Kucinich says he can attract disenfranchised Democrats AND Trump supporters

[TomCADem]

Source: Daytona Daily News

Ohio governor candidate Dennis Kucinich cant be pinned to just one political philosophy, which is why he is considered a populist.

Hes a lot like U.S. Sen. Bernie Sanders, more so than any of the other candidate seeking the Democratic Partys nomination in the May 8 primary. Sanders was a political rock star among millennial and young voters during his 2016 presidential run. But he didnt fit the partys mold for a presidential candidate and often went against the status quo.

Kucinich, a former Cleveland mayor and congressman, still living in the same house he bought in 1971, is pushing for affordable health care, a ban on assault rifles and fracking, and free college tuition.

He also said he is energizing millennials, and was endorsed in February by the of Sanders-backed Our Revolution and recently endorsed by Hamilton County Commissioner Todd Portune.

Read more: https://www.daytondailynews.com/news/kucinich-says-can-attract-disenfranchised-democrats-and-trump-supporters/FscwdVsLw60yb6SvRM9QNI/

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I wonder whether this is part of a trend where Democrats try to triangulate between Trump supporters and Democrats by attacking President Obama, "establishment" Democrats, being pro-Russia, attacking trade, preaching tariffs, pro-Fox News, and attacking immigration while also pushing gun control and health care reform?

Put another way, are there such thing as Trump Democrats who are racist and sexist, but otherwise progressive? Or, does Fox News just promote such folks in order to create a wedge among Democrats?

[bettyellen]

1. There are no Trump Dems- only idiots who think Dems are the same as Republicans. If they dont know

The difference by now, they’re morons.

[sharedvalues]

3. Seriously. Absolutely true.

[TomCADem]

4. Perhaps Modern Triangulation Is Between Extreme Right and Left

In the 1990s, Bill Clinton triangulated between moderate Republicans and Democrats. However, perhaps Trump and some progressives will triangulate on issues common to the far left and right such as being suspicious of globalism, trade and immigration. Back in the early 2000s, some folks on the left were actually very supportive of CNN's Lou Dobbs' efforts to scapegoat immigrants.

[bettyellen]

8. Yeah, we have to mock their paranoia- because theyre Libertarian assholes- not Dems.

And they need to be called out for their nationalist paranoia and nihilism

[Farmer-Rick]

33. Well Dobbs was attacking W and his authoritarian neo liberal economic policies long before

Any liberal media existed on television or cable.

He ranted against policies that were destroying the American middle class. And then he turned anti immigrant like a rabid dog.

He always had a bit of a racist streak, but when Keith Olbermann came to the scene, I think he tried to differentiate himself and went crazy anti immigrant.

But his anti neoliberal economics stance was what drew many liberals to him.....until he went rabid.

[TomCADem]

61. Plus, Russians Hate Neoliberals. They Will Never Win Nowadays

...we should instead stretch our vernacular and support a neochromatic referendum, which can ease the transition toward a more neoprogressive paradigm.

Instead of a free market or command economy, we use an economy based on love and respect where taxes are based one's character and the intrinsic worth of the soul as measured by retweets by REAL people only slightly amplified by foreign bots.

[vi5]

64. Exactly!

Look how well trickle down has treated us all.

If Dems just agree to cut spending and social programs a little more, and not raise taxes, and provide just a few more tax breaks to big companies, and continue to privatize public services then things are going to work out great. Success is just around the corner!!

That approach hasn't been failing us because it's bad and people don't like it, and it's been proven wrong by all empirical data time and time again. it's been failing us because dirty hippies aren't clapping loudly enough.

[Farmer-Rick]

66. OMG, that is so funny

And some people actually believe what you wrote.

[True Blue American]

17. That was before

Dobbs daughter was shown to have illegals working on her horse farm.

He then left CNN for Fox! Now,he is just a hate filled, ranting old fool.

[vi5]

31. So when I hear a Democratic candidate say that he/she...

..is "A different kind of dem" or that they are going to "rise above partisan politics", or any of the multiple variants on this selling point about themselves, all of which imply either that the Dems are also somehow at fault for our current state of affairs or that there is something wrong with being a traditional Democrat......I should assume they are a moron?

Or is only specific Democrats who are allowed to say this?

I mean my point is, if someone running for office has a D after their name but appears ashamed of what the Democratic party stands for and has tried to do over the past however many years........should I assume that they are a moron who is trying to divide the party and spread this myth that Democrats are just as much to blame for "partisan politics" as Republicans are?

I mean I do think that, but I'm just making sure what the current rules are on here.

[Farmer-Rick]

35. Dems who claim they are a different kind of Dem

I think, are claiming their anti neoliberal economics ideals. Let's face it, the last few Dems in the presidency were cheer leaders for neoliberal economics. I remember when democratic leaders said we all believe in free trade. Am, sorry, no "we" don't.

But when they claim our crumbling democracy is the fault of the Democratic party, they have left reality behind.

[vi5]

38. Not from what I see...

I agree about our entire Democratic party establishment is beholden to neoliberal (meaning Reagan era Conservative) economic policies.

But usually the "different kind of Dem" I see and hear is a conservadem/blue dog trying to distance themselves from traditional Democratic positions.

Even Obama was guilty of this on a lot of economic issues, and things like public education.

[Farmer-Rick]

40. Oh, I see what you're saying

The different Dem goes against traditional democratic values, not the newer neoliberal economic policies introduced by RepubliCONS.

I get it now. Yes I agree.

[vi5]

43. Right...

...and for point of clarification anyone who goes against the newer, neoliberal economic policies introduced by the Republicans is a fringe leftist disruptor who wants a pony and doesn't understand how civics works and on and on and on. For example:

Bernie runs a primary campaign against an establishment dem: "It's bad because he's not a Dem!"

Dennis Kucinich runs a primary campaign against an establishment dem: "It's bad even though he's a Dem!!!"

If a liberal Democrat says something bad about Democrats from the left: "They are dividing the party!!!!"

If a conservative Democrat says something bad about Democrats from the right: "They are just doing what they need to in order to win!!!!"

[stranger81]

53. You really nailed it.

Your last four sentences are a good summary of about 40% of this board's traffic over the last few months.

[TomCADem]

63. Reject neoliberal policies in favor of a neoprogressive...

...neochromatic, neo-pacifistic platform.

[TomCADem]

62. We should support neoprogressive policies instead...

...nt

[Farmer-Rick]

65. What are neoprogressive policies?

Not sure what they are. Progressives, for the most part, support traditional Democratic values.

[TomCADem]

67. As Dennis Kucinich Explained, Policies That Appeal To Both...

...disaffected Democrats and Trump supporters. Dennis Kucinich is a classic neoprogressive.

[sharedvalues]

2. So he can split the Democratic vote.

Like Stein and Nader.

Great. Russia and Rove paid Stein and Nader because they wanted to split the D vote and help republicans.

[karynnj]

5. He's running in the Democratic primary

What he should be asked is to promise as Sanders did that if he runs in the primary and loses, he will not run as an independent in the general election.

Does anyone from Ohio know the process and when someone has to apply to be on a general election ballot as an Independent?

[former9thward]

7. This issue and question comes up every four years.

Most states, and almost all of the major ones, have 'sore loser' laws. These laws say that if you run in a party primary for an office and lose you can't run as an independent or third party for that same office. Because of these laws someone who runs for president in the D or R primary could not run in enough states to get even close to the 270 electoral votes needed.

[karynnj]

10. That's why I asked about Ohio and the governor race nt

[former9thward]

24. Ohio has a sore loser law and it would apply to the governor's race.

This is an article on Ohio's laws. It actually is a article speculating whether Trump could run in Ohio if he lost the R nomination in 2016. Some legal experts are not sure of the constitutionality of the laws but so far they have not been struck down.

http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2016/03/13/could-trump-run-as-an-independent-if-gop-stops-his-nomination.html

[karynnj]

42. Thanks - nice to know nt

[True Blue American]

18. Dennis has always

Been a Democrat. Great Mayor when he was young, fought the Utility companies.

But he has been out of Politics too long. He could give us Mike DeWine and that makes me nervous.

Sherrod Brown beat Mike in the Senate. The DeWine became AG. He has done a lot of showy things,like shutting down drug clinics. He postured for days over the mass murder in Piketon. Never solved it for all his posturing.

[vi5]

44. How could he "give" them Mike Dewine?

If he doesn't get a majority of the Democratic primary votes, then he is not the Democratic nominee.

If he does get the majority of the Democratic primary votes, then that means he has the support of a majority of the Democratic party in that state.

Isn't that how primaries work? If he wins, what makes someone think the other Democratic candidate would would be more likely to win?

Or are we so past the point of no return that we don't even trust Democratic voters to pick the best candidate any more?

From the sound of it on here lately it seems like maybe what people want us to do is figure out who the most centrist, conservative Democrat is in every primary race and then just hand them the nomination without an actual primary.

[True Blue American]

45. Yes,that is how Primaries work

And if Dennis happened to win he would give us Mike DeWine. And that would be a catastrophe for my state.

Why do you think we voted for Sherrod Brown to replace Mike? He is a political hack of the worst kind.

[vi5]

32. Uh....Kucinich is a Democrat...

..not sure how he can split the Democratic vote in a primary race.

[More_Cowbell]

6. He denies Trump-Russia collusion

It will be proven to be true by the time he runs, so I hope that takes the wind out of the sails of his supporters.

[mr_lebowski]

9. Fuck Kucinich and his basket of sound bytes. He really thinks his group of positions is a winner?

That there's 'Trump' voters who'll support someone with that collection of liberal ideas? Not gonna happen. They HATE the idea of things like 'affordable health care' and 'free college', for example. After all, the Coloreds, the Islamists, and the Mexicans might apply for college or get admitted to hospitals ... thus 'stealing' their hard-earned tax dollars.

At the same time he also has a collection of right-wing ideas, like not supporting a woman's right to choose, and he doesn't seem to have much bad to say about Dump either.

As an ever-more-pathetic-appearing triangulator, his 'platform' seems to be built on 'things he thinks that most people want', not any truly deeply-held beliefs.

Further, he is looking more and more like a tool for GOP/Russian interests who seek to divide Democrats into two camps ... acting to hobble the party's chances at election time.

It'd be one thing if we had a parliamentary system i.e. we didn't have a 'winner take all' two-party system in the USA, but unless and until that situation somehow changes, we're going to have to settle for trying to get Democrats elected and then pressuring them into advocating for progressive policies.

If we DID, I would definitely be voting for a party that was more overall left-leaning than the average Democrat of today ... someone around say Bernie and Jerry Brown ... I'd be happy to vote for someone to the LEFT ... of Hillary, for example.

We DO NOT, and therefore we cannot, let ourselves be divided the way that Kucinich, and sad to say at this point, Bernie (not that I don't support many of his positions and causes) are likely to do to us come 2020.

There's 2 options in the USA right now, Dems and GOP. Period. Politicians trying to straddle the line and be 'both' must not allowed to divide our party. I want a 'more progressive' option as much as ANYONE, believe me. I'd have been happy to vote for Bernie in 2016 ... but also happily switched to supporting Hill when she won the nomination. All DECENT FOLK must be willing to do the same.

Our side won't peel off a single 'Tea Party' voter just because a GOP candidate is too 'mainstream', always keep that in mind if you're thinking of not voting cause the Dem on your ballot doesn't pass your litmus test(s) for liberalism. The REST OF US DO IT!!!

[True Blue American]

19. That is the reason

Dennis lost his seat in Congress.

[dalton99a]

11. Kucinich is a Trump supporter and collusion denier:

[NurseJackie]

22. Sickening.

[MBS]

29. " " " " " n/t

[highplainsdem]

12. Malcolm Nance tweet on Kucinich: Russians call them "useful idiots"

Link to tweet

[dalton99a]

13. +1

[True Blue American]

20. Dennis wants

His 15 more minutes.

[paleotn]

21. He's already had it....

Go away, Dennis. You're done.

[Lint Head]

14. We do not NEED Trump supporters.

[Historic NY]

15. ...

[pbmus]

16. Reminds me of Dennis the Menace...

[Vinca]

23. Dennis is doing a smaller version of Bernie which means the GOP will win Ohio.

I used to admire Kucinich, but at some point he went to the dark side along with Ed Schultz, so he's dead to me. Go away, Dennis. Just go away.

[True Blue American]

25. Funny you should mention Ed

He became a Bernie supporter. Ed was a Republican until his wife convinced him to turn.

She used to answer personal emails when Ed first came on MSNBC.

Then Ed changed drastically! MSNBC let him go. I listened to him on the web for a while until he became too hysterical.

Do not forget Bernie backed Trump on Amazon. He and Dennis are both spoilers. What credibility Bernie had with Dems is gone,thanks to his personal attacks on Out Party.

We need to stick together as Dems.

[Historic NY]

26. The guy who's entire career was 2 post offices.

I'm beginning to equate 'popularism' with bullshitting.

[katmondoo]

27. I think not!!!

We do not need another big talk and no action person

[beachbum bob]

36. how much help did Kucinich give hillary to defeat Trump...

thats my guideline.....if no help in electing hillary then you are as bad as trump and his corrupt GOP

[elocs]

28. No true Trump "supporter" would ever vote for a Democrat.

The most hard-right tea partier will always vote for the Republican candidate even if they do not agree with that person because they don't want the Democrat to win much in the way that many Republicans who didn't like Trump voted for him anyways because they didn't want to see Clinton become president. They fight in the primaries but unite behind their candidate in the general election because they understand that the winner will be either the Republican candidate or the Democratic one, a concept that many on the Left have problems grasping.

[Maeve]

30. He can say anything he pleases

I'm voting Cordray.

[vi5]

34. I'm confused...aren't Democrats allowed to run in Democratic primaries?

Have we really gotten to the point where that is frowned upon?

Why is it o.k. when certain Dems run from or against the party establishment but not others?

Can someone please provide me a rule book? I mean I hear all the time when people criticize certain red state dems who seemingly run counter to the party establishment and distance themselves from the party or distance themselves from President Obama, or signal anything less than contempt for Trump that "At least they are running within the party.......they will vote as a Democrat.......they vote with us 75% of the time......that's what they have to say to win in that state!!!!"

So explain to me how anything Kucinich is doing is any different than that?

If we're going to say it across the board and demand that every Democrat agree with the Democratic party platform across the board then I'm all for that. But I was told that was a "purity test" and those were bad so.....not sure what Kucinich is doing that is so different than say how Joe Manchin runs.

And last I checked Ohio was.....wait for it....a red state.

[True Blue American]

46. You really have to live

Here and know the Politics of Ohio.

[vi5]

47. I probably do....

From what I know Brown is fairly progressive considering how the rest of the state seems to be trending, isn't he?

I'm definitely not saying Kucinich is the best bet or anything other than a gadfly at this point.

I just get frustrated at the constant calls on here to just concede everything to the Democratic party establishment, with no questions asked and no fight at all. I didn't mean to transfer that frustration to this specific fight, a lot of the posts just seem to have that tone though. Not yours, which are obviously informed accurately by living in the state.

[True Blue American]

48. Thank you for that.

We have spent the last 8 years watching Kasich defund public Schools so his wealthy friends could steal tax payers blind opening Charter Schools.

Scandal after scandal of Charter Schools, cheating on tests,paying people $10 an hour to mak tests, lying about how many students they had,etc, the Republican Legislature restored his funding cuts to Education. It was so deep they could not stomach it.

He tried to kill Public Unions the first thing. We handed him his head at the Ballot box.

Kasich beat Strickland by 2% because people blamed him for the Bush recession and loss of jobs.

Yes,I have been involved in Ohio politics for a long time. Working at the polls to make sure we had honest elections. Volunteer work,local politics.

DeWine has been in there with Kasich for 7 years now. I want him to go home to Greene County,enjoy his 8 or 9 kids and let ius have another Democrat.

Kuchinick is a gad Fly,lightweight who is on Fox News. Let him stay there.

Like Bernie, Dennis had promise, but that is long gone.

[True Blue American]

49. Brown Flew

From his Mother’s funeral to cast the deciding vote for the ACA! I will never forget that.

He wears suits made in an Ohio Factory. Once actually ran out of gas ⛽️ because he wanted to fill his tank in Ohio. His wife, Connie Schultz told that one on him.

Brown is right up there with John Glenn and Howard Metzenbaum. Ohio was booming then.

[vi5]

50. Interesting...

...good for him (and us).

[hueymahl]

37. There are a lot of folks with BDS* on this board

Symptoms: One mention of Bernie, regardless of the context, causes twitchy fingers, paranoia, heightened blood pressure and an overwhelming need to fight the last primary.

Kucinich has his plusses and minuses (looks like more minuses lately). But I knew this thread was doomed as soon as he was compared to Bernie.



*Bernie Derangement Syndrome

P.s. Triangulation is a good thing (and a common political technique) when trying to gain an edge over an entrenched party, like in Ohio.

[vi5]

39. "an entrenched party, like in Ohio"

How dare you! Obviously Democratic party politics and strategies in Ohio are doing WONDERFULLY. The establishment can never fail, it can only be failed by Putin loving disrupters like yourself!

[TomCADem]

58. No, No, No, We Should Not Start Adopting Trump/GOP Positions!

This idea that we should read the losses of Democrats as a sign that Democrats should gravitate toward Republican positions should be rejected. We have to fight for what we believe in. The real culprit is the growth of right wing media coupled with both foreign and corporate sponsored espionage and social media campaigns whereby Democratic opponents can funnel unlimited funds to Democratic opponents on both the left and right.

[TomCADem]

59. Slate - Democrats Shouldnt Give in to White Racism

I know some folks are advocating that Democrats give a Republicans a free pass on issues like social justice, racism or immigration, which both the right and some on the left dismiss as "identity politics." However, these are two sides of the same coin where racist politicians use racial resentment to distract and scapegoat minorities so that the majority cannot see their real oppressors.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/04/democrats-shouldnt-give-in-to-white-racism.html

Too many observers treat American politics as a contest between rival groups of white people. It’s how you get dubious claims that Donald Trump broadly represents “working-class” voters or the related narrative that pits a monolithic “coastal elite” against a so-called heartland, ideas that cannot survive contact with any consideration of black political behavior. The result is that black Americans and other groups—which represented nearly 27 percent of the electorate in 2016, more than 36 million voters—get erased from mainstream political discourse and are ignored as full citizens and political actors.

But focusing on white political conflict doesn’t just remove blacks and other nonwhites from the state of national politics. It also obscures the racial dimensions of white politics, rendering invisible the historic interest—across much of white society—in preserving white racial hegemony.

Writer James Traub does something akin to this in a piece for the Atlantic that takes a critical view of the Democratic Party’s midcentury embrace of racial liberalism, in which the party “exchanged a politics of self-interest for a politics of moral commitment,” asking its white supporters in the suburbs and cities to sacrifice for the sake of civil rights. Traub doesn’t fully obscure white voters’ racial interest. Instead, he minimizes its scope and holds it out as essentially understandable, something that liberals should accommodate as they move forward from the present moment.

Traub recounts the career of Minnesota Democrat Hubert Humphrey, whose efforts brought racial liberalism to the Democratic platform and sparked a revolution that culminated in Lyndon Johnson’s dramatic push for civil rights legislation in the 1960s, nearly 20 years after he opposed Harry Truman’s attempt to end the poll tax as a candidate for Senate.

[Downtown Hound]

41. No Dennis, you can't

Not as long as you keep whoring yourself to Faux News.

[brooklynite]

51. Let's be blunt: Kucinich never won anything outside of Cleveland...

...a safe Democratic enclave. I'm sitting down with him this week to listen to his pitch, but he's gonna have to tell me a hell of a story to get my support.

[Binkie The Clown]

52. We need younger politicians who will represent and relate to a younger population.

Old farts (like me) should be put out to pasture.

[David__77]

54. Interesting that a poll shows a close primary race.

I hope whoever loses votes for whoever wins.

[matt819]

55. Maybe in Ohio

But with his deep state crap reported on earlier today, he lost me. I hope he's not planning any sort of national run again.

Plus, lumping together so-called disenfranchised Dems (Bernie supporters?) and trump supporters is ludicrous.

[FSogol]

56. LOL: Tell us about the UFOs Dennis!

[Blue_Tires]

57. Anybody who believes this bullshit deserves what they get

And I say that as a one-time Dennis voter....

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

60. Right

I remember when he was gerrymandered out of his congressional seat he wanted to come to Seattle and run for office.

We pretty overwhelmingly told him to stay home.

[Hortensis]

68. "Disenfranchised" Democrats? How dare they call themselves that?

The only disenfranchised Democrats are those whose ability to have their vote count was stolen from them by conservative manipulators.

People who like to whine that fringe candidates not getting enough voter support means they're "disenfranchised" are dishonest fools and detriments to democracy. They have no more respect for the votes of others than Republican vote suppressors do.

Kucinich can attract some who insist on being fooled through appeal to malcontents and victim mentality. To win he'd have to attract a bunch of angry malcontents from both sides, create yet another dangerous populist movement in fact, and that would be truly scary.