Uber Hit With Cap as New York City Takes Lead in Crackdown

[brooklynite]

Source: New York Times

Even as Uber has become one of Silicon Valley’s biggest success stories and changed the way people across the globe get around, the company has faced increased scrutiny from government regulators. It has also struggled to overcome its image as a company determined to grow at all costs with little regard for its impact on cities.

On Wednesday, the tech giant was dealt a major setback in its largest American market after the New York City Council voted to cap Uber vehicles and other ride-hail services, providing a model for other cities that are trying find ways to rein in the company.

The City Council approved a package of bills that will halt new licenses for Uber and other ride-hail vehicles for a year while the city studies the booming industry. The legislation also allows the city to set a minimum pay rate for drivers.

The new rules will make New York the first major American city to restrict the number of ride-hail vehicles and to establish pay rules for drivers. New York’s aggressive stance raises questions over Uber’s growth as the company, which has been valued at $62 billion, plans to move toward an initial public offering next year.

Read more: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/08/nyregion/uber-vote-city-council-cap.html

[lapucelle]

1. It's a good move.

Another Taxi Driver in Debt Takes His Life. That’s 5 in 5 Months

Mr. Chow, 56, who lived in Queens and went by the nickname “Kenny,” disappeared on May 11. His body was found floating in the East River about nine miles south, near the Brooklyn Bridge, on Wednesday. Friends and family members believe Mr. Chow jumped to his death, adding to a string of apparent suicides of traditional taxi and livery drivers in the city. It marked the fifth suicide in just over five months. The medical examiner has not yet determined a cause of death.

New York City’s cab industry, dependent on the market value of the once-coveted taxi medallion, has been upended by the proliferation of Uber and other ride-sharing services. Drivers have been demanding changes at City Hall to protect their livelihood, but at least five cabbies have buckled under the strain of debt since December as others describe working 12- and 14-hour shifts to make up for the lost income. One driver shot himself in February outside City Hall after leaving a message on Facebook blaming the industry’s demise on politicians.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/27/nyregion/taxi-driver-suicide-nyc.html

[msongs]

2. uber is not that great for its employees. nt

[DeminPennswoods]

7. According to Uber, they don't have employees

only independent contractors over whom Uber exercizes absolutely no control.

[appalachiablue]

3. Lyft and Uber, issues over employees in San Fran, Britain, more,

Last edited Thu Aug 9, 2018, 12:11 PM - Edit history (1)

- San Francisco throws down gauntlet to Uber, Lyft, A subpoena follows a landmark California legal decision,- Think Progress, May 31, 2018.

Uber and Lyft are in the regulators’ cross hairs again — this time, in their own backyard. The City Attorney of San Francisco, Dennis Herrera, issued a subpoena to Uber and Lyft on Tuesday to figure out whether or not they classify their drivers as employees or contractors. Ride-sharing companies like Uber have long argued that, because they function as an intermediary “technology company” connecting the passenger and the driver, they can classify their drivers as independent contractors — meaning they get to avoid giving them traditional employee benefits.

“[San Francisco’s laws] guarantee employees basic humane benefits like sick leave, health care, and paid parental leave. We are not going to turn a blind eye if companies in San Francisco deny workers their pay and benefits,” Herrera said in a statement. “If your company is valued at $62 billion, you can afford to give your workers health care.” In April, the California Supreme Court unanimously ruled to limit businesses from classifying workers as “independent contractors,” which limits their access to key worker protections like minimum wage, health care and rest breaks...

But major markets are finally cracking down on Uber. Last November, a British employment tribunal ruled that Uber drivers needed to be classified as workers and receive protections such as minimum wage and paid time off. In April last year, Uber threatened to leave Seattle over the city’s collective bargaining law, which some drivers at the time were ecstatic about...https://thinkprogress.org/san-francisco-uber-lyft-drivers-independent-contractors-7fdd838563a5/

[Sherman A1]

4. Good

If they want to be a cab company, then they should be a cab company and spend the money necessary to do so.

[MichMan]

10. By making the drivers spend hundreds of thousands for a medallion?

"That was where the police found the man’s parked taxicab, the biggest investment of his life. The man, Yu Mein Chow, had taken out a loan seven years ago to buy a $700,000 medallion that gave him the right to operate a cab."

It appears that Mr. Chow was an independent contractor and not an employee either.

[Sherman A1]

13. I would suggest a look at post #5

These companies are establishing a two tier system in the taxi cab business and that is exceptionally unfair. Yes, the medallions cost a bundle, but if one elects to take that on, should they then be subjected to a system in which their competitors do not have to do so?

Please explain just how that is fair or likely to have helped Mr. Chow?

[groundloop]

5. Great News. They've attempted to operate as an unregulated cab company for years

This is long overdue. They screw their employees and put their customers at risk because their vehicles are generally not insured for commercial use.

[christx30]

11. They're filling a need that Taxis simply don't.

I have been stranded places at 2am because the taxi company couldn't seem to get anyone out to me within 2 hours or more. If I had had access to Uber of Lyft at the time, I would have used them. Screw taxis.

[EllieBC]

22. Be careful. Some posters will question your credentials.

You have to be willing to suffer for the good of the industry or some shit.

[Snellius]

6. Silicon Valley seems to think they are a futuristic universe unto themselves.

With high ideals of changing the world but with little regard for their impact on the communities they affect and little regard for the human costs. Apple's profits are obscene. Google has become our collective brain. Facebook kills friendship. Amazon kills neighborhood business and local jobs. Just so we can get a trendy pair of running shoes at $10 less. Insatiable consumption of stuff we don't really need. And yet we can't live without it. We're hooked.

[Little Star]

8. Good!

[MichMan]

9. Seems like the Medallions are the biggest problem

"That was where the police found the man’s parked taxicab, the biggest investment of his life. The man, Yu Mein Chow, had taken out a loan seven years ago to buy a $700,000 medallion that gave him the right to operate a cab."


Why should anyone have to go that far in debt just to try and earn a living by driving a Taxi ?

[marble falls]

16. That's bullshit. We're not talking about CPAs or Rocket scientists: we're talking about lower ...

middle class jobs that wealthy people have gotten into the middle of by controlling medallions. They niether sow nor reap, they just own the tractors and the wagons.

Here, inform your opinion:

Author: Miranda KatzMiranda Katz
business
03.28.18
06:38 pm

https://www.wired.com/story/why-are-new-york-taxi-drivers-committing-suicide/

Why Are New York Taxi Drivers Killing Themselves?
Symbolic coffins at a Wednesday protest by New York taxi drivers to mourn a series of recent suicides.
Mary Altaffer/AP

It was a somber scene outside New York’s City Hall on Wednesday afternoon. Four coffins sat at the foot of the steps; one by one, taxi drivers covered them with white flowers, before assembling on the steps and shouting for the city to “stop Uber’s greed” and “stop making us slaves.” It was the second such gathering in two months, as drivers and their advocates mourned another suicide that they attribute to the rise of ride-hailing services like Uber and Lyft. That sudden increase in the number of for-hire vehicles on the city’s streets, they claim, has made it impossible for drivers to earn a decent living.

On March 16, Nicanor Ochisor, a 65-year-old yellow cab driver, took his own life in his Queens home. According to his family and friends, he had been drowning financially as his prized taxi medallion, on which he had hoped to retire, plummeted in value. The circumstances surrounding Ochisor’s death were upsettingly familiar: In February, driver Douglas Schifter shot himself outside City Hall after posting a lengthy statement to Facebook blaming politicians for letting the streets get so saturated. According to the New York Taxi Workers Alliance, a nonprofit group that advocates for drivers, at least two other drivers have killed themselves since December in response to mounting financial pressures.

<snip> the rest of the article at the link.

[JonLP24]

12. About time

[marble falls]

17. Are you sure you're on the right site?

[EllieBC]

18. So we have to support an industry that fails people?

Vancouver refuses to let Uber or Lyft in. The result has been an underground rideshare program because people are sick of waiting 2 hours for a taxi and then being treated horribly by the driver and charged ridiculous rates.

I'm not a protectionist. If you can't do your job right you don't get forced support.

[marble falls]

19. What like sugar, corn and soy growers and processors or even the successful industies like ...

steel, oil etc?????? You do know that the soda pop biz and the cereal industry would die if sugar prices weren't supported by your tax dollars. You'd starve a taxi driver but not the head of ConAgra?

BTW who's supporting Uber? They don't need medallions. That's part of the problem, Uber lowers the wages of medallioned cab drivers and the wealthy medallion owners who have never ever driven a taxi keep raising there leases rates to drivers. The problem isn't the job, its the ownership of the medallions.

Are you sure you're on the right site? This is about working people being screwed by the wealthy exactly because without the Micael Cohens and the Jared Kushners nobody would be stealing their earned wages. The driver owns the car and pays for its maintenance, the only skin in the game the fat cats got is this and ONLY this:

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.2380970.1443692247!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_750/pdir0631-phi-j0093-jpg.jpg

[EllieBC]

21. If you think I'm on the wrong site feel free to report me.

I'm not going to be intimidated by you.

Many posters here have said they've used rideshare services. Better start reporting them because they don't like waiting 2 hours for a taxi.

[marble falls]

23. I'm asking if you really feel that way about the working people in this country while ...

people like Michael Cohen and Jared Kushner get a free ride on the working man and woman's back if maybe you're on the wrong site.


Do you know what the medallions is about. These are auctioned off every year and "investors" like Jared and Michael who don't give a poop about you or their drivers speculate with driver's livelihoods and pay any price to get them: how much can they gyp people before they quit, and then they line up another person like you and me to gyp.

I don't want you to leave, but you really do need to read up on the issue:



Author: Miranda KatzMiranda Katz
business
03.28.18
06:38 pm

https://www.wired.com/story/why-are-new-york-taxi-drivers-committing-suicide/

Why Are New York Taxi Drivers Killing Themselves?
Symbolic coffins at a Wednesday protest by New York taxi drivers to mourn a series of recent suicides.
Mary Altaffer/AP

It was a somber scene outside New York’s City Hall on Wednesday afternoon. Four coffins sat at the foot of the steps; one by one, taxi drivers covered them with white flowers, before assembling on the steps and shouting for the city to “stop Uber’s greed” and “stop making us slaves.” It was the second such gathering in two months, as drivers and their advocates mourned another suicide that they attribute to the rise of ride-hailing services like Uber and Lyft. That sudden increase in the number of for-hire vehicles on the city’s streets, they claim, has made it impossible for drivers to earn a decent living.

On March 16, Nicanor Ochisor, a 65-year-old yellow cab driver, took his own life in his Queens home. According to his family and friends, he had been drowning financially as his prized taxi medallion, on which he had hoped to retire, plummeted in value. The circumstances surrounding Ochisor’s death were upsettingly familiar: In February, driver Douglas Schifter shot himself outside City Hall after posting a lengthy statement to Facebook blaming politicians for letting the streets get so saturated. According to the New York Taxi Workers Alliance, a nonprofit group that advocates for drivers, at least two other drivers have killed themselves since December in response to mounting financial pressures.

<snip> the rest of the article at the link.


BTW: I didn't alert on the moron that got hidden. I don't think you've broken any rules. Live long and prosper, but first please read the article.

[EllieBC]

25. The medallion system is broken.

It is the same way here in Vancouver. They limit the amount of taxis that can be out there. As a result people have to wait ridiculous amounts of time and have taxis just not show up or be subjected to poor treatment by drivers and exorbitant fees.

Is this supposed to be some sort of bread line that we all wait in but don't complain because it's for the good of somebody?

Fix the system. Let there be more taxis.

[marble falls]

26. But two posts ago you wrote that if the workers can't get enough pay they ought to go get new jobs..

I am glad you have an open mind and can evolve an opinion. This what we all should be able to do here, I'm glad you're one of us!

[EllieBC]

27. That is not what I wrote.

I said people aren't supporting a broken system anymore which is why Uber and Lyft are popular. The taxi system is broken.

[marble falls]

28. That broken system, just the Yellow cabs alone represent over 13,000 medallions and over ...

50,000 drivers according to http://www.nyc.gov/html/tlc/downloads/pdf/2014_taxicab_fact_book.pdf.

That's the bady you'd throw out with the bath water of "So we have to support an industry that fails people?", I mean I thought you understood that when you said, "So we have to support an industry that fails people?"

The system worked just fine since 1937. Iwas meant to keep cabbies with a living wage. Then the Rich got involved, from wikipedia:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicabs_of_New_York_City

<snip>
The medallion system was created in 1937 as a government imposed limitation on the supply of taxicabs, requiring that a "medallion" be purchased for the right to operate a taxi. Thereafter, New York did not sell any medallions until 1996, when it auctioned slightly more than 2,000. The lack of new medallions resulted in such a shortage that by 2014 they were selling for more than $1 million each, with about 14,000 medallions in existence. Since then, the increase in rideshare vehicles, which number over 63,000 as of 2017 has drastically reduced the market price of medallions.[1][2][3]

<snip>

Its not the medallion system, its the fat cats being allowed to glom medallions after 1996. Over night drivers went from small businessmen to wage slaves. The system worked until outsiders were allowed to bid on medallions.

Guess who was the Mayor in 1996? His name rhymes with Rudy Giuliani, the one following was Bloomberg.

Its not so complicated: Republicans wanted to raise the profits of the medallion auction and for the first time ever allowed non taxi drivers/companies to bid on them. At the same time they deregulated livery enough to allow Lyft. Uber and other ride services while keeping the medallions in the hand of the wealthy.

The system wasn't broken until Republicans fixed it. Medallions allow the city to control and regulate the cab industry and it used to benificial for medallion drivers. It wouldn't be hard to fix.

Get the non industry holders of medallions out of the mix, and regulate the ride services. A special medallion regime sounds about right.

[christx30]

29. So how would you fix the medallion

system to actually serve the customer? Because if you ban Uber and Lyft, they are going to be the ones screwed over. The last time I used a cab was in November of 2015. I was trying to go home from work at 9pm. I rode my bike as far as I could in freezing temps, and locked it up and called a cab. Over the next 3 hours, I called them about 12 times begging them to dispatch someone, anyone, to pick me up. They pretty much said that they’d get to me when they got to me. I tried to text a friend of mine to see if I could pay her for a ride home, but my phone died after I said, “hey... wanna make a quick $20?”
So I walked home 9 miles.
If Uber or Lyft we’re available to me then, I’d have used them after 30 minutes, and would have gotten home way earlier.
I don’t give a crap about protecting the jobs of people that would strand me in freezing temps. Show up and do your job, or I’ll use someone else.
The reason cabs are losing business to ride share is they fail, at a fundamental level, to pick up people in a timely manner, then they overcharge them. If taxis did a good job, no one would use ride share.
Do you think a 2 or 3 hour wait is a reasonable price that customers should endure?

[MichMan]

24. The responsibilty for the medallion issue is on the City of NY

They decided to set up a system where it is required to own a medallion and then limited the number of them that were available.

[marble falls]

20. I guess he was on the wrong site after all.

[MichMan]

30. Surprised to see so many defend the current taxi model

The city has artificially limited the number of medallions; there were no new ones issued from 1937-1996 nearly 60 years! 2000 more were issued in 1996. This drove the price up to over a million dollars each. That's $1,000,000 just for the right to operate a taxi !

What did the medallion owners get for their money? A virtual monopoly with no competition that treated cab riders terribly because they had no other viable options. Not only that, it didn't treat the drivers any better either by charging them exorbitant fees for the privilege of driving; many were in the hole by over $100 before they even started their shift with sometimes bribes needed to get a good route.

For all the talk about how Uber exploits their drivers, the taxi business treats theirs even worse. Yet many here are defending the medallion system and the taxi industry . I don't get it.



https://priceonomics.com/post/47636506327/the-tyranny-of-the-taxi-medallions

[LanternWaste]

31. As surprising as throwing George Takei under the bus when it fits a narrative