Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

BumRushDaShow

(128,979 posts)
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 03:50 PM Mar 19

Trump files US Supreme Court brief arguing for immunity from prosecution

Source: Reuters

March 19, 2024 3:28 PM EDT


WASHINGTON, March 19 (Reuters) - Former President Donald Trump on Tuesday filed a U.S. Supreme Court brief in his bid for immunity from prosecution for trying to overturn his 2020 election loss, with the case due to be argued before the justices next month.

Trump is appealing a lower court's rejection of his request to be shielded from the criminal case being pursued by Special Counsel Jack Smith because he was president when he took actions aimed at reversing President Joe Biden's election victory over him. The filing makes arguments similar to ones Trump's lawyers previously made seeking to shield him from prosecution, and echoes statements Trump has made on the campaign trail.

"The president cannot function, and the presidency itself cannot retain its vital independence, if the president faces criminal prosecution for official acts once he leaves office," the filing said. Trump, the first former president to be criminally prosecuted, is the Republican candidate challenging Democratic President Joe Biden in the Nov. 5 U.S. election.

Smith was appointed by U.S. Attorney General Merrick Garland in November 2022. In August 2023, Smith brought four federal criminal counts against Trump in the election subversion case, including conspiring to defraud the United States, obstructing the congressional certification of Biden's electoral victory and conspiring to do so, and conspiring against right of Americans to vote. The Supreme Court's decision to hear arguments on Trump's immunity bid on April 25 postponed the criminal trial, giving him a boost as he tries to delay prosecutions while running to regain the presidency. Trump has three other pending criminal cases.

Read more: https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-files-us-supreme-court-brief-arguing-immunity-prosecution-2024-03-19/



Link to filing (PDF) - https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/23/23-939/303418/20240319150454815_23-939%20-%20Brief%20for%20Petitioner.pdf


If at first you don't succeed, try try again and again and again and again and again and again and again and ag...
34 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Trump files US Supreme Court brief arguing for immunity from prosecution (Original Post) BumRushDaShow Mar 19 OP
As fucked as this conservative court is, I just can't imagine that they'll grant Aristus Mar 19 #1
I can see them granting Trump immunity in these cases AND saying it doesn't apply to Biden. ZonkerHarris Mar 19 #3
Similar to what they did when giving Bush the presidency in 2000! slightlv Mar 19 #9
exactly. That was what I was thinking about ZonkerHarris Mar 19 #22
So can i bluestarone Mar 19 #10
Agree. The malicious six will do ANYTHING to protect Trump. CousinIT Mar 19 #11
I agree. I have zero trust in them too not kiss Donny's behind BlueKota Mar 19 #14
Sammy the Rat will dust off BOSSHOG Mar 19 #27
Yup republianmushroom Mar 19 #17
Presidency has 230 years of functioning & it is co-equal not independent bucolic_frolic Mar 19 #2
He's playing his last card. Blue Idaho Mar 19 #4
They may not agree with the immunity argument but BlueKota Mar 19 #15
And when he loses the election Blue Idaho Mar 19 #20
I still think he plans on cheating somehow. BlueKota Mar 19 #25
Aren't they already hearing this argument in a few weeks? Is this a new one? A desperate psycho. nt Evolve Dammit Mar 19 #5
Am guessing this is all in support of that... BumRushDaShow Mar 19 #6
No immunity for traitors. Kid Berwyn Mar 19 #7
The case revolves around one point jmowreader Mar 19 #8
These lawyers must know they'll never get paid. intheflow Mar 19 #12
The few of them who know what they're doing NanaCat Mar 19 #32
All of the holders of the office before and after him didn't need immunity. SeattleVet Mar 19 #13
The root lie there is "official acts". They were not. Period. . . . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Mar 19 #16
I could swear this has already been ruled on. PoindexterOglethorpe Mar 19 #18
By multiple Appeals Courts BumRushDaShow Mar 19 #19
I agree. The fact that they didn't just let the DC Circut Ruling Stand BlueKota Mar 19 #26
Seeing as he has 6 of the 9 on the payroll I wouldn't be surprised if he wins. cstanleytech Mar 19 #21
Too many ramifications BumRushDaShow Mar 19 #23
I still think the main goal has always been to delay the trials. BlueKota Mar 19 #28
He can't use that to delay the state trials BumRushDaShow Mar 19 #29
The state trials give me some hope. BlueKota Mar 19 #30
Well civil court-wise with the half a billion dollar judgement BumRushDaShow Mar 19 #31
I love my state. 🤣 BlueKota Mar 19 #33
So, rallying a bunch of inbred thugs to... LudwigPastorius Mar 19 #24
Supreme Court should fine Trump's slimy corrupt ass for filing a frivolous appeal. creeksneakers2 Mar 20 #34

Aristus

(66,369 posts)
1. As fucked as this conservative court is, I just can't imagine that they'll grant
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 03:52 PM
Mar 19

all Presidents from now until forever immunity, certainly not Joe Biden, whom they hate.

They've got their well-paid, cushy little sinecure. They should just deny Trump's immunity plea, and let this country get back to healing from his disastrous administration.

ZonkerHarris

(24,226 posts)
3. I can see them granting Trump immunity in these cases AND saying it doesn't apply to Biden.
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 04:18 PM
Mar 19

That's how corrupt these 6 are.

slightlv

(2,801 posts)
9. Similar to what they did when giving Bush the presidency in 2000!
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 04:51 PM
Mar 19

They stated that was for only this case and no other cases behind or beyond this election. I always did say that sounded hinky right from the start. They appointed the president, but truly refused to take ownership of what they did.

I sure hope the same thing doesn't happen with *rump, but the thought has crossed my mind more than once, I'll have to admit. I absolutely do not trust this SCOTUS. They start from the conclusion they want, and then work backwards to make it so. If they can't find anything in law to back them up, they just make crap up. Typical R behavior!

CousinIT

(9,245 posts)
11. Agree. The malicious six will do ANYTHING to protect Trump.
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 05:34 PM
Mar 19

They have ZERO credibility and damn sure no sense of ethics or law. They are there to protect Trump, his MAGA cult, right-wing extremists, Talibangelicals, and billionaires and big corporations.

And that's all they're there for. That's why every one of them was nominated.

BOSSHOG

(37,055 posts)
27. Sammy the Rat will dust off
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 10:08 PM
Mar 19

An old tome of a 17th century witch doctor to make it all legal. Brett will dust off a six pack to celebrate the find. Ginni will tell slappy what trump wants him to do. Amy will pray away the minority. And John can’t wait to retire.

Blue Idaho

(5,049 posts)
4. He's playing his last card.
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 04:25 PM
Mar 19

No way even this SC will do anything so obviously political for that fuck head. No one is willing to front him half a billion dollars and no one is going to give his a get out of jail card. He is now going to have to confirm to the world that he is the biggest loser.

BlueKota

(1,728 posts)
15. They may not agree with the immunity argument but
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 06:06 PM
Mar 19

I still believe they have most likely
already given him what he was really after which is to delay the trial until after the election.

BlueKota

(1,728 posts)
25. I still think he plans on cheating somehow.
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 09:58 PM
Mar 19

I hope I am wrong, and I am just being paranoid, but the way the whole party is so blatantly defying norms like they have no concern what the majority of people think, or whether it might cost them votes, has me on edge. It's like everyone said oh Trump won't try to stay in office, but then he did try. Oh the court won't overturn Roe, but they did. Oh the court will just uphold U.S Court of Appeals on Presidental Immunity, but they didn't.

These people have already shown us they are willing to break long standing rules of conduct, so I can't just put blind faith, in their holding Trump accountable, and that he won't cheat, and that they won't help him cheat.

jmowreader

(50,557 posts)
8. The case revolves around one point
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 04:47 PM
Mar 19

Are illegal actions taken to overturn an election that you lost "official acts"?

No one's arguing that a lot of the stupid shit Trump did were official acts. Case in point: the deal Trump cut with the Taliban to end the Afghan War. While it was clearly the wrong way to run a railroad, it was an official act.

On the other hand, getting together a few thousand of your friends to attack the Capitol during the vote-certification process, causing slates of fake electors to be convened, making a "perfect phone call" - Trump's version of Eric Cartman singing a song about how bad he hates Kyle's mom; that never came out well - to overturn the Georgia election, or any of the other illegal things he did were NOT official acts, and can't be treated as such.

intheflow

(28,473 posts)
12. These lawyers must know they'll never get paid.
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 05:57 PM
Mar 19

Volunteering in the hopes of getting a cabinet position or something, I guess. But the joke will be on them if they’re successful. They know too much and will be disappeared under TSF’s authoritarian reign, should that horror ever come to pass.

NanaCat

(1,112 posts)
32. The few of them who know what they're doing
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 10:17 PM
Mar 19

Got retainers before they lifted a finger for him. Big retainers. It's the Tier-3 crowd like Alibaba or whatever her name is, who would be dumb and grasping enough to take the job without cash up front.

I'm shocked that so many people, even on DU, don't realize that good lawyers, especially criminal lawyers, are used to dealing with...you know...criminals, and thus know better than to trust a maybe someday payday from any of them. You get the pay up front, reimburse the client if anything's left over later. You never trust the word of a potential criminal. That's just common sense.

SeattleVet

(5,477 posts)
13. All of the holders of the office before and after him didn't need immunity.
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 06:00 PM
Mar 19

It seems like he's the only one that has a pressing need to be immunized against criminal prosecution, for some reason.

Wonder why...

PoindexterOglethorpe

(25,857 posts)
18. I could swear this has already been ruled on.
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 07:02 PM
Mar 19

Obviously I'm wrong.

Still, hasn't he lost every single case so far?

BumRushDaShow

(128,979 posts)
19. By multiple Appeals Courts
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 07:30 PM
Mar 19

D.C. Circuit - D.C. Circuit panel rules against Trump’s immunity claim

2nd Circuit - Second Circuit strikes down Trump’s request for presidential immunity

That's why pundits and others feel this is ridiculous for them to even take this.

(this is not counting all the "Executive Privilege cases that went on before this)

BlueKota

(1,728 posts)
26. I agree. The fact that they didn't just let the DC Circut Ruling Stand
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 10:07 PM
Mar 19

like most former Judges and Prosecutors thought they should, has me nervous too about what the six might be trying to pull.

BumRushDaShow

(128,979 posts)
23. Too many ramifications
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 08:36 PM
Mar 19

because the current President could then pick up the phone to "Seal Team 6" and have a nice chat.

BumRushDaShow

(128,979 posts)
31. Well civil court-wise with the half a billion dollar judgement
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 10:17 PM
Mar 19

they pretty much already have. We'll have to stay tuned for next week (March 25).

LudwigPastorius

(9,145 posts)
24. So, rallying a bunch of inbred thugs to...
Tue Mar 19, 2024, 09:32 PM
Mar 19

attack the Capitol and seize control of the lawful government was an “official act”?

I don’t think so, asshole.

creeksneakers2

(7,473 posts)
34. Supreme Court should fine Trump's slimy corrupt ass for filing a frivolous appeal.
Wed Mar 20, 2024, 12:28 AM
Mar 20

Today, Trump's attorneys filed an appeal with the Supreme Court dealing with his immunity claim for his criminal trial for among other things trying to steal the 2020 presidential election. The appeal is filled with nonsense.

Most of it is about whether a president can be criminally charged for his official acts. Its always been the law that official acts can be covered by immunity. Trump is not being charged for official acts. Nobody should seriously believe that carrying out a seven state conspiracy to create fraudulent electors was an official act. None of the charges against Trump are for official acts. They are for crimes.

Still the appeal rambles on, claiming Trump is charged with things like "communicating with the Vice President, the Vice President's official staff, and members of Congress to encourage them to exercise their official duties in the election certification process in accordance with the position, based on voluminous information available to President Trump in his official capacity, that the election was tainted by extensive fraud and irregularities." The appeal doesn't mention that Trump was trying to get the lawful vote of the electoral college to be thrown out when he was doing that.The appeal doesn't mention that Trump was informed by many that the election was in fact not tainted. It doesn't mention that the activity they name is NOT what Trump was charged with.

The appeal goes on to rephrase what happened too with other crimes to things that Trump was never charged with but they claim he was.

The appeal cites the landmark case Marbury v Madison. Trump's lawyers must be nuts to think they can fool anybody with that. Marbury v Madison is considered the most important case ever and every lawyer has had it covered in law school.

Marbury v Madison says:

"It follows, then, that the question whether the legality of an act of the head of a department be examinable in a court of justice or not must always depend on the nature of that act.

If some acts be examinable and others not, there must be some rule of law to guide the Court in the exercise of its jurisdiction.

In some instances, there may be difficulty in applying the rule to particular cases; but there cannot, it is believed, be much difficulty in laying down the rule."

Marbury distinguished between two kinds of official acts: discretionary and ministerial. Marbury said discretionary acts were not reviewable. But Marbury also said "when the legislature proceeds to impose on that officer other duties; when he is directed peremptorily to perform certain acts; when the rights of individuals are dependent on the performance of those acts; he is so far the officer of the law; is amenable to the laws for his conduct; and cannot at his discretion sport away the vested rights of others." Marbury made very clear that there is no immunity when the law is violated.

Trump's lawyers cited language from Marbury but only from the parts about the discretionary acts that weren't reviewable. They left out the rest.

Trump's lawyers also had lots to say about Presidents never being criminally prosecuted before and that's true. But Nixon probably would have been if Ford hadn't pardoned him. Clinton would have been too had he not reached a deal with a special prosecutor to give up his law license for five years and pay a steep fine.

Trump's lawyers tried to frighten the court with claims that if immunity is not declared that every president in the future would suffer from endless legal harassment. But it always been assumed that presidents could be charged with crimes. Congressional investigations from opposing parties have endlessly investigated trying to find them. While he was in office Nixon said, " when the President does it, that means that it is not illegal, by definition." Most people thought it was funny when he said that. Still, our presidents have managed somehow. The fact that no charges have been filed shows the Trump lawyer scenario doesn't happen.

Trump's lawyers have other arguments to that are also fruity. I've always considered the world immunity to mean that somebody could never be prosecuted. Trump's lawyers insist that presidents are immune but if they are impeached then the immunity magically disappears. I don't know how they can claim something so crazy with a straight face. The Circuit Court of appeals points out that impeached judges used that and other Trumpster arguments. The courts that heard them called the claims "tortured."

The Supreme Court has done all it could to drag its feet to benefit Trump. They pushed oral arguments for the immunity case all the way to the last day they would be in session - or for as long as they possibly could. Delay benefits Trump and if he can get elected and take office before the cases are over he can pardon himself. He says he won't but he's one of he biggest liars in history and I don't believe for a second he won't do it.

The Supreme Court has given the issue for appeal as: "Whether and if so to what extent does a former President enjoy presidential immunity from criminal prosecution for conduct ALLEGED to involve official acts during his tenure in office." What could they possibly mean by ALLEGED? Things start out alleged but courts are supposed to decide if they are real or not before applying the law. Will the court end up with some absurd ruling that Trump trying to create fraudulent electors was an official act because he ALLEGED it was? If they do that I'm going to be very angry. Probably angrier than I've ever been. They just made a ridiculous ruling about Trump's ballot access. I think these corrupt bastards might do far worse.

Latest Discussions»Latest Breaking News»Trump files US Supreme Co...