proof. The fact that she was raped under the influence of alcohol (uncontested by all parties) makes no difference to me as to the guilt and punishment of her attackers and in no way lessens my concern for the victim. You seem hung up on the distinction between being drugged and simply being impaired by alcohol, so it seems to me that you are the one who feels she needs to have been drugged in order to be sympathetic. You are the one who fears that if she was simply drunk this is something shameful.

Yes, we are done.

[ButterflyBlood]

7. You want the penalty to be worse than a DUI?

Hell that's probably even worse than burglary, even armed robbery can get parole before five years. Also rather absurd. The alcohol laws in this country are ridiculous as it is, so I don't have much concern for those who break them who aren't hurting others. And a couple 18-year olds getting drunk in someone's basement isn't hurting anyone. Nor is it what caused this awful crime.

[Kelvin Mace]

9. I am not talking about punishing kids

for illegally obtaining alcohol for themselves, I am talking about adults legally buying alcohol then providing it it to minors.

Oh, and getting drunk in someone's basement is PRECISELY what led to this crime. I really don't believe that this would have happened if all the principles had not been drunk.

A couple of 18 year olds getting drunk in someones basement IS hurting someone, the 18 year olds. While the damage of alcohol abuse may be minor during any isolated binge, it is damaging in the aggregate. It also greatly maximizes the possibility of assault, rape, injury, and death.

Adults who aid and abet this behavior deserve no mercy.

[ButterflyBlood]

12. The thing is, 18 year olds getting drunk is legal in most countries

And it was legal in many US states to at one point before Reagan started blackmailing them.

The US's laws here are absurd and fucking ridiculous. No need to make it even more draconian. Five years to parents who let their kids have a glass of wine at dinner or a beer at a family outing? Let's focus on the actual criminals: The rapists, and those who assisted in covering it up. Not blame the alcohol. If this was all at a party where kids were getting high instead of drunk, would that mean the logical response would be to make marijuana laws tougher and serve as a justification for further prohibition?

[crim son]

8. "Ahold"?

Seriously?

[L0oniX]

11. Every person who recieved any pictures of the crime and did not report it should be prosecuted.

Let me give it a term: Child rape porn! They accepted child porn pics and didn't report it. They are guilty of child pornography crime just like anyone else caught with child porn on a computer.

[freshwest]

13. Want to see the parents who had them carry out of the basement charged, too.