Holy God! 50 years before Pilgrims Arrived in America....

[busterbrown]

This Happened: Incredible Violence based on Religious Doctrine...
Perhaps this was a prelude to our current problems with religious zealots.


http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/americas-first-true-pilgrims-50229713/

Just found this bit about 20 minutes ago

http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/14/politics/pope-advisers-trump-supporters/index.html?sr=fbCNN071417pope-advisers-trump-supporters0442PMStory

[USALiberal]

1. Thanks for this, saved to read later. n/t

[Not Ruth]

2. We should get new history books

[Lucinda]

3. KNR

[brewens]

4. This shouldn't be missed. The separation of church and state didn't come from atheists at all.

Far from it.

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/god-government-and-roger-williams-big-idea-6291280/

[csziggy]

5. There is a monument to Captain Ribault of that expedition

In 1562 he had placed a monument on the banks of the St. Johns River. I am not sure what happened to the original but in 1924 the Florida DAR placed a replica in a spot near Mayport, Florida. July 1958 the replica was moved to St. Johns Bluff at Fort Caroline National Park where it still stands.

I know this part of the history since among our family photos I found this one from 1961:

I'm sitting in the middle with my lovely glasses and my two older sisters on either side.
(This image shows why you should never touch a negative!)

I didn't remember or recognize the location but when I was scanning some DAR history I found the information on the moving and re-dedication of the replica monument.

The Florida Memory Project has a better picture:

https://www.floridamemory.com/items/show/74845

This picture was the one that helped me identify for certain the location.

And an image of Jean Ribault with his troops:

Jean Ribaut was Commander of three French ships, with 150 persons aboard, that arrived at the Saint Johns River on April 30, 1562. Ribaut named the stream River of May, and planted a stone pillar on the bank with the arms of France, the date, and his name engraved on it. The Ribault Monument near Jacksonville is dedicated to him.
https://www.floridamemory.com/items/show/24901

[dalton99a]

10. +1

[highplainsdem]

6. That was 7 yrs before the St. Bartholomew's Day massacre in France, when Catholics slaughtered

Protestants:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Bartholomew%27s_Day_massacre

The St. Bartholomew's Day massacre (French: Massacre de la Saint-Barthélemy) in 1572 was a targeted group of assassinations and a wave of Catholic mob violence, directed against the Huguenots (French Calvinist Protestants) during the French Wars of Religion. Traditionally believed to have been instigated by Queen Catherine de' Medici, the mother of King Charles IX, the massacre took place on the wedding day of the king's sister Margaret to the Protestant Henry III of Navarre (the future Henry IV of France). Many of the most wealthy and prominent Huguenots had gathered in largely Catholic Paris to attend the wedding.

The massacre began in the night of 23–24 August 1572 (the eve of the feast of Bartholomew the Apostle), two days after the attempted assassination of Admiral Gaspard de Coligny, the military and political leader of the Huguenots. The king ordered the killing of a group of Huguenot leaders, including Coligny, and the slaughter spread throughout Paris. Lasting several weeks, the massacre expanded outward to other urban centres and the countryside. Modern estimates for the number of dead across France vary widely, from 5,000 to 30,000.

The massacre also marked a turning point in the French Wars of Religion. The Huguenot political movement was crippled by the loss of many of its prominent aristocratic leaders, as well as many re-conversions by the rank and file, and those who remained were increasingly radicalized. Though by no means unique, it "was the worst of the century's religious massacres."[2] Throughout Europe, it "printed on Protestant minds the indelible conviction that Catholicism was a bloody and treacherous religion".[3]

-snip-

[zentrum]

8. Thanks.

[burrowowl]

7. K&R!!!!!!

[zentrum]

9. Kick!

[lastlib]

11. One of my all-time favorite quotes:

"History records the fact that men have gone to war and cut each others' throats over what was to become of them after their throats had been cut." --Walter Parker Stacy

[Canoe52]

12. Isn't humanity great? We must be god's chosen.

[GulfCoast66]

13. Many of us in Florida know this history well

And Virginians know they had the original English settlement. And Americans used to know that after fighting to a draw in the North and mid-Atlantic the revolutionary war was won in the South.

Lots of our history was rewritten after the civil war to minimize the impact the South had on early US history. Until the Civil War Virginia was as powerful as New York.

But that is the price the South got to pay for fighting a treasonous war to keep blacks enslaved. My family fought in both the revolutionary and civil wars. Unfortunately in the second one they chose poorly.

[Igel]

14. Three things don't matter.

Because they didn't matter.

The Spanish forts and exploration settlement. They're important in Floridian history, but by the time Florida was part of the US the US had its own history. The first settlements that led to the United States weren't Spanish.

The French settlement. For the same reason. It's part of a different thread of history. Communities, anthropologists know, rely on stories for unity and identity. The French and Spanish settlements aren't part of the United States story. Lots of anthropologists have said that to destroy a people, first destroy their stories. A lot of "newer history" is to undermine the stories and recreate or uncreate the uniting stories. Only other cultures' stories are worth preserving, and often researchers fight to preserve them and ensure continuity, true or false; think of this as a version of American exceptionalism because the US is exceptional in how its treated.

And coming in at #3, Roanoke. It's only of interest as a precursor or prolog to chapter 1. It's a "what might have been" saga. That's about it, except to the extent it influenced later expeditions.

Even some aspects of chapter 1 that went chronologically before the first word of chapter 1 are slighted, the story backfilled as necessary (and often incompletely because the information was unnecessary and complicated the story, or more recently because it undermines the alternative story that people wanted to tell).

In the same way, we bought the Louisiana Purchase from the French. Little mention of how the Spanish got it from the French or how the French got it back from the Spanish. Locals know it, but as far as the rest of US history, nobody really cares that the Louisiana Purchase was French for less than a month before the French transferred it to the US. It was billed in my history class as a shrewd deal that cheated the French out of a lot of value. The French couldn't afford it, so it was a fire sale--if they hadn't, the Spanish probably would have reclaimed it, or maybe the British would have moved in, and the French would have frowned and said bad words, nothing more. It's no more our story than the story of the family that lived next door to me is my story--where our histories touched, sure, but mostly they're irrelevant.

[GulfCoast66]

15. Another history fan...

I was not referring to Roanoke which was a failed settlement but Jamestown which predated Plymouth Rock by 15 years. The Pilgrims came looking for religious freedom(unless you disagreed with their religion) the Virginians came for wealth. The part of may family that gives me my name settled in Virginia but we were pikers and did not show up until the 1660's. Ironically, they were Huguenots.

And your Louisiana mention was great since that is where I was born and my Grandmothers first language was French! The architecture of the French quarter is Spanish! So the history of early Louisiana is not he history of the family that lived next door to me. That is my history.

And the irony of history that lives in my family...the ancestors of 3 of my grandparents fought in the revolutionary war. As did 3 of my wife's ancestors even thought she if from the Midwest. We both had ancestor who fought in the Blackhawk war under Andy Jackson. Since that 'army' was only a couple of thousand men there is a good chance our ancestors knew each other. Then 30 years later our ancestor fought against each other at Shiloh!

I am glad her ancestors came out on top!