Romney paid 14.1 percent effective tax rate in 2011

[Playinghardball]

Source: NBC NEWS


Mitt Romney paid an effective tax rate of about 14 percent last year, his campaign said Friday while also announcing that the Republican presidential nominee had paid an average annual effective tax rate of about 20.2 percent between 1990 and 2009.

Romney made good on its pledge to release his tax returns from 2011 before the election, and went a step further than was previously anticipated in releasing a certified summary of his tax returns over a two-decade period preceding 2010.

While the full tax documents won't be made available until a little later this afternoon, the Republican's campaign said Romney paid more than $1.9 million in taxes on income of about $13.7 million. That amounts to a 14.1 percent effective tax rate; the tax level is lower because most of the Romneys' income comes from investment, which is taxed at a lower rate than employment income.




Read more: http://firstread.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/09/21/14015361-romney-paid-141-percent-effective-tax-rate-in-2011?lite

[progressivebydesign]

1. I'm SO PISSED!! The MSM better say that Mitt tweaked 2011 to actually PAY in that much!!!

Seriously. If the fucking media doesn't get this, I just give up. He had ALL campaign to tweak 2011 and has NO compunction about paying in the 1.94 million in taxes TODAY, to make him look like he pays a alot.

An the "summary of tax rates" FUCKING WORTHLESS!!! Doesn't matter what his fucking tax rate was, because we all know that guys like that take very single loophole, trick, loss, etc, so that what they're paying on is next to nothing. 13% on nearly nothing is still nearly nothing!!!

And think about it. He made 13 million on his investments last year.... do the math. and how much is he hiding overseas? And did he take the amnesty? I hate that asshole.

[George II]

12. I want to see his deductions and write-offs, etc.............

Yes, I'm sure he changed this year's to make them look "better" because of the election. How much do you want to bet that he files an amended return later this year if (WHEN!) he loses the election?

He's a weasly shiftless scumbag, just like most of Big Business.

And don't worry, the press will be all over this, mostly because of MSNBC show hosts. They won't be able to ignore this one Ed, Rachel, and Lawrence tear the numbers apart.

[progressivebydesign]

19. that's what I thought, too! They'll file an amended return later. What a sleazeball. nt

[cordeg]

38. Wow -- You've packed a lot of misunderstanding into one post!

"Seriously", your pissed because you don't understand taxes at all and are blinded by prejudice and partisanship.

When they discuss Romney's EFFECTIVE tax rate -- not MARGINAL rate -- they are starting with his TOTAL income (a big fat $20M or so) and dividing it into his TOTAL tax (a big fat $3M or so). THEREFORE, this is calculated BEFORE -- not AFTER -- ANY deductions OR adjustments at all. For example, it does NOT include the $4M or so he paid to charity, nor any other "tricks" (say, like the "trick" you might use where you deduct your mortgage interest, etc.).

Here's the FACT of the matter direct from the IRS as published by the Obama administration's Department of Commerce: the average American couple filing jointly --as the Romney's do -- earning up to $40K pays an EFFECTIVE income tax that's NEGATIVE. At $50K, you break even with an average EFFECTIVE rate of 0.1%. By $100K, the average EFFECTIVE rate has risen to just 10%. The Obama Commerce Department has chosen to end the published table at that point, so it would take a bit of time to get percentages for higher incomes, but those figures already cover the "middle-class" that has been led to believe they pay more than rich people.

The lie promulgated by the lap-dog press comes from telling people that the ~14% rate Romney paid is a result of the fact that his income is from capital gains and interest, which has a MARGINAL rate of 15% rather than the MARGINAL rate of 25% - 35% paid by many Americans. People who don't know better think that Romney's 14% results from deductions made that lower it from the 15% MARGINAL rate so that their own rate would similarly be just a bit under their own MARGINAL rate of 25% or 35%. HOWEVER, the reality is that Romney's rate is very close to his MARGINAL rate of 15% simply because MOST of his income taxed at the MARGINAL rate (i.e., making the two rates almost equal) whereas the average middle-class person/couple pays an EFFECTIVE rate that is a fraction of their MARGINAL rate (which is merely the rate charged on those dollars earned ABOVE the next lower tax bracket). So, if your MARGINAL rate is 25%, your EFFECTIVE rate is most likely 1/4 of that. If your MARGINAL rate is 35%, your EFFECTIVE rate is most likely at most 1/3 of that.

So, progressivebydesign, YOU are STILL paying a LOWER EFFECTIVE tax rate than Rich Romney. Sorry to burst your bubble of ginned-up hate.

Also, the reason many people invest in CERTAIN foreign countries (say, the Caymans) is to HIDE their income from taxes. However, the REASON everyone in the press knew that Romney had investment accounts in some of these countries is because HE REPORTED THEM all the way back when he was releasing returns as Governor. So, he clearly wasn't doing it to hide the money, but to diversify and find better rates of return. As to his other foreign investments, these are very much like the foreign investments President Obama has (he claimed foreign taxes of over $22K, which means he earned enough outside the US to pay that much in taxes). Sorry, once gain, no great controversy or breaking news there either.

Really, you might want to think about therapy to allow you to live your life and be happy without requiring a boogeyman to fear and loathe. It's a much better way to live.

[MIDNITERIDER1438]

42. No Pain, it's Plain His Gain.

Absolutely clinical feelings here for a deceitful corporate suit who deludes himself to be a leader instead of only a controller.

"A major reason for the Romneys' relatively low tax rate was that $5.5 million of their income in 2011 came from 'carried interest,' a form of compensation for private-equity executives that's accorded the low 15% capital-gains federal rate. (Mckinnon and Murray, September 21, 2012)

(Mckinnon and Murray, September 21, 2012) "Reflecting the complexity of Gov. and Mrs. Romney's investments, the couple reported $3.5 million in foreign income, on which they paid taxes. They also filed various forms reflecting holdings in the Cayman Islands, Switzerland, Ireland, Germany and elsewhere."

"Romney manages this low rate because he takes his payments from Bain Capital as investment income, which is taxed at a maximum 15 percent, instead of the 35 percent he would pay on 'ordinary' income, such as salaries and wages. Many tax experts argue that the form of remuneration he receives, known as carried interest, is really just a fee charged by investment managers, so it should instead be taxed at the 35 percent rate. Lee Sheppard, a contributing editor at the trade publication Tax Notes, whose often controversial articles are read widely by tax professionals, is nonplussed that the Obama campaign has been so listless on the issue of carried interest. 'Romney is the poster boy, the best argument, for taxing this profit share as ordinary income,' says Sheppard." (Shaxson, "Where the Money Lives", "Vanity Fair", Aug 2012)

(Shaxson, "Where the Money Lives", "Vanity Fair", Aug 2012) "But administrative guidance says you can do this kind of thing only if the compensation is in recognition of past services you have provided. 'This should not mean retired from the mother ship 10 years out and getting profits you had nothing to do with,' Sheppard says, adding that Romney can get away with it because of excessive 'administrative indulgences' that have allowed a 'perversion of the law in favor of a small class of overcompensated investment managers.”

Refs:

(Mckinnon and Murray, September 21, 2012)

http://professional.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444032404578010451626055738.html?mod=ITP_pageone_0&mg=reno64-wsj

(Shaxson, "Where the Money Lives", "Vanity Fair", Aug 2012)

http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/2012/08/investigating-mitt-romney-offshore-accounts

[FourScore]

2. It's not his tax returns. It's a summary of them. Prepared by PricewaterhouseCoopers.

Why doesn't he release the real deal? Hmmm...Must by something in there he doesn't want us to see. And I'll bet it's BAAAAD.

[progressivebydesign]

4. Exactly. 2011 is "complete" but the others are summaries of his "tax rate"

not even any details at all. What the hell is that guy hiding??? and is the media savvy enough to ask??

[JDPriestly]

10. It's complete -- AND the tax rate is a bit higher than in the year previously released.

Interesting.

I wonder what taxes Romney is including when he claims to have paid an average of 20.2% of his income in taxes in previous years. Is he including property tax payments? What is he including?

[Zoeisright]

3. I'm so angry.

That piece of shit paid HALF of the tax rate I did. And I earned my money by WORKING. He should have paid at least 40%. I hate repukes and I REALLY hate the 1%.

[smirkymonkey]

37. +10,000

I can't even tell you how p***ed off I am about this. I pay a higher percentage of my income than most millionaires and billionaires. All because I can't afford some sleazy tax accoutant and can't offshore the tiny bit of savings that I do have.

[Ash_F]

5. I doubt it was even that high... /nt

[valerief]

6. Where are the tax returns where he got Swiss bank account amnesty???? nt

[MIDNITERIDER1438]

43. Good Question

The details of the tax amnesty for all depositers in the UBS Swiss bank accounts has been kept confidential in the agreement between the U.S. government and the industry. Remember the UBS whistleblower incident ? I do believe that's related to the disclosures. Otherwise we would know nothing.

[SoapBox]

7. I'll just bet that his Book Cookers, had to really sweat to make it look like he paid even this much

Two old sayings:

1. The Devil is in the Details

and

2. Figures Lie and Liars Figure

[progressivebydesign]

20. Hell, you know he's willing to pay 1.94 million in taxes to win this..

and when he loses, go back and file an amended return. But more important, will the media buy this?

[jonesgirl]

8. I want to see his stock portfolio...

And I want to know who/what are his best interest. Romney opened up the wrong can of worms when he spoke against 47%, and possibly more, Americans.
Romney is poison

[BlueStreak]

9. Let me guess. Virtually no ordinary income tax, almost all tax was the billionaire's rate of 15%

It isn't hard. If you have $1,000,000 of income and give $100,000 to "charity" (which in fact is a gigantic financial enterprise) and then use loopholes to treat the rest of the income as long term capital gains at the special billionaire's rate of 15%, your tax bill is 15% of $900,000 = $135,000. That works out to 13.5%

So if Romney paid 14%, he either didn't give 10% to the Mormons or else he treated a very small amount of his income as ordinary income, paying ordinary income tax on it.

And please understand that none of this addresses all the money that is sheltered, such as the magic IRA in the Cayman Islands. When you add in the sheltered money, his effective tax rate is MUCH lower.

[GreenTea]

11. Romney has released just the last 2 years (2010 & 2011) - Get real!

Romney thinks that's enough? Get real......

What is Mitt so desperately hiding? he should of released at least the past ten years....His dad released a dozen years....but not old Mitt - What are you hiding Mitt?

[progressivebydesign]

22. Well that's all "you people" deserve! It's just "so hard" ya know.

They're now calling Ann #moneyBooHoo on twitter.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

13. How do we know these documents are authentic? I don't trust Robme!

[grok]

14. So this means he gave 45 percent of his income.

1.9 million taxes(2.5 million deduction)
4 million to charity

This is actually calculated to make him look good but it doesn't because almost nobody in the media emphasizes the charitable giving...

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-57517962-503544/romney-paid-14.1-percent-tax-rate-in-2011/


for reference Obama gave away his nobel peace prize winnings so it sort of puts him in the same category...

[DallasNE]

36. When Romney Filed For His Extension

He indicated he expected to get a $200,000 tax refund. Where does that stand? Also, wouldn't this charitable gimmick effectively wipe out the anticipated refund? lastly, I don't know how you can retroactively alter last years charitable contributions. Either you gave or you didn't.

[citizen blues]

15. The full documents are to be released later this afternoon? WTF!!!!!

Doubt it'll happen.

Wonder how much in Foreign Tax Credits he took in 2011. His 2010 returns showed almost half a million dollars.

[tokenlib]

16. He underclaimed charitable deduction to boost tax rate--will amend in Nov...

A lot of us would bet on it. He'll amend after election day..

[skeewee08]

17. so he gave more to charity than he paid in taxes?????

[shireen]

18. who certified the summary? nt

[bluestateguy]

21. I paid a higher rate

I was just looking at mt 2011 returns and I paid a slightly higher rate on an income of about $65,000.

I refuse to consider giving money to the LDS to build another temple as charity.

[progressivebydesign]

23. Seriously, those temples are ridiculously lavish mansions...

and they only help their own. Like an expensive pyramid scheme.

[MIDNITERIDER1438]

44. Actually not true.

From a CBS news report I believe ? I recently saw in it's entirety and showed a central warehouse distribution center. I think doctrinally they allow virtually anyone anywhere to apply for a one-time "help package", and I've been told by friends in Idaho they are quite liberal in their giving to the less fortunate. Quite organized though, even more than the Salvation Army.

[DallasNE]

24. This Doesn't Pass The Smell Test

Last edited Fri Sep 21, 2012, 11:31 PM - Edit history (1)

In the two years he relesased he pays 14% and in the 20 years he doesn't release he pays 20.2%? Also, his 2011 income of $13.7 million is considerably below his earlier 2011 esitmate. That needs some explaining.

We know why his earlier 20 years would have a higher rate -- the Bush tax cuts. There is reason to believe that Romney has paid about the 14% rate since the Bush tax cuts kicked in and suggests that the Bush tax cuts resulted in a 50% savings, i.e., that the first 12 years he hasn't release he likely paid at about a 28% rate -- still low for someone in his income bracket. That still doesn't explain why his income in 2011 came in 35% below his estimate. With his record on truth being so low I don't trust his "summary" of 20 years any more that I trusted Nixon's transcripts of Watergate related conversations.

[cbdo2007]

28. 2011 estimate?? How much had he estimated his income would be??? Probably offshore somewhere....

cause I doubt a businessman like him wouldn't know how much money they expected to bring in in any given year. If there's one thing they know, it's money.

[DallasNE]

34. His Estimate Reported $20.9 Million In Income

Or $7 million more than what he filed.

http://www.mittromney.com/learn/mitt/tax-return/2011/wmr-adr-return

[RoccoR5955]

25. What he banked overseas in tax-free countries would be more interesting

It would be nice to know where he shipped his money so that he paid this little!
We all know that he hides his funds overseas, but how much.

I also think that this "investment" tax rate of 15% is WAY too low. Yeah, people may risk their money, but how about those of use who RISK OUR LIVES and pay between 20 and 35%? Shouldn't we get a bigger break?
Why is investment money more valued than labor money. Inquiring minds wanna know!

[Fgiriun]

29. Low capital gains tax rate

equating to higher investment is a distortion of reality. Consumer demand leads to job creation and growth. The 'job creators' deserve a bigger share of the pie myth is the main reason economies break down.

[MIDNITERIDER1438]

45. We'll never know, and neither will the IRS.

"Why would anybody (or anybody’s blind-trust manager) put his money in the Cayman Islands if there were no tax benefit? Douglas Holz-Eakin, a former Congressional Budget Office Director who advised John McCain’s presidential campaign in 2008, and now runs a conservative think tank, offered this explanation a couple of days ago on the National Review Web site: ' Almost everybody with a global business has a Cayman subsidiary, as do many U.S. colleges and universities. Why? First and foremost, any venture interested in having the participation of foreign investors needs a location that has a strong rule of law, well-developed financial services, and is outside the reach of the IRS. International investors need the protections and financial services, and have no desire to have their investments entangled with the IRS. The Caymans, along with Bermuda, the Bahamas, and others fit the bill." (Noah, "Romney Claims No Tax Advantage In The Caymans", "The New Republic", Sept 21, 2012)

(Noah Sept 21, 2012) "Now, it’s my understanding that the IRS is in business to collect taxes. So if you want your money to be “outside the reach of the IRS” that means you don’t want the IRS to take it away. How can Holz-Eakin and Romney claim otherwise? It turns out they’re playing word games. The taxes you evade by putting your money in the Caymans aren’t your own personal income taxes, but your offshore investment fund’s corporate income taxes."

(Noah Sept 21, 2012) "In striking contrast to nearly every other developed country, the United States continues to tax worldwide earnings of corporations. Thus, for example, if an international investment [firm] headquartered in the Caymans earns $100 in Brazil, it will first pay the $15 in tax due to Brazil. For other international investors, that is the end of the story."

(Noah Sept 21, 2012) "U.S. investors, however, must then pay a second layer of tax to the U.S. government, bringing their tax rate up to the U.S. level of 35 percent. This additional $20 is owed, however, only when the earnings are brought back to the United States (“repatriated”). If the funds merely flow back to the Cayman-based subsidiary, the tax is not yet due."

Ref:

(Noah Sept 21, 2012)

http://www.tnr.com/blog/plank/107610/romney-claims-no-tax-advantage-in-caymans

[MFM008]

26. desperate to change the subjest

Millard is, funny isnt it .

[Fgiriun]

27. I think a lot of people are missing the point

That even though this guy paid an insanely low tax rate (in my opinion should be at least twice as much) he is campaigning on policies that would reduce his taxes even further. This should indicate the character of a guy that criticizes others of being lazy yet aspires to give himself million of dollars through tax breaks. Alas, the conservative mentality is quite sadistic so little can be done to convince them.

[patrice]

30. So? I'm still interested in his relationships with his FOREIGN BANKING friends. nt

[krawhitham]

31. Mitt-Ann-Romney-Tax-Return-2011-as-released-by-campaign

http://www.scribd.com/doc/106589436/Mitt-Ann-Romney-Tax-Return-2011-as-released-by-campaign

[DallasNE]

33. Compare And Contrast To 2011 Estimate

His estimate listed $20.9 in income but now his actual comes out at $13.7 in income. Time for somebody to staart up the compare and contrast and what the differences are. Over $7 million on the income side is huge and I don't understand why he would not have had the exact amount to report on income. Every penny of my income is represented on a form sent to the IRS so there is absolutely no wiggle room on income.

http://www.mittromney.com/learn/mitt/tax-return/2011/wmr-adr-return

[ellenfl]

32. the nail in his coffin if exposed . . .

"Mitt and Ann Romney also donated about $4 million -- about 30 percent of their income -- to charity in 2011, though they only claimed a deduction of about $2.25 million from those donations, according to the campaign.

That means the Romneys voluntarily paid a higher tax rate than they were legally required, which the campaign said they did in order to stay consistent with Romney's pledge to never play less than a 13 percent tax rate."

in other words, he did not take the deduction he took all those prior years which essentially negated his tax liability. kinda stupid to point that out. he just proved what harry reid has been saying. he's been paying little or no taxes!

ellen fl

[nycbiscuit]

35. here's what I want to know

In January the estimate he released said he'd earned $20.9 million in 2011. The actual return lists $13.7 million. What happened to the $7 million?


Also, why the hell is PwC still pushing this "taxes paid plus donations equals way more than 15%" BS? Just because the LDS requires a tithing does not make it a mandated liability in terms of tax discussions.

[wordpix]

39. good question for IRS to pursue but I won't hold my breath

They seem to go after people like my friend making $10/hr. in menial labor jobs. Both she and her ex claimed their child as a dependent, and you would have thought she was a real criminal the way the IRS went after her. This was during the * years. She had to hire a lawyer to get it all straightened out.

[fascisthunter]

40. entitled lying prick.... go move to Somalia!

[MIDNITERIDER1438]

41. What A Schlemiel !

Besides getting that extension to doctor the charitable amount to keep the campaign pledge to a certain percentage, this shows that he probably still has those blocking accounts to shield the completely unexplained stuffed IRA that had impossible deposits from time to time.

"Mysteries also arise when one looks at Romney’s individual retirement account at Bain Capital. When Romney was there, from 1984 to 1999, taxpayers were allowed to put just $2,000 per year into an I.R.A., and $30,000 annually into a different kind of plan he may have used. Given these annual contribution ceilings, how can his I.R.A. possibly contain up to $102 million, as his financial disclosures now suggest?" (Shaxson, "Where the Money Lives", "Vanity Fair", Aug 2012)

"All we know is really that it's a big number, and we're a little bit baffled as to how it got so big,' Sheppard says.
Candidates list their assets in broad ranges, so we know Romney's retirement account is worth somewhere between $21 million and $102 million. Law professor Ed Kleinbard of the University of Southern California says that's a lot of money considering the most Romney could ever contribute to the account was $30,000 a year." (Horsley, NPR, Sept 23, 2012)

(Horsley, NPR, Sept 23, 2012) "Either Gov. Romney is sort of the modern-day equivalent of Jack and his magic beans, who somehow created a mighty beanstalk, or he took a very aggressive position with respect to valuing insider stock,' Kleinbard says."

And all those Cayman/Bermuda accounts in his so-called "blind trust" to keep running that 15% max tax rate he enjoys as "carried interest" only allowed as compensation to certain ACTIVE private-equity execs, even though he claims to have retired from Bain long ago. This IS unethical on it's face.

He's been flat out lying about the "blind trust" administrator, even though it's been publicly know that it's one and the same as his own privately retained lawyer, so he can keep the "attorney-client privilege" going to direct the accounts discreetly.

"The Romneys’ blind trust was created when Mitt was elected governor of Massachusetts. (...)The director and president of this entity is R. Bradford Malt, the trustee of the blind trust and Romney’s personal lawyer." (Shaxson, "Where the Money Lives", "Vanity Fair", Aug 2012)

(Shaxson 2012) “What Romney does not get,” says Jack Blum, a veteran Washington lawyer and offshore expert, “is that this stuff is weird.” (...) The Washington Post summarized the opinions of experts across the political spectrum by saying Romney’s disclosures were “the most opaque they have encountered.”

So Rmoney's foreign holdings are his own best examples of some of the numerous loopholes that he claims he will close to support his "revenue neutral" magic budget.

As if these shortcomings weren't comprehensible to the average voter, much less the average investor. Give me a break (too) !

Refs:

(Shaxson 2012)

http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/2012/08/investigating-mitt-romney-offshore-accounts

(Horsley, NPR, Sept 23, 2012)

http://www.npr.org/2012/07/19/157002254/tax-professionals-scrutinize-mitt-romneys-returns

[Evasporque]

46. I paid about 30% on income < 100k....

tell me the system isn't tilted to a wealthy advantage....