As a person that lives in Ohio in a formally blue area this is why

[doc03]

I think we lost the election. Since this area went for Trump overwhelmingly I know and talk to Trump voters every day.
The last couple years before the election it seemed every day BLM was protesting a shooting of a black person. These people
have been convinced by Fox News mainly that they were all justified. Then we started to have cops targeted and killed.
I am not arguing the merits of either side. These people were convinced by Fox, the NRA and other right wing outlets the blacks had gone too far and we needed someone to put a stop to it. Up pops Trump, a guy that ran a racist, law and order campaign. Now since Trump has been elected those two issues have all but disappeared from the news.

[DonCoquixote]

1. ok, then let's play this

Lets say the people were tired in the news about hearing how black people were upset that cops were getting away with doing stuff like shooting people on tape.

Does it take away the fact that we needed to at the very least shine a light on it so that cops would NOT be so willing to do such?

Does it take away the fact that for all the blacks being shot, Trump would not even move one plant that made things of his to the USA.

How are these points linked, because people will gladly expect Blacks to tolerate all sorts of crap, but in addition, they also tolerate all sorts of crap from RICH WHITE people. Simply put, Obama wil be blamed for those ties made in Mexico, but overlook Trump.

[Cary]

2. Were #fakepresident voters racists before BLM?

Or did BLM make them into racists?

I have a hard time believing the latter.

[pnwmom]

8. BLM didn't make them racists. Fox News and Russian propaganda is stirring up the racist pot.

[doc03]

14. I agree 100% with that. I am just saying talk to

a Trump supporter very long and the BLM will come up.

[SCantiGOP]

41. This is the same way Nixon won

As a part of his Southern Strategy, he adopted a campaign theme of Law and Order. Everyone knew that "Law and Order" was a code for "I will stop those scary Black Panthers that you see on the evening news."

[atreides1]

53. So they're racists???

But they're racists who are too cowardly to admit that they are racists!

To them cops shooting a 12 year old black kid with a toy gun, was justified, cops shooting a black man carrying a pellet rifle, in the back, in a Wal-Mart store, is just fine???

Those Trump voters you spend time talking to, are a waste of space!!!

[Docreed2003]

28. Ding ding ding!!!! We have a winner!!

[demigoddess]

54. you are right. They don't like black people asking for human rights.

rights that they do not want to give.

[doc03]

10. Like I said not arguing about the merits of either side. The last

couple years three things beside the election have dominated the news cycle, Muslim terrorists, cops
shooting blacks and cops being targeted. Then Trump shows up with the help of the media he plays on peoples
fears, the blacks are taking over and a Muslim is gonna kill you. Did the cops suddenly stop shooting
people on Jan. 20, 2017? We see little about it anymore and if we do it doesn't dominate the news cycle for
more than about 5 seconds. Suddenly gun sales are way down. The Trump supporters think Trump did it.
Talk to a Trump supporter for a few minutes and let him think you agree with him. I guarantee he will talk about
Mexicans, Muslims and blacks.

[Amishman]

59. I've talked with people like this, the focus is on the group not the color

It's not about blacks being black, it's about (the Trumpster's) view of a group being (in their eyes) out of control and opposing or attacking police. Racism is probably a factor for some but not as much as many here would believe.

Law enforcement gets a ton of respect in these circles. Law and order is a big deal. There are a bunch of people who hate undocumented/illegal immigrants just because they broke the law. Same people are usually vocally pro capital punishment.

[geek tragedy]

3. Badge-sniffing is part of the cultural conservatism that Republicans rely upon

It's easily observed that BLM and gun control did not help us electorally in 2016.

It's not easily observed how we deal with that.

[Cary]

15. We viote

We.stop the petty bickering and we win elections.

[Stallion]

4. It's a Sad Commentary on America-but I Think You are 100% Correct

similar to the perception of Americans to the anti-war protests of the 1960s leading to Richard Nixon

especially when non violent protests veer off to inevitable violence in the streets and attacks on the police.

[tonedevil]

34. Um...

more like artacks by the police.

[JI7]

5. I agree but they were already racist

[LeftInTX]

6. Nixon did this in 1968

Except there was much more turmoil in 1968.

In 2016 Fox, the NRA and Trump sowed discontent and made BLM appear much worse than they are.

[Bettie]

7. I see it differently

they went for Trump because he and his party gave them explicit permission to be racists, homophobes, and anything else they want to be.

Trump voters voted for hate. They may not all hate the same people, but they were relieved that they could take off the masks and show it in public again.

Trump represents freedom to them...freedom from an expectation of common decency toward those they deem inferior.

[doc03]

16. That's exactly what I was getting at in my post nt

[Bettie]

21. OK. Guess we were

just saying it in different ways.

I'm sickened to see how many people (relatives and acquaintances) have turned out not to be the people I thought they were.

The things I've heard them openly say since that orange thing was installed in the White House prove that they are not the decent, kind people I thought they were.

They were hiding their true selves under a thin veneer of civility. A mask to hide the ugliness underneath.

[Blue_true]

23. I am surprised you did notice their true selves earlier.

None of my family voted for Trump, we all think that he is a buffoon and dangerous. I was not surprised by people that I know voting for Trump, they struck me as that type long ago. I know them through business, I don't have friends like them.

[Bettie]

36. I knew my brothers and in-laws

were right wingers, but I thought they generally were not outright racist dickheads.

Turns out they were, but they were hiding it until it became socially acceptable again.

I live in a small town in Iowa and I've only lived here for 15 years, which means I'm still an outsider, so I don't know my neighbors well.

I've learned a lot about them since the election though. I avoid most of them at this point.

[Blue_true]

40. Your brothers and I laws are hard to avoid.

Do what you can with them. The others, you don't need people like that online. When I see people like the ones you now live around online, it is sort of clear they come from small town and never have really been to a big major city, some of the images they paint of big cities are comical, like Gotham City comical.

[Bettie]

42. I miss living within striking distance of a large city

I also miss living in a place with diversity, culture, and pizza delivery.

Plus, a larger pool of potential friends for my boys.

As for the in-laws...I have a Kindle and I simply read unless I'm helping out in some way. They learned long ago not to bring up politics with me, because I don't give in and I ALWAYS have backup data (especially now with the internet at my fingertips).

My brothers live far away, so I can just avoid them most of the time. We have nothing in common anyway.

I've unfriended most of the people I went to school with on Facebook, as soon as they started with the "give the guy a chance, like we did Obama" memes.

[Blue_true]

63. Yeah, they gave Obama a chance, like 2 weeks.

He was sworn on Jan 21, 2009 and I saw the first tea party "patriots????" In the second week of February. Those clown have no memory or they are outright liars, my bet is on number 2.

[Garrett78]

22. Common decency is really what they mean when they speak of "political correctness."

Absent bigotry, there's no viable Republican Party.

[Blue_true]

24. Yep.

Not calling minorities and women names is political correctness to them.

[Dawson Leery]

30. Correct.

In Connecticut, I see alot of "Blue Lives Matter" Blue Stripe Flags on cars.
This is the more acceptable way of saying they support the Conman.

[Orrex]

44. This is why I refer to them as "idiot racist fuckheads"

And it fills my heart with joy when someone cries out "So you're saying that my sister is an idiot racist fuckhead?"

Yes, yes I am. And so is mine, and so is my aunt.

[Bettie]

46. I'm related

to a lot of idiot racist fuckheads...by marriage and birth.

[Orrex]

47. In that regard (and many others) I married well, but...

My own family has a disturbing number of Trump supporters. I make it a point never to bring it up with them...

[lunasun]

9. So no protests for anyone ever again and then democrats will win. BLM is still very active not gone

http://blacklivesmatter.com/who-we-are/
Maybe not used for propaganda as much on RW and alt left slants but whatever the issue with Trump voters and BLM, it shouldn't mean withdrawing support for the group by dems

[ProfessorGAC]

37. I Don't Think That's What The OP Was Saying

We're clearly interpreting it very differently. I don't believe the OP was offering a "no protest" strategy, merely an observation of what triggered the overt racism that led to the electoral outcome.

[crazycatlady]

11. I've seen 'blue lives matter' outnumbering BLM by a long shot

In fact I see blue lives matter flags and stickers on a daily basis.

[Blue_true]

25. Normally if you look they have some other rightwing sticker on their vehicle.

Or a Trump sticker or an NRA sticker. When I see a blue lives matter sticker I ignore the driver for all reasons but safe driving in traffic.

[crazycatlady]

38. I've actually seen more as flags than stickers

The stickers around here tend to be produced by the local police departments (a possible fundraiser).

[Trekologer]

45. I feel that those flags are disrespectful

The greyed-out American flag with the blue stripe through disrespectful the flag by using it as a symbol for something other than the whole country.

Same with strapping a flag to the back of a truck--the speed rips the flag to shreds. For people who like to wrap themselves in the flag, they surely don't have any respect for it.

[Shrike47]

12. I think you've got a point.

[delisen]

13. Ladders of the Mind. Submit to those above, kick those below

How do we get beyond the hierarchy?

I think it is possible.

[doc03]

17. Just run this experiment. Find you a guy with a "Make America Great Again"

hat on. Strike up a conversation with him and as hard as it may be agree with him. I bet he will start talking
blacks, Mexicans and Muslims. He won't be talking about how billionaires have screwed us over. When you get tired
of listening call him a racist asshole if you want.

[Garrett78]

18. Racism is the single most important factor in Republican success.

Absent racism, no Republican wins the White House. Hell, absent racism, there'd be no viable Republican Party. Seriously. When explaining Trump's rise to power, no other factor comes close to being as important as racism. I laugh out loud when folks try to suggest it's trade or taxes or jobs.

Racism is the tie that binds for the GOP.

Trump could break nearly every campaign promise and it wouldn't much matter to his supporters. But if he were to do a 180 on civil rights issues, particularly his view of BLM and immigration, his cult following would wither and die.

[demosincebirth]

32. True

[HughBeaumont]

49. It's no secret that no Democratic Presidential candidate has won the white vote since 1964.

As a country, we're still committing the same sins we refuse to atone for.

[workinclasszero]

52. Totally agree

It's so obvious.

[blueinredohio]

19. I also live in Ohio, my county and surrounding counties were 75% Trumpsters and every letter to the

editor quotes Fox News to the letter. I don't think they have a thought of their own.

[MiddleClass]

20. Exactly, I've read about this so many times from every source in Ohio, Wisconsin, Michigan, Pennsylv

When I posted that, in the words I did, I got my post removed.

Thank you for putting it in a more neutral, informative, factual way.

You alienate people and tell them they're not wanted, they leave the fold.

It's not racism, it's not women haters, it's not conservatives, those people just didn't feel welcome.

In Hillary's party any more. You can't blame them for voting against their interests, they were banished

[CakeGrrl]

27. "Banished"? How?

Do they still live in the U.S., still in their homes and neighborhoods?

Who "banished" them?

[MiddleClass]

48. Yes they still live in the US, they live in their homes and neighborhoods. And now those states vote

Despite being centerleft vote Republican.

A vast majority of the working middle class have at least one member of their family in law enforcement.

They voted for Clinton, Al Gore, John Kerry, Obama, and now trump.

And now all of a sudden you don't know who banished them?

Just read a cross-section of this very website

[mvd]

55. While I agree that we have paid less attention to..

rural and working class voters (the economic message, while there, isn't getting through), you would think they would be smart enough to know Trump would make things worse. It's frustrating.

[MiddleClass]

61. Yes it is very, Bernie tapped into that, but that started the wedge, the whole fiasco that summer

Was the nail in the coffin, nothing was getting through at that point.

While Hillary was trying to court/get suburban women, she lost the Rust Belt.

I don't think protests did it, I was shocked at the chanting content, and was praying not to get the response we got from the nonpolitical amongst us. Trump did not win because of Republicans, he produced new voters on a mission to make a statement. The northern redneck that was throwing his beer at the television all summer and did something about it, unfortunately.

[bdjhawk]

35. They weren't banished

And I do blame them for voting against their interests. It IS racism and woman hating. Not sure how blue collar/middle class folks felt unwanted by the Dems as HRC's and the party's planks gave specific support to helping them across the board- education, job training, health care, social security, etc. while the Repugs cared only about the 1%.

These are the folks who complain about the "snowflakes" who are concerned about how minorities, women, LGBT, handicapped, etc are treated. Yet these tRump voters are snowflakes to me--they just can't stand that minorities or women may get ahead when false barriers are removed so they want the discrimination to continue. IMHO, the LBJ quote about convincing the lowest white man he is better than the greatest black man and he will gladly go along with what is against his own interests. And I will add if he can get his wife to submit to him and put other women down, he will go along with the tRump/Repug 1%-er agenda then, too. Trump's disdain for smart. independent women is another dog whistle to these types.

[MiddleClass]

50. That's your opinion, which is fine, but it's their opinion that matters

It's your right to blame them for that and agree with you, but I understand why people feel the way they do.

If it is as you say JUST racism and woman hating, why did they vote for Democrats all their lives?

They voted for, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, welfare, food stamps, WIC, financial aid in education, Hillary care, Obama care, the auto industry bailout, stimulus, and overnight, they turned into racists for the richest 1 percent? I beg to differ, despite lying through his ass, he went to the Rust Belt talked about their problems and offered a solution. Now we all know he was full of crap, reluctantly, even them, but it was a simple choice between, the law and order President and the Goldman Sachs lady is going to turn America over to them people. Now, I don't agree with it, it's stupid thinking, but just try to understand why they were thinking that way. Remember in America you are constitutional right to be willfully stupid and vote.

Remember the other side of the coin, how many were stupid and stayed home in the Rust Belt? The combination killed us. All the talk about snowflakes, misses my point, something was happening and we have to understand what and why, not right and wrong.

I am 100 percent talking about why we lost the election, despite winning the popular vote by a large margin. I am not talking social issues on right and wrong, I am talking how social issues and want to do about it affects the other voting public. Bill Clinton was screaming to Hillary's campaign about this very issue. I wonder why, remember not right or wrong, why?

Remember, these people were not deplorable, but they did willfully go and join those deplorables and vote the way they did. We can't change their vote, but we can change what drove them there

[Coventina]

43. Please explain to me how "Hillary's Party" didn't make them feel welcome?

TIA

[MiddleClass]

56. Certainly, during election, Hillary's campaign paints Don the Con as unacceptable

Which he was, by the way,

the target audience was suburban housewives would normally vote Republican, Access Hollywood video, she had them. Late in the campaign, James Comey letter immediately had them running back into the Republican fold.

The Rust Belt, lost a massive amount of jobs over the last 30 years, automation, NAFTA, the web, a cheaper southern workforce. Massive job loss, massive resentment for those immigrants, massive resentment for others that took got jobs. All the people, Hillary Clinton was reaching out to. Think about it for a moment, because of NAFTA, those damn Mexicans did take their job, but they didn't even realize they weren't immigrants, the company emigrated to Mexico because of NAFTA. George Bush senior, basically started NAFTA, but Bill Clinton and by extension, Hillary finish implementing the law.

Now remember before the election. What was all over the news? Ferguson protests, every police shooting in the Midwest and protests that followed, anti-police chanting, followed by assassinating police officers. A perfect political wedge issue. Don the con jumped into one side of the argument as a lawyer and order president, Hillary was pigeonholed as the BLM president. And that was it.

[Coventina]

58. Doesn't sound like Hillary made them unwelcome.

Sounds like they went for Donald Trump because they were racists who identified with his message.

[MiddleClass]

62. Exactly, unfortunately the vitriol which was understandably over the top drove a wedge

With the regular Rust Belt common man, an ally for generations and now, sick and tired of being told "shut up and sit down, you straight, white people were in power long enough"

if you keep kicking the dog, don't complain when it bites you. It doesn't mean it's a mean junkyard dog, it's just a simple dog tired of you kicking it.

Now the other side have been bitten by dogs for 400 years, but that doesn't mean that every dog is a mean junkyard dog.

I hope and pray it's not taken the wrong way because I understand both sides, and both sides are 100 percent legitimate. But why do Democrats have to suffer, which they are, when this is been years in the making.

[MiddleClass]

26. A lot of these people have cops in the family

Say jail them if they did wrong, and withhold judgment until after it's investigated.

Now people in the community, the cop is automatically guilty, and that to is understandable.

Emotions can run wild, and if not kept within reason, tempers flare, again, understandable

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

29. Do you perhaps mean "formerly" blue area, not "formally" blue area?

[demosincebirth]

31. I think you are right and many of us seem unable to admit it to ourselves that what you posted is

probably true

[farmbo]

33. Another Ohioan here.... Colin Kaepernick's protests during the National Anthem..

... Were also mercilessly attacked by RW media in the Mahoning and Ohio River valley.
Kaepernick, a millionaire sports celebrity, was linked with BLM and was accused of disrespect ing the the troops when he took a knee during the playing of the National Anthem at 49ers games.
(Like the OP, I am not attacking Kaepernick or BLM; I'm just noting that this was a big topic of conversation among voters who went for Trump in 2016).

[Johonny]

39. When times are relatively good, people allow racism and other crap steer their vote

when times are scary they run back to the democrats...

Trump's victory was a sign of how complacent the American voters got due to Obama's success. When you're "worried" about BLM, you're really not that worried in general.

[MrScorpio]

51. Hence another example of this country's problem with white monoculture

It's very easy to manipulate these people into hating and fearing something or someone other than themselves.

Even in the case of Obama, someone in which they had previously approved.

[underpants]

57. I do think BLM is an under-mentioned factor

The media got white people really scared about that. When the guy did what he did in Dallas ambushing the cops I thought "uh Oh!"

I still think the biggest factor was the media 50-60%. First Trump was on air constantly. People will convince themselves to buy any product if it's put in front of the face 12-16 times. At the end the media declared it OVER which dissuaded a lot of people from voting.

Voter suppression 20% was next in order then the stumble 5-10% , Comey-Chaffetz 10%, and the fact that being the first woman POTUS was always going to be hard but following right after the first black POTUS was just too much change for some people. That last one and drunken/joke Brexit type votes were the tiny edge in Mich Wisc Pennsylvania.

[JoeStuckInOH]

60. No. Ohio and the other "Rustbelt" states voted for Trump becuase of manufacturing and immigration.

Easy to see why racist trump won the south. But I don't buy the racist angle as a majority reason he took Midwest and Appalachian states north of the Mason-Dixon Line.

Good jobs are hard to come by in a lot of the Rust-Belt and coal states. Michigan, Ohio, Indiana, Kentucky, West Virginia and Pennsylvania have been in consistent decline and the primary reason is quite literally loss of heavy industry and manufacturing to foreign places. Enough of Urban Chicago is still strong enough to keep Illinois blue, but know that if Chicago were in a similar conditions of Detroit/Cleveland/Youngstown/Pittsburgh... Illinois would be red too.

Trump gave a lot of lip service to not only stopping companies from leaving... but bringing American companies back. Not only that but his punitive stance against immigrants likely struck a chord of retribution among rust-belt disenfranchised workers.

IMO, from a lifelong Ohioan... it was 95%+ the "losing jobs and illegal immigrants taking jobs" angle.