Geologist believes Grand Canyon was caused by Noahs flood so hes suing the Park Service to prove

[smirkymonkey]

http://www.rawstory.com/2017/06/geologist-believes-grand-canyon-was-caused-by-noahs-flood-so-hes-suing-the-park-service-to-prove-it/

Ok. The stupid is burning a hole in the fabric of the nation. How this guy ever acquired the title of "Doctor" is a complete mystery.

"Dr. Andrew Snelling, the geologist, already had a formal request denied by the NPS last year, and is choosing to sue to prove his claim. Snelling’s “young earth creationism” concept is a mix of evangelical creationism theories that claim the earth is, according to Genesis, only a few thousand years old.

In a late May interview with the New York Times, Snelling’s lawyer Gary McCaleb of the Christian legal group Alliance Defending Freedom said his proposal was denied because of what he might find.

“It’s one thing to debate the science, but to deny access to the data not based on the quality of a proposal or the nature of the inquiry, but on what you might do with it is an abuse of government power,” McCaleb told the Times.

Snelling and his lawyers’ motivation, the Beast’s Candida Moss writes, “is to demonstrate the biblical Flood story happened, and happened just as the Bible says it did. His research, if it panned out, would have the additional bonus of grounding the scientific evidence for the flood in the United States.” For fundamentalist Americans,” she continues, “the only thing better than a Bible story is an American Bible story.”

What is even more amazing is that this "Doctor" has a "Lawyer".

WTF. Seriously. WTF?

[dhill926]

1. more religious insanity....

[KentuckyWoman]

2. Just dropped Netflix yesterday because of this

They have uploaded this guys idiot "intelligent design" special.

[Initech]

37. OK I may have to do a deep dive on this for the Top 10.

[Nitram]

3. Where did he get his degree? No accredited university or college could give a geology degree

to a young earth creationist.

[Igel]

7. University of Sydney.

Thesis title: "A Geochemical Study of the Koongarra Uranium Deposit, Northern Territory, Australia"


Often one's research for degree is unrelated to any of the young-Earth lunacy. Knew a molecular biologist at UCLA who didn't believe in evolution. Didn't keep him from publishing in reasonable journals. On the other hand, he was worried his advisor would find out and dump him, not because of bad research but because of his religious views.

[Nitram]

39. Clearly I'm behind the times. And a bit naive.

[Baconator]

16. Many do...

They work around the system in legitimate universities or just go to straight fundy schools but they don't have the same quality of reputations obviously.

[Drahthaardogs]

4. PhD's can be stupid just like anyone else.

Seems counter intuitive but it's true.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

18. There is a difference between intelligence and wisdom.

A geologist Ph.D. is almost certainly intelligent.

But how a person applies their intelligence is an indicator of whether they have wisdom or not. A true scientist works hard to try to find evidence that goes against their own beliefs. The more attempts at knocking down a theory that it passes, the stronger is the confidence in the theory.

Pseudo-scientists like Snelling are technically skilled, but unwisely look for evidence to support their pet theories.

As almost all of us are agreed, the theory of Young Earth has failed numerous tests and is discarded by all except those who put their faith ahead of everything else.

[Drahthaardogs]

21. Absolutely, although I will say this...

I think you can incredibly intelligent and lack wisdom, but I do not think you can be wise without at least an average intelligence.

I also think University and professionals fail to screen adequately for candidates with exceptional wisdom. A classic example are ivy league schools who will pull the trigger on a student with tremendous SATs and good grades with little extra curricular activities but snub a 4.0 student who excelled on the field and other extra curricular activities if they have average SATs.

One of these kids shows the decision making ability to get the best out of what God gave them, while one doesn't seem able to pull it together.

I see it all the time.

[Hortensis]

5. He's suing to remove 60 1/2-pound rocks. Oh, my. Lol.

"The stupid is burning a hole in the fabric of the nation." Should point out he's here from Australia. Maybe he fell through one of the holes he burned there first.

These people will always be with us. Men and women used to have shovels and sewing kits at hand to tidy up "the holes" they left around town. They were often the crazy relatives allowed to make a home in the barn because they had nowhere else to go. Now they have the internet to spread their message to like-minded supporters far and wide.

[Ilsa]

12. So thirty pounds of rocks are going to prove

his belief that Earth is only 6000 years old?

Is there any reason to hope he will come to a different conclusion when he does his research, or will his confirmation bias get in the way?

Geez, the Grand Canyon, for me, is prime evidence that our planet is millions of years old.

[petronius]

6. If he's already in Australia, he should just go the the Jack Hills instead

They've got rocks there that are twice as old as the oldest rocks in the Grand Canyon...

[hunter]

8. Mining geology is hard work. Ripping off Creationists by telling them what they want to hear...

... is easy.

[3catwoman3]

9. Maybe he didn't become...

...Jesus-addled until after he completed his doctorate?

[smirkymonkey]

25. Maybe he never really completed his "doctorate" in the first place.

Who on earth would give such an idiot a legitimate degree?

[3catwoman3]

30. I remember having similar thoughts...

...when listening to now-former Congressman Paul(?) Broun, who I think was from Georgia. The guy is an MD, and a couple of election cycles ago was ranting away about hod he did not believe in evolution or embryology. EMBRYOLOGY! That is an entire class in med school. Med students study the slides. How can a doctor not "believe in" embryology.

(I'm getting callouses on my forehead.)

[procon]

10. OK, so he has a profession degree AND he whores himself out for money

on the side by exploiting ignorant fundamentalists. No one should find this man to be unusual. He's just a con man who thought up a unique gig in a niche market to make himself rich. Welcome to American Capitalism 101!

[Baconator]

17. Meh...

Some of them really believe the gibberish...

[smirkymonkey]

27. I would seriously question that "degree".

Honestly, how can someone call themselves a learned person and spout this garbage?

[Quixote1818]

11. It doesn't even look like it was caused by a flood.

The side canyons mostly formed along fault lines and are clearly cut by water flowing off the Kaibab Plateau which slopes causing a lot more erosion on the N. Side of the river than the south as the south side tips away from the canyon for the most part.


Interesting how at the bottom the fossil life forms are so simple and as you go up they become more complex. Amazing how the flood laid them all down like that.


This is what a giant flood causes and how it looks:

[hunter]

19. Here's an interesting article about the scablands...

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2017/03/channeled-scablands/

[Quixote1818]

26. Thanks! nt

[ProudLib72]

13. Religious stupidity is a state of mind

Lump him in with "Dr" Ben Carson.

[Warren DeMontague]

14. You could put quotes around "Geologist", too

You can't be an actual scientist, to my mind, if you flat-out reject scientific fact and method.

These imbeciles make me too.

[GaYellowDawg]

20. Bingo. He's a creationist, not a geologist.

nm

[smirkymonkey]

28. Seriously, I could call myself a fucking geologist and make shit up.

Would anyone believe it? Probably. If I was a republican.

[Louis1895]

15. The Two Dr. Snellings

[link:http://www.noanswersingenesis.org.au/realsnelling.htm|
Will the Real Dr Snelling Please Stand Up?]

[hunter]

24. I think he enjoys his world travels, especially when the moron creationists pay for it.

A wolf in their midst.

Or maybe he banged his head on a rock.

[Jake Stern]

22. So wish these nutter fundamentalist Christians

Would stop misreading OUR book to justify their lunacy.

[L. Coyote]

23. There must be a DONATE button somewhere. The best way to find an easy mark is to sell stupid.

Surely, a few of us could band together and start a 501(c)3 to live in mansions selling Jesus to the stupid marks. How about we do the Flat Earth Alliance?

[gibraltar72]

29. People seem to be missing the bigger question.

Does religion breed insanity or does insanity breed religion?

[Permanut]

31. Same with "Doctor" Steven A Austin..

of the Institute for Creation Research. Even wrote a book about it. Also believes the Mt. St. Helens eruption "proves" that the Earth is just thousands of years old. He actually made a video of it, introduced by Ken Ham another Australian, and President and founder of something called "Answers in Genesis".

I watched the video several times, trying to fathom how he could "get there"; to conclude from findings at the Grand Canyon and Mt. St. Helens would indicate in any way that the age of the Earth matches up with some old Hebrew folk tales. Seems ironic that these people who present themselves as educated, intelligent and able to interpret "holy scripture" for us could be so stupid.

Disclaimer: I am a member of a Lutheran church, but I'm a very poor Lutheran. Joined so I could go feed soup and stuff to the shelter guys.

[tblue37]

32. The same way fundamentalists get to be lawyers, probably--by attending a religious college or law

school.

[Takket]

33. good on NPS for refusing to even provide an audience to this nonsense

next thing you know scientists will be forced to "prove" there is no bigfoot or toothfairy. The NPS has enough work to do with actual real life issues. even listening to this foolishness implies that there is a debate to be had. these is not.

[icymist]

34. More on this guy:

According to the complaint and his online biography, Snelling obtained a doctoral degree in geology from the University of Sydney in 1982 and began his career by studying the Koongarra uranium deposit in Australia's Northern Territory. He spent time in exploration and mining industries before becoming involved with organizations that espouse creationism, rather than evolution.

From 1998 to 2007, Snelling was a geology expert at the Creation Science Foundation and has since worked for Kentucky-based Answers in Genesis, an organization that investigates geology "from a Biblical perspective."

He's also been an interpreter on more than 30 river trips in the Grand Canyon, which has been a central area of study for creationist geologists.

The complaint describes Snelling as "primarily focused on investigating geological phenomena from the perspective of one who believes in the truth of the Old and the New Testaments."

In 2013, Snelling applied for a permit to study the folding of Paleozoic sedimentary structures at four locations within the Grand Canyon. He wanted to collect 60 fist-sized rocks from the sites.

http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/05/creationist-geologist-sues-us-park-service-after-it-rejects-request-collect-samples

[thecrow]

35. My brother just visited the " Creation Museum"

and sent me lots of pictures of the exhibits pushing this "grand canyon was formed by Noah's flood"
"theory". I was shocked. It was a oage taken straight out of medieval times.
This attraction draws millions each year.
Now I am wondering what other types of exhibits they will force on the believing public, and wonder how far they get to go with this. They already have dinosaurs boarding the ark.

[Permanut]

40. Once you've been to the Kool Aid bowl..

Or twice or a few thousand times, there is an answer for everything. For example, Bob Dutko, a thumper mouthpiece out of Detroit who has a daily radio show "Fearlessly defending the faith", argues that of course those dinosaurs "must have been baby dinosaurs". The show is broadcast around the country on various radio stations of the Crawford Broadcasting Network, a collection of a couple dozen stations. I would recommend limiting your exposure to anything on this network in order to avoid taking a hammer to your radio.

Dutko also has a webpage where he offers us (for $15.00, of course) a selection of CD's with the theme "Top Ten Proofs". We can listen to such scientific masterpieces as "Top Ten Proofs Christianity is the Only True Religion", and "Top Ten Proofs Evolution is Scientifically Impossible".

I have no problem with anyone who wants to visit those particular Kool Aid bowls. My concern is, as you say, that they are attempting, with some success, to force their beliefs into the lives of the believing public, and more alarmingly, into government.

I'm assuming your brother was favorably impressed by the exhibits at the "museum". I have family members who also would probably enjoy it, and no doubt would send me pictures. Not sure I'm correct in that assumption, however.

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

36. "The Rocks Don't Lie" by David R. Montgomery

is about the development of modern geology. About a hundred and fifty years ago geologists who were sincere Christians set out to prove the Biblical Flood. Along the way the discovered that the earth is a whole lot older than they'd originally thought, and that there is zero proof of a world-wide flood.

So basically, what that idiot is attempting to "prove" has already been considered and found entirely wrong.

Really good book by the way. I recommend it to anyone with even a passing interest in the topic.

[Permanut]

41. Great tip..

Thanks!

[DFW]

38. These nut cases have been immortalized in song, though maybe not how they'd like

http://www.jango.com/music/The+Freedom+Toast

Look in the center for "The Evolution," listen and hear what we're up against (at least you can dance to it, too)