Kerry defends liberties, says Americans have "right to be stupid"

[IDemo]

Source: Reuters

Secretary of State John Kerry offered a defense of freedom of speech, religion and thought in the United States on Tuesday telling German students that in America "you have a right to be stupid if you want to be."

"As a country, as a society, we live and breathe the idea of religious freedom and religious tolerance, whatever the religion, and political freedom and political tolerance, whatever the point of view," Kerry told the students in Berlin, the second stop on his inaugural trip as secretary of state.

"People have sometimes wondered about why our Supreme Court allows one group or another to march in a parade even though it's the most provocative thing in the world and they carry signs that are an insult to one group or another," he added.

"The reason is, that's freedom, freedom of speech. In American you have a right to be stupid - if you want to be," he said, prompting laughter. "And you have a right to be disconnected to somebody else if you want to be.

Read more: http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/02/26/us-usa-kerry-liberties-idUSBRE91P0HJ20130226

[get the red out]

1. Too many people take him up on that

Stupid is a right that is over-exercised in this country.

[relayerbob]

12. That was exactly my thought

Pretty sad state of affairs.... when I was a kid, getting an education and being aware of the REAL world around us was considered a good thing and an actual goal of parents and the country as a whole.

[Larry Ogg]

28. It's over-exercised because promoting it aids and abets the predator class...

And yes, stupidity has become so popular in America, that rich predators have the right to cheat and steal from stupid people in any way they see fit, and then they have the right to blame it on someone else like unions, teachers, firefighters, and a host of other so-called terrorist.

Predators even have the right to hand pick all the little venal sock puppets that most of all the stupid people in America will vote for in their pretend elections. And then they go about their business of proudly promoting and protecting all the stupid as if it were some sacred rite.

[YvonneCa]

29. AND, it's important to note that there are consequences for choosing...

...to "be stupid." GWB, for one example.

[get the red out]

30. Unfortunately

I have "friends" on FB that occasionally post a pic of GWB captioned "Do you miss me yet?" in an effort to exercise their right to be stupid.

[YvonneCa]

32. There will always be such people. ALWAYS. I think education...

...is the long term solution. We NEED a solution, because "being stupid" has consequences...bad ones. This is a debate we need to have, IMHO, so we don't repeat things like the Bush Administration, or the Iraq War.

[get the red out]

34. agree

I am hoping they will understand the "consequences" of this Congress, at least some of them.

[YvonneCa]

36. So am I. And there will be more...

...consequences, negative ones, until people start caring and paying attention. I just hope it's soon.

[AllTooEasy]

39. Recall: Female Suffrage use to be "Stupid"

Freeing the slaves was "Stupid". Ending Segregation was "Stupid". The thought of a Black or Female president was "Stupid".

Now, letting gays have marry is "Stupid". Don't be so quick to knock Stupid.

[get the red out]

40. Sorry

Right now stupid is the Republicans in Congress and those who support them. I have my doubts they will be vindicated by history unless they write it themselves.

[Berlum]

2. "Hooray. Finally, a lib who gets it!" - RepubliBaggers (R)

[Ian David]

3. You have the right to be stupid-- if you dare...

[BainsBane]

4. Wouldn't it be nice if they chose otherwise?

<sigh>

[blm]

5. And, of COURSE, Reuters would go with 'the most provocative" headline because they want to gin up

backlash against Kerry based on a false impression that he was attacking America's freedoms. Reuters is a RW piece of sh!t news service.

[YvonneCa]

35. Most of the media, with few exceptions, does that...

...where Kerry is involved. It's provocative...but also LAZY because they don't help or encourage followers to learn the context of what he actually says.

If most people actually learned the context, they would agree wholeheartedly with John Kerry.


People really ought to watch this whole sppech...and the one at UVA last week. Blew me away...

[wisteria]

43. ++++++++1 n/t

[edbermac]

6. Whose he callin stoopid??

[liberal N proud]

7. There are millions of Americans proving him correct

Although each one of them would chastise him for saying it.

Oh the truth can be painful!

[mountain grammy]

8. Yes, but we live under the thumb of these stupid people

because the rich and powerful in America have found a way to manipulate democracy to advance their own personal agendas, and they know how to spell and know exactly what they're doing. Most important, they are super rich, and in America that'll buy government policies, the media, the education system, and enough influence over enough voters to stay in play. So, even as a minority, the white supremacist GOP, stays in the news, continues to obstruct, and continues to rig enough elections to influence the government.. Germany understands this all too well. It's their history.

[Arkana]

9. Well, he's right.

People like the current Republican Party are the price we pay for free speech.

[otohara]

10. Isn't Stupid Costing This Country Billions?

this is a ridiculous message to send.

I read last week dropouts are costing this country billions.

[relayerbob]

13. Actually, it would be "trillions"

Given that if people were educated, they wouldn't allow the banks to rob them blind and then vote for their sycophants

[otohara]

16. Word n/t

[pampango]

11. I took it to mean that people (like the Nazi party or anti-Muslim types) have the right to protest

(even though they look 'stupid' doing it) rather than him endorsing the right of Americans to be ignorant hicks.

[yellowcanine]

14. Forrest Gump said it best, "Stupid is as stupid does."

[sofa king]

15. That's a bunch of crap.

Virtually everything I learned before the age of 25 turned out to be time-sensitive, or deliberate disinformation. Everything I thought I knew about U.S. history, government, and foreign policy was untrue and quite intentionally taught to us, because the truth would have made me question the very right of our government to exist.

It wasn't my right to be stupid. I didn't want to be stupid; I didn't want to be brought up on mythical "news" and bludgeoned over the head with fear and uncertainty. That was bequeathed upon me by one political party in the U.S., without my consent and against my wishes. It has only become worse in the past fifteen years.

I have to work hard every single day to collect enough information from enough un-poisoned sources so that I have any idea at all what is actually going on. The right to be indolent and accept the deceptions that are thrown at me is about as useful as the right to mount my toilet on the ceiling.

Fuck calling it a right, and start calling disinformation what it is: the largest problem our nation faces today.

[karynnj]

20. Kerry was one of the strongest people attacking Republican lies in the Senate

- like when Kyl called an abortion/PP point in a speech not to have been intended as factual.

[YvonneCa]

31. It IS a problem...

...that the country faces. And it DOES hurt us. GWB, for example. You and I work hard to get our information. Not everyone does, or wants to. It is their right...but there are consequences that affect us all.

[politicasista]

45. +1

There doesn't seem to be anything malicious the SOS said. He is working for the POTUS here. He should not be made the enemy here.

[sofa king]

71. Amen to that.

But I would point out that if ignorance was a right, there would be a hell of a lot fewer people in jail today. Ignorance of the law is no excuse, so in a highly technical sense, ignorance is most certainly not a right. Rather it is a liability that can and will be used against the individual.

I feel I understand what Secretary Kerry is saying. He's speaking of the lowercase rights, most of which we never had, most of the rest of which we collectively handed over to GWB. Those rights are rights that legally are no longer actual rights, or never were, like the "freedom" which our brethren across the aisle cannot define but for which they would happily sacrifice other peoples' children to protect.

Like you, I am very, very tired of sacrificing my own blood and treasure so that others can be stupid. But hey, that's freedom, man!

[hughee99]

17. It seems like every time John Kerry comments on "stupid people" he gets himself in trouble. n/t

[karynnj]

18. Every other article has the statement in context - for what it is -

the strong US right to free speech.

The AP article is here and in many other sources - http://bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2013/02/26/john-kerry-pushes-trans-atlantic-free-trade-germany/cr3medzQpYmbCdwYmMXRwI/story.htmlthe

Here is the WP - http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/as-secretary-of-state-john-kerry-still-a-champion-of-massachusetts/2013/02/26/f35039e2-802c-11e2-a350-49866afab584_story.html

Both of these articles show that it was a very well received Youth Connection town hall. (The very type of thing that Reuters would have been thrilled by if it were Clinton or Condi Rice.)

Note that especially in the WP, it is clear that this was a very serious discussion of American culture and values - including speaking of tolerance as a value that took time to develop in the US. Think of the issues facing the US and the problems that have developed - under both Bush and Obama, there have been crises when fringe media have produced outrageous things that other countries were unhappy with that they blamed on the US government.

Do you remember Hillary Clinton and Obama saying almost the same thing about the film that inflamed the middle east?

[hughee99]

23. There are many ways he could have phrased this.

I understand what's being discussed, but describing American's free speech rights as "The right to be stupid" is not the best way to phrase it.

My point was that this is not the first time Kerry has phrased a similar sentiment in such a way to make it easy fodder for the RW media.

[ProSense]

24. Oh brother.

"There are many ways he could have phrased this. I understand what's being discussed, but describing American's free speech rights as "The right to be stupid" is not the best way to phrase it. "

Maybe let the RW do their own work as that cherry picking worked out so well for them in 2006.

Kerry: "The reason is, that's freedom, freedom of speech. In American you have a right to be stupid - if you want to be."

That's a statement of fact, and there is no other way to "phrase it" because that is the point he was making.

Americans enjoy freedom of speech, and they have the right to express it even if it appears stupid. Go and read any article about Boehner and see that right being expressed precisely.

Still, one has to wonder when freedom of speech is being defended, why anyone would criticize such expression by mischaracterizing what was said and how it was said.

[hughee99]

26. You have the right to be stupid

You have the right to be wrong.
You have the right to say many offensive things.
You have the right to say things contrary to government policy.

All are statements of facts. The point he was making is that Americans have the right to say whatever they want. They have the right to say stupid, offensive or unpopular things.

People from ANY country have the right to BE stupid.

In 2006, they didn't take his words out of context, Kerry F'd up the joke.

[ProSense]

27. Freedom is wonderful, isn't it? n/t

[karynnj]

38. Actually they DID take his words out of context

Even taken verbatim, they do NOT mean that everyone who was in Iraq was stupid. Anyone taking it that way has no understanding of logic. (A implies B is not equal to B implies A. )

When some tried to defend the statement as said, Kerry immediately said he misspoke. The truth was he had a very bad cold and he skipped a word when reading from a card. Unfortunate, but not a scandal or anything that made him less than he was.

The fact is that people in many countries could not say some stupid things without legal consequences.

Kerry has been in public life for decades and at least since 2003, everything he has said in public has been parsed by the RW to pull out anything - even taken out of context - that could be used against him. Given the length of time, he has given them very little. (Compare to Biden or even Obama and Clinton in 2008. )

The fact is the comments he has made in London and Germany appear to have been well received and understood by the people he was speaking to.

[hughee99]

41. No, taken verbatim it means that if you don't work hard in school

and get a good education, you could end up in Iraq.

Kerry said he misspoke. He DIDN'T say that people weren't interpreting his words correctly or that it was taken out of context, merely that what he said was not what he intended to say. That's fine, people make mistakes all the time, but lets not pretend that what he actually did say initially isn't or should be offensive to some people.

His comments in 2006 seemed to be well received as well by the people he was speaking to, but that doesn't mean they weren't offensive to others. Why would Kerry explaining Americans "right to be stupid" be offensive to people in London or Germany anyway?

[blm]

46. The press knew damn well that Kerry merely dropped a pronoun because they'd heard the line before

and they had copies of his prepared remarks. Not one of them raised an eyebrow at the time, and it wasn't until RW bloggers found a way to twist it to fit their narrative that the rest of media piled on disingenuously.

[hughee99]

47. That's my point, they didn't HAVE to twist it!

"This is not what I intended to say" is a valid defense, but it doesn't make up for the golden sound-bite you provided the opposition. "What I did say doesn't mean what you think it means" (as some attempted to defend him with) is NOT a valid defense, it only makes the problem worse and kept the story alive.

This single misstatement put a bunch of Democrats on the defensive going into the 2006 midterms, and while you can say that you know what he really meant to say, it doesn't change the reality of what he did say. It wasn't just the media that piled on, you can find comments from people who knew better (including his predecessor, Sec. Clinton). Kerry is now the Sec. of State. The precise use of words is vital to his job, and I think he needs to be more careful about how he says things.

[blm]

60. Horsesh!t. Clinton was being opportunistic in cozying up to the RW then. It WAS twisted and to claim

it wasn't is pure HORSESH!T!

There were PREPARED REMARKS, fer chrissakes, and not one reporter covering the speech raised an eyebrow until LIARS - got that, hugh? - PROFESSIONAL LIARS twisted it for nothing but kicks. And there wasn't ANY serious political strategist in 2006 who believed Dems were in any danger - only OPPORTUNISTS like Clinton and her hit man Schumer, undermining Kerry in preparation for HER presidential run.

Tell your story to those dumbed down and naive enough to believe it. Some of us know BS we see it.

[karynnj]

67. Yes - and I remember that they were the likely culprits of the "Hey John" nonsense

attacking Kerry as he helped a huge number of 2006 candidates - both in person and with his PAC. The most notable one was Webb. Kerry endorsed Webb, who came close to swiftboating him in 2004 when he was the nominee and who would not shake his hand for 30 years. Kerry did this because he thought more vets in Congress was a good thing and he thought he had the best chance to win. It was money that Kerry raised that was used for his GOTV effort. Without Kerry, he possibly would have lost the primary - partly due to his obnoxious oped in 2004.

[karynnj]

66. Actually, I think there were many sickened by HRC's "inappropriate" comment

I think it hurt her with Democrats who took it as stabbing Kerry in the back. There were many things she could have said , but only if she believed Kerry deliberately demeaned vets and soldiers, would "inappropriate" be the right word. You don't say inappropriate for leaving out one two letter pronoun accidentally - when it was in the text given out before the speech and which he had already explained.

In fact, her comment may have come back to haunt her. Is it possible that her treatment of Kerry led to the Kerry and Kennedy endorsements of Obama? Even if it didn't, I suspect that had Kerry stayed in, he and Obama would have split the NOT Clinton vote and HRC would have won the nomination.

Speaking of precise use of words- and seeing that you mentioned Hillary, I think there is a bigger problem with anyone - especially one of Clinton's generation - that did not see that giving the Russian leader something with a big red button as a way to reset the relationship - is a bigger problem.

[YvonneCa]

62. It was a standard part of his...

...remarks during that time.

I attended this rally. He appeared exhausted from constant campaigning and botched the telling of a joke he often used. Media and RW piled on as they always do...

I wish people who pile on would actually listen to the speeches and remarks they complain about. But, then...if they did...they'd have nothing to complain about.

[karynnj]

65. True, but it does not mean that ALL the people in Iraq were there because they

did poorly in school = which is the damning way the Republicans parsed it. Kerry did point out that the comment as you stated it did not make sense as this was not Vietnam and there was no draft that would kick in when a college deferment was lost. It was a simple misreading of a joke written on a card. The fact that NO ONE in the US Senate had done more for Veterans over his years there and that he served is why this ended up not hurting him in MA in 2008 - or when nominated for SOS.

The fact is that people in both parties used the worst possible interpretation for their advantage. Including Hillary Clinton calling Kerry "inappropriate" - a word better suited to her husband's actions. It was NOT a decent comment for a man who skipped one two letter word. (She incidentally got more breaks for saying FOUR times that she was under fire in Bosnia as first lady, which was strange! )

In 2006, the comment was taken IN CONTEXT to be speaking of Bush given the lead in jokes. It was the repetition out of context that was a problem --- though the refrain "stuck in Iraq" repeated millions of time likely helped the Democrats who did far better than predicted even the Sunday before the election.

Every single politician makes gaffes which the 2006 joke was, but the key thing is that it said nothing negative about who Kerry is. For the recent comment - take it in context. Stupid is (I think) a euphemism for much darker words that he could have used to characterized some of the speech that is protected in the US though most good people strongly condemn it.

[wisteria]

48. Seems you harbor some Kerry resentment. And, for the record. everyone misspeaks now and again.

Everyone fumbles trying to remember or trying to find the right word. And, in the situation you memetioned from 2006, he inadvertantly ommitted a word. Come on, why help the RW continue to try and present a view of SOS Kerry that is wrong?

[hughee99]

50. Kerry's new job is very much about using the right words.

The situation I mentioned is from 2006, but it's about a very similar theme (stupid people being stupid). In my general experience, a politician calling people stupid usually doesn't work out well. A Sec of State going to a foreign country and describing our freedom of speech as "protecting the right to be stupid" probably isn't a good way to make the point he wants to make. I don't think it was a very wise way to say this, I expect more from our Sec. of State, and while I'm not giving Kerry NEARLY the ration of shit I might give repuke for a similar statement, I'm not willing to give him a free pass, either.

[politicasista]

51. Obama chose him for a reason

Last edited Wed Feb 27, 2013, 01:01 AM - Edit history (2)

Sorry he didn't chose anyone that was, or would have been perfect in your eyes.


Despite this and any other resentment people may have, continue to press on Mr. Secretary. Haters gone always hate.



edit to eliminate the rest

[hughee99]

52. Yep, haters gonna hate.

A well thought out dismissal of anyone who criticizes an Obama appointee.

I'm one of those people who doesn't like people who represent us at the highest levels making it look like they don't respect the people they're representing. I'm one of those people who isn't a fan of him lobbing softballs to the media. I'm one of those people who was represented by him since I was old enough to vote and KNOW that he knows better than this, and expect better from him. That's the "club" I joined.

[politicasista]

53. Sure, right

At least Obama shows more respect for decent people than most people ever will. Facts never get in the way of a Kerry dislike.

Thanks to those people for sticking up for our SOS in this thread. Peace.

[hughee99]

54. Exactly as I said.

It was not a wise thing to say. If a repuke SoS had said it, people would be all over them, not just for saying this, but for the impact it might have if they make another poorly worded statement in the future... but hey, this is our guy, so it's all okay.

As for those guys who think it's an issue, even a small one, I can read their minds. They just don't like Kerry. Any criticism of the administration plays into the repukes hands.

In general, the same generic defense/dismissal that you can see from some people on any issue. I can find exactly this same "defense" technique (really, a dismissal technique) when discussion drones, war crimes, trade agreements or virtually anything else.

[politicasista]

55. So blame only Kerry and not the media

that pounces on everything he says?

Wonder if the left, right, and center did the same when HRC was running the show? Probably not because Kerry is always a lighting rod, even here at DU 10 1/2 years later.

We just agree to disagree and Kerry can/will never do right in yours or anyone's eyes. Despite this, he should be fine.

[hughee99]

57. Yeah, Kerry is the "lightning rod" and HRC isn't.

Good luck arguing that on the DU or anywhere else.

We can certainly agree to disagree, and Kerry can/will never do wrong in yours or anyone's eyes. I think he'll probably be fine.

[karynnj]

69. The RW will attack both - the difference is that most of the mainstream media

built Hillary up as First Lady, Senator and Secretary of State.

I think you are ignoring the context, he was speaking to young people in an informal town hall. It was both well received and well attended. The comment IN CONTEXT is defending a level of freedom of speech that is unusual. There are many things that can be printed or said in the US that would be illegal in Germany. He was also speaking of the how it was related to tolerance.

This is not something that other statespeople have not spoken of. The reason is that in many countries - not Germany, but Egypt for example - there is disbelieve that things the US government completely disagrees with can be published (or if movies, made and distributed) The balance is hard - it is imperative to express how disagreeable the content is to (the speaker) as is the need to defend the right to say it. Both Hillary and Obama did so after the video - and both had the statements taken apart by the RW as "apologizing for our values". Kerry was speaking in a more informal setting, but he achieved the same balance.

[karynnj]

70. Kerry was at a town hall with young people

His language while chairing the SFRC hearings, speaking on the Senate floor, or working with other Senators in committee meetings is far more complex, far more precise and always very thoughtful. He was more informal when campaigning - and the criticism was more that he was still too detailed.

For the last 4 years, it was Kerry who Obama sent into several of the trickier problem areas - including spending hours with Kharzi to get him to follow his country"s election law, Sudan when it was falling apart and in probably the most difficult task - Kerry was sent to Pakistan to get Raymond Davies who killed two Pakistanis while working with the CIA. This was a few months before the US killed OBL - and before Kerry calmed things down, the Pakistanis were speaking of limiting the US CIA activities severely.

The fact is the Senate Republicans who know Kerry almost all voted for him. (As to the MA seat, the vote was after Brown's bizarre twitter nonsense and after rather strange Facebook posts. I don't think it was just the Senate seat == and it was clearly not for the Senate seat that Dick Lugar came to DC to attend Kerry's public confirmation.) Senator Corker, the ranking member on SFRC, had strongly praised Kerry several times in committee after Kerry helped Obama.

[wisteria]

61. And, it wasn't Kerry's words that were wrong, but the way some in the media chose to report them.

He knows more about doing his job correctly then I suspect you do. He was confirmed 97 to3. Seems he has the confidence of nearly 100% of the Senate. He certainly is no novice at this job.

[YvonneCa]

63. NO similarities at all. NONE. The only thing...

...in common is PILING ON.

[karynnj]

68. I don't remember any comments from you gor the early Hillary Clinton flubbs - and there were many

All more germane to her job than this. This was part of an answer to a question. It seems only the RW and some here are disturbed by it.

[wisteria]

44. Thanks, some media sources purposely took his words out of context.

Must be some left over 2004 Bush media supporters. This is so stupid of them. People have wised up to their tricks.

[YvonneCa]

33. Or maybe, he starts...

...an important discussion we need to have in this country?

[Kolesar]

19. I wish we could ban doctor killers like they banned Nazism

Doctor killers, clinic bombers, white supremacists, etc.

[Crabby Appleton]

21. Yes, but some people are abusing the privilege. nt

[Arugula Latte]

22. Stupid, Violent and Religiously Insane. Yay USA!

[Liberalynn]

59. Funniest thing I have read all day!

Thanks for the laugh!

[Tom Ripley]

25. Sometimes I fear we have a destiny to be stupid (it receives so much nurturing and encouragement)

[wisteria]

42. They take one insignificant comment and make a big thing out of it.

Why is this even important SOS news other than trying to mock Kerry and make it seem he was insulting Americans. I understood his point, anyone who read the entire article would understand his point, so why does the headline read like and insult? I am so sick of some in the media continuing to carry left over Repub water from 2004.

[Wolf Frankula]

49. Americans Have a 'Right' To be Stupid

But teabaggers overdo it.

Wolf

[TwilightGardener]

56. We not only have a right to be stupid, we revel in it, sadly.

[Liberalynn]

58. And some of them namely the Repukes excercise that right

with every freaking breath they take.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

64. Sounds like a right Fux Noise can support

Stupid people are their bread and butter.

[DeSwiss]

72. K&R