Los Angeles leaders ban high-capacity gun magazines after string of US mass shootings

[jpak]

Source: Star Tribune

LOS ANGELES — The Los Angeles City Council has voted to ban the possession of high-capacity gun magazines following deadly mass shootings nationwide.

Tuesday's 12-0 vote closes a loophole in state law that banned the manufacture and sale of magazines holding more than 10 rounds of ammunition — but not their possession.

Mayor Eric Garcetti says he'll sign the measure, saying it will save lives and prevent crime.

People who have the magazines will have 60 days from the time the law takes effect to sell, destroy or take them out of the city.

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Read more: http://www.startribune.com/los-angeles-leaders-outlaw-high-capacity-gun-magazines/319439111/

[TeddyR]

1. I find bans on high capacity magazines

To be primarily about looking like you are "doing something" instead of actually passing legislation that will impact gun violence. First, this law isn't really enforceable until the magazine is used in a crime - the authorities don't get to go into someone's house to search for magazines unless they have cause for a warrant, and it certainly isn't going to "prevent crime" (that's simply a ridiculous statement). Second, criminals will still have their high capacity magazines and I can't imagine that this law isn't going to prevent a criminal from using a high capacity magazine any more than the law against murder prevents a criminal from shooting someone. Third, settling on 10 is simply plucking a random number out of the air, but if that floats their boat then I suppose that's ok. Keep in mind though that it takes about 2 seconds to release a magazine and insert another, so not sure a 10 round limit does much. See this article at Slate for a discussion of the firing/reloading mechanics.

That means an experienced gunman can fire off a 20-round magazine—the likely capacity of Hasan's gun—in 3.3 seconds. Reloading takes under two. You just press the magazine release button with your shooting hand and insert the new magazine into the grip with your offhand. * Experts holster extra ammunition on the side of their nonshooting hand to speed the exchange and can have the new magazine loaded before the empty one hits the ground. So each 20-round magazine would take no more than 5.3 seconds, including time to reload.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2009/11/how_many_times_can_you_shoot_a_handgun_in_seven_minutes.html

[Hello Dragon]

2. Constitutional challenges might follow nt

[Fred Sanders]

5. Scary, isn't it, how folks overreact every time there is a mass murder or shooting with a gun?

Why can't these folks just leave The Gun alone!

[SunSeeker]

3. K & R

[Fred Sanders]

4. A good start...then melt them down. Let the laws be challenged, it is time for a massive re-write.

[friendly_iconoclast]

6. Will you be volunteering for a gun collection squad?

Or will you be going the Toby Keith/John Wayne/Dick Cheney route?

[Fred Sanders]

9. No one knows what that means. Speak plainly, like I do. Why so coy?

[friendly_iconoclast]

10. Are you willing to put *your* life on the line? Or are you all bumpersticker and no sign-up?

[jpak]

11. Should we be a'feared of the "law abiders"?

If they don't abide, they are scofflaws and should be disarmed by the police.

yup

[friendly_iconoclast]

13. That's not what I asked. Will you actually *do* anything that doesn't involve a keyboard?

There's a long history of media types plumping for wars they expect others to fight

If there ever is a "War On Guns", I fully expect most controller types would be eligible
to be on a list like the following:

http://www.nhgazette.com/chickenhawks/

http://www.nhgazette.com/chickenhawks/?sort_list=1

Chickenhawk Hall of Shame

When an American male (or an especially belligerent female) makes the challenging transition from late adolescence into early adulthood, he is faced with many decisions. One certain, specific combination of choices will result in his becoming a chickenhawk: choosing to “support” war, while also choosing not to serve in the military. His motto becomes: “Let’s you and him go fight; I’ll hold your coat.”

[MicaelS]

25. The same police that are constantly accused of being Racist..

Sexist, Homophobic, Fascist, Warmongering Pigs?

[jpak]

29. Why yes indeed

Grab 'em

[sarisataka]

32. Yes, those police

[MicaelS]

36. Of course it is.

The Police are The Enemy, except when they're needed to do the dirty work that others won't sully their lily-white hands.

[Adrahil]

30. House to house inspections looking for "hi-cap" magazines? Yeah... THAT will happen. nt

[Fred Sanders]

16. Life on the line to fire up the smelters to melt the guns? I think I can handle that!

[friendly_iconoclast]

18. And let someone else do the collecting. How *very* unsurprising...

[Fred Sanders]

19. The NRA is pure evil, any progressive would agree. Do you? 12 to 0 vote...unanimous.

Any liberal would support the LA ordinance, but you do not...we all see.

[friendly_iconoclast]

20. "Any liberal would support..." Any *true* liberal?

http://www.google.com/search?q=%22no+true+scotsman%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

Is that you, Joe? Haven't seen you in quite a while:

https://www.google.com/search?q=%22joe+steel%22&sitesearch=democraticunderground.com

[Fred Sanders]

22. My work with you is done, you were a tough one, but I have new friends to engage me.

[friendly_iconoclast]

24. You are not the first self-appointed DU politruk, and undoubtedly won't be the last

I do note that most of your predecessors no longer post, either by choice or by getting banned-
tangling with those who actually *do* run the place tends to have that effect...

[friendly_iconoclast]

21. No doubt you would be doing yeoman work at your keyboard in support

[NickB79]

23. Are you suggesting door-to-door searches by the police to collect them all?

What do you envision happening?

[Fred Sanders]

26. Australia...your feeble and transparent and common attempt at putting words into my mouth was enough for me to reply!

[friendly_iconoclast]

28. 20-25% of Australians didn't own guns before that ban

[NickB79]

33. Australians had few guns to start, surrendered ~33% of them, then bought new ones to replace them

They were compensated generously for them, enough so that most gun owners simply purchased new, non-restricted firearms as replacements. Semi-auto shotguns replaced with double-barrels, semi-auto rifles replaced with lever-actions and bolt-actions.

You do realize that many hunting and target shooting guns are still fully legal in Australia, right?

Also, firearm ownership in Australia has never been particularly high, even before the gun ban. Gun ownership before the ban was around 7%; today it's around 5.5%.

Contrast that with the US, where somewhere between 35-40% of households own firearms.

Lots of info here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_Australia

And that's not even delving into the constitutional issues at play (the Australians don't have a constitutional right to bear arms whereas Americans do).

Your example is inadequate.

[Fred Sanders]

34. Feeble attempt number 2.

[NickB79]

35. I'm sorry you find facts and history feeble

By all means, continue to enjoy the fantasy world you've created for yourself.

[friendly_iconoclast]

27. I'm sure they would display a very nice bumpersticker in support if such were to happen

Most (if not all) gun banners are of the William Loeb, John Wayne, and Toby Keith persuasion
when it comes to actually *doing* the dirty work they so loudly call for.

[hack89]

7. "save lives and prevent crime" How?

can't see the gangs giving them up and anyone predisposed to commit mass murder is unlikely to do so either. They can collect 90% of them (which they won't) and not make any difference.

[friendly_iconoclast]

12. It won't- it's a 'beer keg registration' law:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keg_registration

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=118x362693

[vkkv]

8. They need make the possession charge of such a magazine years and years in prison. Deter, deter.

Wha? 10 rounds aren't enough ?!?!?
Law should be FIVE rounds.

[friendly_iconoclast]

15. Were you planning on banning the following, as well?

The first shooter reloads in less than two seconds:

[Adrahil]

31. Oh for fuck's sake....

I don't even what to say to that kind of foolishness. I have a 120 year old rifle with a 10 round magazine. It's not even legally a gun.

[truthisfreedom]

14. Anything's better than nothing.

Seriously.

[ManiacJoe]

17. The local law will probably not stand up to the state preemption.

[beevul]

37. I say let this law stand for a year.

After a year, if gun crime has not dropped significantly in a way that can be laid at the feet of this new law, scrap it and every other magazine law in America.