If You're a Male Celebrity, Check Your Memory Files

[MineralMan]

If you find some times when you abused your position of power by sexually harassing or abusing women who had little or no power, get in front of it and make a statement of sincere apology for your shitty behavior. Because there's a welcome trend right now of people who had no power then to come forward now.

Trust me, if you did it, they will come forward and tell us about it. And we'll believe them, because we know what shit goes on.

Think about it.

[Sneederbunk]

1. RIP Wilt Chamberlain.

[MineralMan]

2. I thought he died already. Shows how much I know...

[steve2470]

3. amazing, in a good way, how this tsunami is rolling

A lot of guys are probably losing sleep. Good!

[MineralMan]

6. The culture of male power has always shrugged off

women's rights as individuals. Men in power appear to believe that they can take advantage of anyone who has no power, and particularly women. They know, or knew that the women they treated wrongly wouldn't speak out, due to fear or whatever.

Well, those days may well be ending, and ending quickly. There's no statute of limitations on people calling our their abusers. Not at all. The more who do that, the more will be emboldened to do the same.

That's good, I think. Perhaps exposing what has been a norm in the past will stop it from being a norm in the future.

I won't mourn any of those men. They deserve their comeuppance.

[steve2470]

8. +1000000000000000000000 nt

[PoliticAverse]

4. How about all celebrities check their memories for times they sexually harrassed anyone.

(The recent Kevin Spacey allegations for example didn't involve women).

Any why limit it to celebrities? Let all the poison that lurks in the mud, hatch out.

[MineralMan]

11. Yes. I have no problem with that at all.

[BigmanPigman]

5. It seems to me (I am a woman by the way)

that a lot of men are confused lately about what the actual, specific behaviors and in what context sexual harassment is. They can't apply it to themselves personally until they have a one on one talk with someone (a friend or family member) explaining it to them in a language and situation that they could understand and possibly have happened in their own life in the past 20 or so years. That takes a bit of work and personal reflection over a long period of time for them to commit to in the first place.

This should not be applied to only celebrities but to ALL MEN (and yes, some women too)! It happens all the time all over the place in a zillion different situations. That is what needs to be addressed even more than the "celebrity circle".

[MineralMan]

9. I don't think so. The definition has always been simple.

Don't coerce people sexually. If they aren't enthusiastically consenting, they're not consenting at all. If they don't consent, keep your freaking hands and other parts to yourself.

I'm 72 years old. That's always been the rule I've followed. I've always known the rule. So did all those assholes. They just ignored it, because they could get away with it. Perhaps the time of reckoning is approaching for them. I hope so.

[BigmanPigman]

13. I hear different things from men on TV.

They say that they never heard "locker room talk" like with the pussy grabbing tape. Or they say they don't know of anyone like this (including their close male friends). Bill Maher and his guests said that two weeks ago and he is among many others who sincerely believe and mean it.

[MineralMan]

14. Of course not all men did those things.

I never listened to "locker room talk," even when I was young. I was brought up to treat women as equals, not playthings. So, that's what I did. I was very slow to get sexually involved with anyone, and never until it was crystal clear that the other person was as interested in going there as I was.

It has never been all men who have taken advantage of their position to take advantage of women who were vulnerable to their positions. In fact, it's probably a minority of men who have done that.

[brush]

16. Most men do not sexually harass women/men, even those in positions of power over others.

And the ones who do don't share that horrible side of themselves with their friends, unless their friends are in on it with them of course.

[hlthe2b]

7. It has been so pervasive that it feels like the flood walls have opened.

I don't know any woman of my generation/cohort who didn't have some story to tell--some merely irritating, but others quite serious. While I'd like to see all forms of sexual harassment and power-associated abuse be addressed, I fear some are conflating a lot of behaviors into the mix, which may cause some to deny the problem is as serious as it is.

Maybe I am still suffering from the forces that shut us all up over the years, but I do fear a backlash in the public's willingness to believe the accusers when a certain level is exceeded (whatever that might be). Not at all suggesting those victimized (both women and men) NOT speak up, but I hold my breath that this seeming societal enlightenment continues. Given the sins of the person in the WH have not been addressed--either criminally or civilly--I can't be as optimistic as I'd like.

[MineralMan]

10. I'll have no problem believing them.

It was traumatic then, and it's traumatic to reveal it now. Why would anyone do that falsely?

[OldHippieChick]

12. To begin, I do not, under any circumstances, blame women for men's behavior in this or

any other regard. I also do not mean to patronize men. Those statements made, I do believe that men sometimes don't understand what effect their behavior has and where the boundaries are.

My son is in his late 20's and is now in a position of power and has young women students. He calls me daily (mostly to make sure I'm still alive) to check out my opinion on various issues - sometimes on Grand Tour (yawn) but often on what he should do regarding a particular female student. Recently one of these sweet young 19-year olds wanted to meet w/ him privately about a personal problem. I suggested he invite her to his home where his WIFE could make dinner and they could all bond.

Seriously, my son is not an idiot, but he is stupid when it comes to women. When he was a sophomore in high school, a freshman girl sent an email of her doing a strip tease. Thankfully he let me know about it and I explained that we must delete, delete. delete and he had to let her know to never do that again.

I guess my message is that we mothers must be very diligent about raising our sons and we mothers must be even more diligent raising our daughters. NO it is NOT the mothers' fault, but we must be careful and complete in letting them know boundaries and how their power effects others.

This is an ongoing educational effort and it takes a village from birth to death.

[MineralMan]

17. I did some student classroom teaching when I was a grad student.

I was about 25, then. It was clear as a bell to me that students were absolutely off-limits, even if they consented or even if they initiated something. So, I didn't do any of that, despite a number of opportunities. It was a matter of ethics, both formal and my own personal ethics.

Some men probably do not understand the basic rules of sexual interactions. I don't know. I always knew them. Some men also ignore those rules and just pretend not to know them, I think. They're not a secret.

I'm far from being prudish. I've been sexually active since about 15 years of age. There never has seemed to me to be a shortage of people who were more than willing to get involved sexually during my lifetime.

I won't say there haven't been tempting times, but I've always managed to maintain my ethical compass in that regard. A couple of times while I was married there were situations where affairs were possible and not suggested by me. Difficult as it was, I managed to avoid those situations, while maintaining friendships with the women in question. It just wasn't something I could do ethically, despite a mutual attraction, etc.

So, you're right. Some men either don't know the rules or ignore them for some reason. We're all moral or ethical weaklings in some ways. Some people justify their failings. Others stick to their ethics and avoid the situations. We're all just human.

However, sexual harassment and abuse isn't a matter of that, really, It's taking advantage of some advantage you have and abusing your privilege, whether that privilege is earned or unearned. That's more than an ethical lapse. It's a deliberate misuse of power. I cannot forgive that. Neither should those who were harassed or abused.

[OldHippieChick]

19. Concur

[LanternWaste]

15. Also males celebrities, try to remember if you've been staring at young females

Also males celebrities, try to remember if you've been staring at young females on an airplane, then discussing their wardrobe in a creepy, creepy way.

Think about it, indeed.

[LexVegas]

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