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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWATCH: Utah nurse being arrested for refusing to give a patient's blood to police
Last edited Fri Sep 1, 2017, 09:01 PM - Edit history (1)
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mahatmakanejeeves
(57,504 posts)ProudLib72
(17,984 posts)A neighboring police department sent Payne, a trained police phlebotomist, to collect blood from the patient and check for illicit substances, as the Tribune reported. The goal was reportedly to protect the trucker, who was not suspected of a crime.
Protect the trucker even though he was not suspected? Seems very fishy.
kcr
(15,317 posts)It was their own ass. They were hoping to find something in his blood so they could try to pin blame on him.
snowybirdie
(5,230 posts)out of context. Why did they want it? Was he suspected of drunken driving and injured or killed others? If so, the police needed that blood to prove the case. Its her job to cooperate with law enforcement.
exboyfil
(17,863 posts)Not the suspect. It was a fishing expedition with no legal foundation.
d_r
(6,907 posts)1. the injured driver they wanted blood from was a reserve police officer from Idaho (I don't know if they were trying to get it for his insurance claims later ?)
2. He was injured by a car that was in a high speed chase that crossed the line and hit him head on (I don't know if they were concerned about a future lawsuit because the police were chasing the car that hit him?)
Supposedly, the blood test was requested by another jurisdiction.
JonLP24
(29,322 posts)now I totally understand why the cops wanted the blood so bad.
Brother Buzz
(36,444 posts)They wanted to clear his name, post haste; to Hell with the constitution when a member of your brotherhood is involved.
LisaL
(44,973 posts)He was a victim and thus not suspected of anything. There was nothing to clear him from.
L. Coyote
(51,129 posts)Response to L. Coyote (Reply #5)
d_r This message was self-deleted by its author.
JonLP24
(29,322 posts)1) They need a warrant -- which they didn't have
2) they need his consent -- he was unconscious
Washington Post
Besides all she was doing was telling him what her supervisor said.
y all accounts, the head nurse at the University of Utah Hospitals burn unit was professional and restrained when she told a Salt Lake City police detective he wasnt allowed to draw blood from a badly injured patient.
The detective didnt have a warrant, first off. And the patient wasnt conscious, so he couldnt give consent. Without that, the detective was barred from collecting blood samples not just by hospital policy, but by basic constitutional law.
Still, Detective Jeff Payne insisted that he be let in to take the blood, saying the nurse would be arrested and charged if she refused.
Nurse Alex Wubbels politely stood her ground. She got her supervisor on the phone so Payne could hear the decision loud and clear. Sir, said the supervisor, youre making a huge mistake because youre threatening a nurse.
Payne snapped. He seized hold of the nurse, shoved her out of the building and cuffed her hands behind her back. A bewildered Wubbels screamed help me and youre assaulting me as the detective forced her into an unmarked car and accused her of interfering with an investigation.
<snip>
On top of that, Wubbels was right. The U.S. Supreme Court has explicitly ruled that blood can only be drawn from drivers for probable cause, with a warrant.
www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/09/01/this-is-crazy-sobs-utah-hospital-nurse-as-cop-roughs-her-up-arrests-her-for-doing-her-job/?utm_term=.8bb1a4a425c3
L. Coyote
(51,129 posts)Arazi
(6,829 posts)The cop is an asshole and will pay big $$$ in her lawsuit
Ms. Toad
(34,076 posts)There's that little pesky thing called the Constitution that prevents police officers from demanding blood be drawn, without probable cause - which, except in very rare circumstances isn't a call police get to make. We leave that call to neutral magistrates, to avoid becoming 2-bit police states with no respect for the privacy rights of our citizens.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)What leads you to believe part of her job is to cooperate law enforcement?
Additionally, what is the specific context you allege is lacking, and what leads you to believe there is in fact, a lack of this context?
dalton99a
(81,526 posts)https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/09/01/this-is-crazy-sobs-utah-hospital-nurse-as-cop-roughs-her-up-arrests-her-for-doing-her-job/
FarPoint
(12,409 posts)The Nurse is following Protocols....The reason the LEO gives to get the labs fail the standard of law and hospital protocol...
Officers in this case we're pisst off. Assult to the nurse followed...
MyNameGoesHere
(7,638 posts)Or read about this did you?
yardwork
(61,654 posts)NutmegYankee
(16,200 posts)An extreme example, but also a demonstration that the duty to obey a cop's orders only pertains to LAWFUL orders. The cop in this case was completely wrong about the law and his order was unlawful.
AngryAmish
(25,704 posts)kcr
(15,317 posts)That was a spectacular attempt at blameshifting, though!
bettyellen
(47,209 posts)yardwork
(61,654 posts)LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)You'll of course provide the specific causation leading to this particular instance cause and effect you allege, yes?
Or is this simply another bumper-sticker predicated wholly on your own bias?
Ms. Toad
(34,076 posts)A misguided attempt to protect a fellow office by preserving evidence that he was clean. (Gray was the victim of someone fleeing the police, who hit him head on and died at the scene.)
LisaL
(44,973 posts)Ms. Toad
(34,076 posts)is to establish the victim was also negligent (in some jurisidictions it can prevent any recovery at all). Establishing he had no alcohol or mind-altering drugs in his system would minimize the likelihood that his (or his family's in the event of his death) recovery would be limited because of his own negligence.
(In other words, the argument will be that both parties caused the crash - so the off-duty police officer should recover less or, in some jurisdictions, not at all)
imanamerican63
(13,802 posts)this is cover by legal ramifications and fall under federal laws. No, arresting her went over the line and could be an issue later? But, she needed to follow the law as screwy as it might be?
NutmegYankee
(16,200 posts)The Officer's order was illegal.
LisaL
(44,973 posts)KG
(28,751 posts)Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin
(108,036 posts)HAB911
(8,904 posts)lpbk2713
(42,760 posts)The police made a demand of a member of the general public who knew their job and followed standing instructions. Her refusal was followed by the usual intimidation tactics without success. Due process be damned. Hats off to the nurse. She is a hero for standing up to bullies.
yardwork
(61,654 posts)Warpy
(111,277 posts)The hospital is going to raise hell about this. I imagine the ACLU might get involved. Meanwhile Officer Pig is still on duty, he should enjoy throwing his weight around while he can, because it's not going to last.
Nurses can't just draw somebody's blood because some random cop wants it.
Warpy
(111,277 posts)through the grapevine. The patient wasn't under arrest because he was the victim of the whole thing which was caused by a police chase. That cop was hoping to get evidence that the victim had some sort of substance in his system that could be used to smear him and exonerate the cops. It was a total CYA situation for the cops.
This one is going to get messy.
uponit7771
(90,347 posts)Warpy
(111,277 posts)Plus, she was the only woman there. The administrators present were all men.
This stinks to high heaven of many, many things.