Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

appalachiablue

(41,169 posts)
Thu Nov 29, 2018, 11:30 PM Nov 2018

Federal Employees Are Warned Not To Discuss Trump 'Resistance' At Work

Source: New York Times

By Charlie Savage, 3 hrs. ago.

WASHINGTON — At workplaces across the United States, it is routine for Americans’ conversations to turn to President Trump — whether his policies are good, whether he should be impeached, what to think about the “resistance.” Some drink from MAGA mugs; others tape cartoons to their cubicle walls portraying Mr. Trump as a Russian quisling.

But roughly two million people who work for the federal government have now been told that it may be illegal for them to participate in such discussions at work — a pronouncement that legal specialists say breaks new ground, and that some criticized as going too far. Generally, federal employees have been free to express opinions about policies and legislative activity at work as long as they do not advocate voting for or against particular candidates in partisan elections.

But in a guidance document distributed on Wednesday, the independent agency that enforces the Hatch Act, a law that bars federal employees from taking part in partisan political campaigns at work or in an official capacity, warned that making or displaying statements at work about impeaching or resisting Mr. Trump is likely to amount to illegal political activity.

The guidance was issued by the Office of Special Counsel, an independent agency that enforces the Hatch Act, including by investigating complaints of improper political activity and recommending discipline — like a reprimand or firing — for violators. The agency also enforces the Hatch Act against state and local government officials whose salaries come from federal grants. (The agency, led by Henry Kerner, is not related to Robert S. Mueller III, the special counsel appointed by the Justice Department). -MORE...

Read more: http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/federal-employees-are-warned-not-to-discuss-trump-%e2%80%98resistance%e2%80%99-at-work/ar-BBQh3QR?ocid=HPCOMMDHP15



The reasoning behind the guidance centers on the fact that Mr. Trump is already running for re-election in 2020. It contends that arguments about his policies or impeachment prospects are effectively statements in support or opposition to his campaign.

“We understand that the ‘resistance’ and ‘#resist’ originally gained prominence shortly after President Trump’s election in 2016 and generally related to efforts to oppose administration policies,” the guidance said. “However, ‘resistance,’ ‘#resist’ and similar terms have become inextricably linked with the electoral success (or failure) of the president.”




- Speaking in support of or against the “resistance” to President Trump in a federal workplace would probably be illegal, according to an independent government agency.
24 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Federal Employees Are Warned Not To Discuss Trump 'Resistance' At Work (Original Post) appalachiablue Nov 2018 OP
Did they also crack down on anything that shows support for Trump? Marie Marie Nov 2018 #1
Speaking as a federal employee bluevoter4life Nov 2018 #16
Thanks for that info. Marie Marie Nov 2018 #21
They'll have to speak in Cha Nov 2018 #2
(Stealing the pic!) lastlib Nov 2018 #14
lol.. Have at it, lastlib! Cha Nov 2018 #15
Much like the French Resistance was outlawed by the Nazis. Farmer-Rick Nov 2018 #3
Sounds unenforcable, unConstitutional too. bitterross Nov 2018 #4
Speaking as a former federal employee, Haggis for Breakfast Nov 2018 #13
Trump uses his free speech to tell lies and its illegal for us to use free speech to tell the truth. marble falls Nov 2018 #5
That's a perversion of the Hatch Act marybourg Nov 2018 #6
This message was self-deleted by its author appalachiablue Nov 2018 #7
So whatever happened to the complaints that Kellyanne and several other WH sinkingfeeling Nov 2018 #8
They've been doing this. From the moment Trump filed his eligibility with the FEC Solly Mack Nov 2018 #9
I don't like the way the pResident uses the military as a backdrop as if every one of the Doitnow Nov 2018 #10
As a retired Fed this pisses me off!!! 50 Shades Of Blue Nov 2018 #11
Once again, the Office of Special Counsel oversteps its legal authority Haggis for Breakfast Nov 2018 #12
This is unenforceable DeminPennswoods Nov 2018 #17
Mid 70s Vista orientation..told about hatch act dembotoz Nov 2018 #18
The Office of Special Counsel is hardly "independent" these days Ramsey Barner Nov 2018 #19
FUCK HIM and his BLACKMAILING RUSSIAN BOSSES turbinetree Nov 2018 #20
I'm a retired Fed and when I was working everyone I worked with lilactime Nov 2018 #22
Yeah, that will set them at each others throat... Maxheader Nov 2018 #23
Can they discuss "Individual #1"? JustABozoOnThisBus Nov 2018 #24

Marie Marie

(9,999 posts)
1. Did they also crack down on anything that shows support for Trump?
Thu Nov 29, 2018, 11:37 PM
Nov 2018

Seems to me, the law should work both ways.

bluevoter4life

(788 posts)
16. Speaking as a federal employee
Fri Nov 30, 2018, 02:25 AM
Nov 2018

Can confirm. The Hatch Act specifically prohibits activites for or against a candidate while on government property or time. They crack down as much for Trump as against.

lastlib

(23,272 posts)
14. (Stealing the pic!)
Fri Nov 30, 2018, 01:17 AM
Nov 2018

Righties go ballistic about "Happy Holidays"; others get upset about "Merry Christmas"--this could be the perfect happy medium!

Farmer-Rick

(10,202 posts)
3. Much like the French Resistance was outlawed by the Nazis.
Thu Nov 29, 2018, 11:47 PM
Nov 2018

To support a resistance movement is always made illgal by those illegally occupying a government.

 

bitterross

(4,066 posts)
4. Sounds unenforcable, unConstitutional too.
Thu Nov 29, 2018, 11:47 PM
Nov 2018

First, let me say, I think Federal workers would be wise to not discuss the President at work anyway. We don't do it where I work because we all have to work together and it's best to not create friction.

Having said that though, avoiding talk of the President is probably darn near impossible to do 100% of the time.

Haggis for Breakfast

(6,831 posts)
13. Speaking as a former federal employee,
Fri Nov 30, 2018, 01:02 AM
Nov 2018

this is totally illegal. Even federal employees have First Amendment rights that cannot be abridged by the Office of Special Counsel.

We were never permitted to advocate or politicize (We weren't even allowed to wear political buttons during elections.) but this is beyond the reach of OSC to demand, much less enforce.

Response to marybourg (Reply #6)

Solly Mack

(90,780 posts)
9. They've been doing this. From the moment Trump filed his eligibility with the FEC
Fri Nov 30, 2018, 12:24 AM
Nov 2018
Trump officially filed his eligibility with the FEC on January 20, 2017 - this has been pretty much the rule at work for my husband.

The "formal" announcement for reelection came later (February 2018, I think) but he filed his intent on the same day as the inauguration.

They were briefed at work about it after Trump filed with the FEC.

That's how long it has been going on.



Doitnow

(1,103 posts)
10. I don't like the way the pResident uses the military as a backdrop as if every one of the
Fri Nov 30, 2018, 12:31 AM
Nov 2018

participants is a supporter.

Haggis for Breakfast

(6,831 posts)
12. Once again, the Office of Special Counsel oversteps its legal authority
Fri Nov 30, 2018, 12:58 AM
Nov 2018

and makes a sweeping proclamation that will NEVER stand up in court. No surprise there.

I worked for the federal government for years. This is unenforceable, illegal and will not stand up in a court of law. Even federal employees have First Amendment rights that cannot be abridged by the OSC.

DeminPennswoods

(15,290 posts)
17. This is unenforceable
Fri Nov 30, 2018, 05:51 AM
Nov 2018

By way of anectdote, during the Clinton admin, the military at my command were known to be passing around emails denigrating Clinton. They were told from the top to stop and respect the commander-in-chief, but never did. No one was ever punished as far as I knew.

Ramsey Barner

(349 posts)
19. The Office of Special Counsel is hardly "independent" these days
Fri Nov 30, 2018, 07:52 AM
Nov 2018

The Special Counsel, Henry Kerner, previously worked for Cause of Action (formerly the Freedom Through Justice Foundation), which received plenty of dark money from conservative donors and the Koch brothers.
https://osc.gov/Pages/about-bio.aspx?ID=36
https://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/Cause_of_Action

Cause of Action funded negative reporting on ACORN, unions, and the NLRB (created to protect unions).

lilactime

(657 posts)
22. I'm a retired Fed and when I was working everyone I worked with
Fri Nov 30, 2018, 05:04 PM
Nov 2018

knew how much I hated Nixon/Reagan/Bush/Bush. Of course, most of my coworkers hated them too!

I was never shy about expressing my political opinions and the only constraint that was every put upon me was that I was told to remove my Bill Clinton bumper sticker when I parked in the building's courtyard because the only people allowed to have political bumper stickers were Schedule C's (i.e., people who got their jobs via political connections).

Maxheader

(4,373 posts)
23. Yeah, that will set them at each others throat...
Fri Nov 30, 2018, 06:06 PM
Nov 2018

Another really dumb shit proclamation by the ruskys satellite government..
Latest Discussions»Latest Breaking News»Federal Employees Are War...