Will our moral righteousness help us when Franken leaves the Senate and Moore joins it?

[pnwmom]

Have we lost our collective minds?

The Republicans aren't going to oust their misogynists. How will we be better off if we rid the Senate of Democrats like Al Franken?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/posteverything/wp/2017/11/17/im-a-feminist-i-study-rape-culture-and-i-dont-want-al-franken-to-resign/?utm_term=.25262db82a1f

It would feel good, momentarily, to see Franken resign and the Democratic governor of Minnesota, Mark Dayton, appoint a senator who has not (as far as we know) harmed women. If I believed for one second that Franken is the only Democrat in the Senate who has done something like this, with or without photographic evidence, I would see that as the best and most appropriate option. But in the world we actually live in, I’m betting that there will be more. And more after that. And they won’t all come from states with Democratic governors and a deep bench of progressive replacements. Some will, if ousted, have their successors chosen by Republicans.

In other words, if we set this precedent in the interest of demonstrating our party’s solidarity with harassed and abused women, we’re only going to drain the swamp of people who, however flawed, still regularly vote to protect women’s rights and freedoms. The legislative branch will remain chockablock with old, white Republican men who regard women chiefly as sex objects and unpaid housekeepers, and we’ll show them how staunchly Democrats oppose their misogynistic attitudes by handing them more power.

[bettyellen]

1. It's insane. While Moore is accused of attempted rape we roast people

For shitty jokes they made while working as a comedian? Nope. He should not go under the bus. Both Trump and Franken should submit to ethics investigations- only if BOTH do

[Fred Sanders]

2. The MSM loves to equate everything so as to get a fiery "debate" going. No fire, no ratings.

[The_Casual_Observer]

3. It's easy to get played by Stone if you immediately react to his bullshit.

They carefully craft this shit in advance, they are experts at it.

All they had was some bullshit picture and a story cooked up by some ex-sex kitten. Right away everybody is talking about the end of Franken around here. It is all nonsense.

[egduj]

4. This reads like a "boys will be boys..." post.

Can you imagine a society if everyone lived by the "If they're not going to punish their kids for it (stealing cars, doing drugs, groping women...), then I'm not going to punish mine..." rule?

[BannonsLiver]

5. Not to me.

It reads like an every situation must be evaluated on its own post. Thinking people asks questions, they analyze and they come to a conclusion. Only Morons apply a cookie cutter approach to every allegation.

[pnwmom]

7. Thank you. n/t

[BannonsLiver]

15. No, thank you. This needed to be shared.

[orangecrush]

17. ...

[pnwmom]

6. Can YOU imagine a Senate even more dominated by men like Roy Moore? That's what we'll get

if we start attacking men like Al Franken.

[egduj]

8. You can either set the example or follow the example...

I have trouble finding an example where more sexual harassers in a organization is better than less. Even congress.

[pnwmom]

9. The GOP will NEVER follow our example. It's beyond naive to think that they will. And when some

Democrat caught up in this hysteria gets replaced by a REPUBLICAN governor, we will be much worse off.

[egduj]

23. So sexual harassment is bad dependent on which side of the aisle loses seats.

I think it's bad all the time.

[pnwmom]

24. Without knowing the totality of the circumstances we can't judge how bad his behavior was.

Virtually everyone agrees that joking about sexual assault is stupid and wrong. But the rest of the story is still unclear.

In the photo, Franken pretends to grope Tweeden, without actually touching her (there are shadows under his fingers). She may or may not have been part of the joke. If she was a willing participant in the joke, and was only feigning sleep, then it wasn't harassment. The other people present (the photographer and the man with the red cap -- and there may be others out of camera view) could help clarify this but haven't so far.

As far as the kiss is concerned, she claimed that she didn't want to kiss him but did because it was part of the skit. It's not clear in her statement whether she voiced her reluctance to kiss him, or just tried and failed to avoid him. In any case, she has already accepted his apology.

As far as we know, there are no other accusers, unlike with the other men who have been accused.

[panader0]

19. False equivalency. You think what Franken did is the equivalent

of Trump's actions or Moore's actions? Good Grief!

[kcr]

22. Or you can be led around by the nose n/t

[rzemanfl]

10. The weather here near St. Petersburg, Florida is lovely, how is yours? n/t

[maxsolomon]

12. nicely played.

[rzemanfl]

14. Thank you. n/t

[orangecrush]

18. ...

[Demsrule86]

11. No it doesn't ...not if you are a Democrat...this is a set up pure and simple.

What no comment on Pedo Moore?

[maxsolomon]

13. Unless further allegations come out, Franken's going nowhere.

He certainly has lost Moral Authority in punching back at the GOP, which was probably most of the plan.

This is how Power operates in Russia - that playbook is being executed here piece by piece by a party without Ethics.

[mythology]

16. Can we get a list of wrongs we should accept?

For example what if he stabbed a man in Reno just to watch him die? Your logic can be used against any progressive goal. If we support same sex marriage, some people won't vote for us for example. Or look at how much worse we did among white voters after the Civil and Voting Rights Acts. Sometimes you have to pick morality over short term benefit.

Also Moore isn't doing so well in the polls.

[TheFrenchRazor]

20. first of all, who said he should leave the senate? i can damn well say what he did was wrong, witho

without a bunch of wishy-washy excuses, qualifications, and what-abouts. jeezus f-ing christ; my moral standards do not depend on the political affiliation of the alleged offender.

[pnwmom]

21. There have been calls for him to resign, including here. n/t