General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsI think we can expect a cycle of indictment/pardon, indictment/pardon, indictment/pardon,
indictment/pardon, indictment/pardon from the Mueller investigation and Drumpf until something blows. I am hoping it is a blood vessel under that ridiculous hair, but who knows?
Resist.
emulatorloo
(44,131 posts)If say Manafort is charged by Virginia state attorney on money laundering for example, Trump cannot pardon him.
The screws can be put to the indicted person to flip and cooperate w the investigation.
rzemanfl
(29,565 posts)Last edited Fri Oct 27, 2017, 10:14 PM - Edit history (1)
emulatorloo
(44,131 posts)Mueller didn't just fall off the turnip truck. He's a seasoned prosecutor and has a hell of a team
rzemanfl
(29,565 posts)emulatorloo
(44,131 posts)I am rather Pollyanna your cynicism may be a better approach.
rzemanfl
(29,565 posts)How many indictments? How many state court charges?
Do you think Drumpf will try to fire Mueller and Rosenstein? I do.
emulatorloo
(44,131 posts)t
rzemanfl
(29,565 posts)emulatorloo
(44,131 posts)Nixon didn't get away w it. I don't think Trump will get away with it either. Constitutional crisis
DK504
(3,847 posts)can the Slug still pardon?
Ccarmona
(1,180 posts)Any individual pardoned can no longer plead the 5th nor can the President claim Executive Privilege to stop that individual from testifying.
emulatorloo
(44,131 posts)rzemanfl
(29,565 posts)unblock
(52,243 posts)First, someone can refuse a pardon in order to retain 5th amendment protections. Not a likely scenario, but possible.
Second, someone pardoned for a federal crime could still take the 5th if answering might implicate themself in a state crime and/or another unpardoned federal crime.
rzemanfl
(29,565 posts)marylandblue
(12,344 posts)Accepting a pardon is an admission of guilt. At the same time, the person will be subject to state prosecution anyway, who can still pressure him to testify. Trump would have to pardon people while trusting them to go to state prison rather than betray. Trump trusts nobody. He demands loyalty but does not give it. He will send them all to jail rather than risk his own next. They all know it too.
rzemanfl
(29,565 posts)I'm not so sure about collusion with a foreign power and election law violations.
Dotarded
(23 posts)There is no admission of guilt if you are pardoned before your trial even takes place
And im inclined to believe this route of state prison that is the fantasy here is just that. Fantasy.
When was the last time that strategy was sound in combatting the federal government. It never has been and it wont now
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)Which means Trump will have to trust the people he pardoned not to squeal anyway. And Trump doesn't trust anybody.
unblock
(52,243 posts)Based on the entirely reasonable suspicion that Donnie and co. committed financial crimes prior to becoming president.
It's not necessarily stuff mueller is investigating, though there's some overlap in evidence possibly, such as tax returns or financial records.
If he violated federal tax laws, e.g., he might well have violated New York State tax laws as well.
But yes, federal election law violations would have no state counterpart.