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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsOBAMA Rips Mitt For "Abandoning a Principle"...because of "pressure for two days from Rush Limbaugh"
The Morning Plum: Obama rips Romneys lack of principlesBy Greg Sargent
Obama, in an interview with WLWT in Cincinnatti thats set to air today, slammed Mitt Romney for flip flopping on whether Obamacares individual mandate is a tax:
One of the things that you learn as President is that what you say matters and your principles matter. And sometimes, youve got to fight for things that you believe in and you cant just switch on a dime.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/post/the-morning-plum-obama-rips-romneys-lack-of-principles/2012/07/06/gJQAdWecRW_blog.html
Democat
(11,617 posts)Limbaugh must be about as unpopular as he's ever been.
TrollBuster9090
(5,955 posts)tnvoter
(257 posts)It's an excellent strategy -- plays to the flip-flopper image Mitt got painted with during the Republican primaries. So even Republicans can agree on this one...
Kyad06
(127 posts)Robbedme has no convictions, no ideas, no morals. He is a spineless nothing.
DCKit
(18,541 posts)Your (wonderful) wife knows when to ignore people. Talk to her.
Democat
(11,617 posts)It's probably better to be out in front of everything and to set the narrative before the other guy does.
Chorophyll
(5,179 posts)which is how they've managed to stay in power despite being empty, out of ideas, and morally bankrupt. Time to grab back the narrative, and leave them with nothing.
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)Staying above the fray and igoring your opponents' attacks is straight out of the Dukakis/Kerry playbooks. Bill Clinton and BHO taught us the right way to do it and we aren't going back.
karynnj
(59,504 posts)The media for the most part colluded with the Republicans and condoned character assassinations of both John and Teresa Kerry.
Here is a PARTIAL list of Kerry and his team's reactions to the SBVT:
The campaign's immediate reaction to the August attack was to put out 36 pages listing lies and discrepancies in the book. That was done within ONE DAY of the book's emergence in August.(In 2008, the first reaction of the Obama team was to put out 41 pages on lies in Corsi's book.) This should have been sufficient to spike their attack. How many lies are people usually allowed when they are disputing the official record, offering nothing - not one Telex, photo, or record sent upward discussing Kerry as the problem portrayed in the book - as proof. They also later proved the links to Bush - in funding, lawyers, and in one case the B/C people were caught passing it out. In addition, Kerry surrogates including some of his crew, Rassman and Cleland countered it. (Like Kerry, Obama used surrogates against Corsi rather than respond himself)
That was far more proof countering the liars than the Clinton machine ever put out on anything. The problem was that it went to the media and they refused to play the role of evaluating who was telling the truth - the Washington Post's editor even saying they wouldn't. The broadcast media was worse. Would Obama have done as well if the networks and cable TV failed to give coverage to his speech on race in the furor over Reverend Wright?
Many Democrats, including Edwards who was asked to, did little. It wasn't that they had no ammunition to use. There was an abundance of proof - far more than would be typically available as they hit against a well documented official record. Even before the August re-emergence, the Kerry campaign had already provided the media with more than enough backup for them to reject the August attack out of hand.
It should also be mentioned that it was not Kerry's accounts they disputed, it was the NAVY's official record. Backing the NAVY account over the SBVT, Kerry had the following:
he had 120 pages of naval records - spanning the entire interval with glowing fitness reports - all given to the media and on his web site from April on. That alone should have been enough. (In addition to disproving the SBVT lies, these reports completely dispute the RW stereotype that Kerry was an elite snob - in EVERY position for about 4 years, it was noted how exceptional his relationship with his subordinates was and how intensely loyal they were to him. Tour of Duty also had accounts that Kerry rejected the way many officers treated their subordinates because it completely disgusted him. No Romney/Bush bully here.)
He had every man on his boat for every medal earned 100% behind him. That alone should have been enough.
He had the Nixon administration on tape (that they thought would never be public) saying he was both a genuine war hero and clean, but for political reasons should be destroyed. (SBVT O'Neil was one of those tasked to destroy Kerry in 1971.) That alone should have been enough.
He also was given a plum assignment in Brooklyn as an aide to a rear admiral. From the naval records, this required a higher security clearance - clearly his "employers" of the last 3 years (many SBVT) had to attest to his good character. That's just standard. That alone should have been enough.
The then secretary of the Navy (Republican Senator John Warner) said he personally had reviewed the Silver Star Award. That alone should have been enough.
Compare this list of proof to Carville & Co response on Clinton's Flowers or draft problems - this is far more comprehensive and completely refutes the charges. The Clinton responses in these two instances did not completely refute the charges - in fact, after changing his story a few times in each case - conceding that earlier statements were not completely true - parts of the charges were conceded. The difference was that in 1992 - even in the primary - Clinton was given breaks by a media that wanted him to win. The fact is that we KNEW in those two cases that he was willing to dissemble and scapegoat others when he was called on his actions - two things that later hurt his Presidency.
In any previous election, calmly and professionally countering lies by disproving them would have been the obvious preferred first step. It is only when there is no open and shut case (as there is here) that the candidate would try anything different.When this didn't work, Kerry did speak to the issue - and he did so before the Firefighters as soon as it was appear that the attack was beginning to hurt him. Many here - all political junkies didn't here this. Why? The media that gave a huge amount of free time to people they had to know were lying didn't think that it was important to give the Democratic nominees response air time. Now, it was - I think less than 2 minutes long - so there is no excuse.
As to Teresa, I am STILL often surprised to learn of major things she did through her foundation. Four quick major examples are:
Teresa through example with her offices and the buildings she funded or partially funded was key to making Pittsburgh one of the greenest big cities in the US. In addition, while doing this she initiated a coordinated successful effort by several Pittsburgh philanthropists to revitalize Pittsburgh which was in trouble in the mid 1990s. She has funded prototype programs for education in PA that have helped prove their value. The foundation with Corey Booker created a way to provide several types of needed medicines to low income people inexpensively. Yet during the campaign nothing was said of her accomplishments. In addition, as one who has seen her a few times at their book signings and at political events, she is a gracious, charming, softspoken woman, who is very very intelligence and who has a very good sense of humor.
In the 1990s, Teresa was always mentioned as beautiful (which she still is), intelligent and charming and a political asset to Heinz. Now consider that the media reported very little of this and instead created a caricature. Obviously the reason was to prevent what would have happened otherwise. If seen as she is, the fact that she married Kerry would have for some validated that he was a very good person. In fact, a PA transplanted Republican in my NJ county spoke of Kerry being the first Democrat she voted for - and the initial reason she considered doing so was " if Teresa married him he wasn't sleazy"
The Wizard
(12,548 posts)were presented as news by the corporate media, thus lending legitimacy to the lie. People saw these ads on news broadcasts and as a result were more likely to believe them as truth. The actual ad buys for the SBVT were small. The corporate media used the ads as news to damage the Democratic candidate. So much for the liberal media.
The draft dodging AWOL deserter Bush was portrayed as a war hero and the war hero was portrayed as a traitor.
The propaganda we get as news comes right form the Goebbels Diaries. The old Soviet propaganda outlets,Pravda TAAS and Izvestia, could have learned a few tactics from the likes of ABC, CBS, NBC, Pox and CNN. We are the dumbest country on Earth by design.
karynnj
(59,504 posts)of the money he had for the general campaign, it would have done little to help. His ads - citing the truth - would have been seen as ads - where the news was seen as the "neutral" source.
This was really outrageous when you think of the sacrifice made by the 25 year old Kerry, who certainly could have pulled strings to avoid risking his life/health in Vietnam. The galling thing was the Republicans claiming he was not "injured enough" . I remember the look Vanessa Kerry, now a doctor, had when those comments were made.
barbtries
(28,811 posts)we'd like to be above it all but that just seems to land us in the loser column.
politicasista
(14,128 posts)(and the factual post fall on deaf ears)
People for some reason love to hate on Kerry, but praise B. Clinton and Obama.
Rove and the GOP love it when we eat our own.
Thanks a lot Cahill and Shrum. Thanks for making a decent dem be seen as the unofficial poster Dem for "not" fighting back and how "not to run a campaign."
Well, at least Obama knows/respects what a good surrogate Kerry is, guess we never, ever appreciate that.
JMHO
"Ignore them" gives them their power. We need to hit them HARD, fast, and repeatedly. And then kick them when they are down. (no, not LITERALLY, figuratively)
Coddling and letting them run their game when dealing with these these jerks only emboldens them.
DCKit
(18,541 posts)Even when they're so pitiful at it.
But you've got to admit, Michelle ignoring those RW hags about "her bare arms" worked well. I get a serious laugh every time that bring it up. They're obsessed with it beyond belief, and I can't help myself.
Oh, those nekkid arms. We love you Michelle, and don't ever want to see those arms covered up. You worked hard on those arms... a real role model.
nxylas
(6,440 posts)There's a huge difference in what you can ignore when you're not in a role that requires you to fight for re-election.
As nice, beautiful, and wonderful as The First Lady is, her role in the battle, is at most secondary.
You cannot let Teathuglicans say ANYTHING that goes unanswered. That is exactly how they distort reality and make it stick.
If ever there was an example of "those that fail to remember history are condemned to repeat it" this is it.
randome
(34,845 posts)That's what Obama does best. He knows when to pull his punches and he knows when to let them have it.
Obama needs to go MMA on Romney's ass and NEVER let up until November.
But that's not enough - they need to dominate with their ground game too. They have to spoil the Repubs plans for hacking the election - on the machines and in the districts.
Will they? Can they? It will require thinking outside the box.
Bluzmann57
(12,336 posts)Sorry, the repukes happen to bring out the worst in me. But kicking 'em when they're down literally wouldn't really do any good, but ooooohhhhh it would be enjoyable. By the way, I hope you understand that I am kidding. Sort of.
mac56
(17,574 posts)Mmmmkay?!
lunatica
(53,410 posts)His wife is probably clapping her hands enthusiastically when you're not looking.
DCKit
(18,541 posts)Do you actually think she'd be sitting by, clapping like an idiot for her husband? That was the last one. I generally respect you, but you went too far this time.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)But obviously you think clapping about something her husband says makes her an idiot. I see it very differently and will continue to do so.
efhmc
(14,732 posts)the idea of ignoring anything that reveal the sliminess of romney. Michelle is not an adoring clapper,
DCKit
(18,541 posts)just not an idiot clapper. Unlike the teabaggers, she's not an idiot... and she's kind of hot, too boot.
Smart AND attractive. How long has it been since we're seen that in a First Lady?
AlbertCat
(17,505 posts)Ignore his opponent in the Prez election????????
Are you nuts?
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)the fools that listen to him including Romney.
How many times have I heard people say that they hate Limbaugh but they listen to him. Why listen to someone you hate? Come on now. Be honest. People who cannot think for themselves listen to Limbaugh because he is a verbal bully and believing that they are on the right side of the big bully and know where he is coming from makes them feel safe.
Unfortunately, Limbaugh influences people through their subconscious fear mechanisms. And the fact that Romney is responding to Limbaugh suggests that he is a very fearful, insecure person who does not react rationally with strength and true conviction but rather reacts like a hunted animal to the roar of the lion.
Have you ever watched an animal run in terror from the lion's roar? (If it isn't too late already.) Limbaugh roars like a lion and the "leaders" of the right wing run like deers. Describes Romney perfectly.
Romney is in way over his head.
progressivebydesign
(19,458 posts)It works for people who are already supporting Obama, but we've taken the high road too many times. The Democrats keep playing fair because we believe it's the right thing to do.. but the game has changed, and there are no merit prizes for playing nice and fair.
Sort of like being in a sanctioned boxing match vs getting jumped in an alley by four thugs. I'm all for playing nice and fair when everyone is held to the same rules, but if someone wants to scrap and attack, then all bets are off. The only way to reach the undecideds and the people who aren't comfortable with Romney, is to respond to their monied and vicious attacks, head-on.
Hey.. my thought is that we may not win over all the republicans to vote for Obama, BUT you can certainly do enough damage to Romney's credibility to keep a lot of people home who would have voted for the republican otherwise. I suspect there will be a lot of write ins in those republican precincts this year. There will not be a clothespin strong enough to hold the nose while voting for Romney the flip flopping elitist. HE is all the things they accused Kerry and Dukakis of.. but in his case, they're true.
maddiemom
(5,106 posts)politicasista
(14,128 posts)the way BC and Obama are handling things, yet still berate Kerry (and Gore for that matter) for everything. Guess that those surrogate dems that were M.I.A. in 04, and the media is off the hook, but guess that facts never get in the way of Kerry bashing.
Your last sentence deserves more notice. Rove loves it when we eat are own (not you).
NYC Liberal
(20,136 posts)yes, absolutely Kerry gets way too much crap. The media gave the Swift Liars months of free airtime for their ads (by playing them over and over as part of "news" coverage), and a free platform from they got to spew their lies nonstop without being challenged on it. Yet that media gave almost no coverage to the Kerry and his campaign's numerous responses.
Response to NYC Liberal (Reply #64)
politicasista This message was self-deleted by its author.
klook
(12,166 posts)Sitting on your hands waiting for the other guy to self-destruct is not going to get the job done.
awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)hit them every chance you get. The minute you stop, they will hit back.
DCKit
(18,541 posts)I can't dispute that, and I won't try. You're all correct. I was wrong on the Internets, and I got schooled by peoples I respect. Every one of you approached and said it differently, but you are all correct. It's why I love and respect my fellow DUers.
I'm glad I said what I did and caused so many people to come out swinging. We need that passion, and every one of you made a good point about why I was wrong. I hope they're listening to you and not to me, and that you're all fighting the good fight on the ground.
Note karynnj's post. It's full of facts that many in this thread ignore.
DCKit
(18,541 posts)politicasista
(14,128 posts)you can't be serious.
cbdo2007
(9,213 posts)They will still be fun but that's going to be like my Superbowl this year and I'm just getting excited and impatient.
Motown_Johnny
(22,308 posts)and now the law was upheld because one justice thinks it is a tax.
I think he would do better to just let Rmoney twist in the wind on this one. He has the same problem but right now nobody is hitting him on it.
Gold Metal Flake
(13,805 posts)More of this, please.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)LOL!
NewJeffCT
(56,829 posts)how can he stand up to the likes of Vladimir Putin, Hu Jintao and other world leaders?
progressivebydesign
(19,458 posts)magical thyme
(14,881 posts)Initech
(100,103 posts)nanabugg
(2,198 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)the decidedly apolitical, Mrs. 1StrongBlackMan and she was saying that she just didn't get why this "race is so close."
I pointed out that after all President Obama has done, this race is boiling down to a "Black guy/Not Black guy decision.
She then surprised me be recounting a number of things President Obama has done and how it supports the majority of working class Americans.
I smiled and said, "When he's re-elected, you ain't seen nothing yet!"
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)JohnnyRingo
(18,641 posts)For some reason, Republicans now have to ask permission before they even open their mouth, and the list of people they have to get approval from grows and grows.
Republicans forming John McCain into their ideal image was a large part of his undoing. Choosing Palin was a large part of this ass-kissing process. The candidate twists himself into a pretzel to please everyone in the party:
pokerfan
(27,677 posts)Everything changes. Its almost like an Etch A Sketch. You can kind of shake it up and restart all over again.
SHRED
(28,136 posts)Thats the man I voted for and will be voting for again.
MrScorpio
(73,631 posts)Blanks
(4,835 posts)Romney can't win (in this particular scenario).
Response 1: Romney defies the president People listen to Rush and see that Romney is getting his talking points from Rush. Rush is bat shit crazy for 3 hours a day. Nobody wants that in the white house.
Response 2: Romney listens to the president (already a bad choice for him) and there is less marching lock step within republican ranks. Rush fans are mad at Romney.
It's win win for Obama. I expect he's gearing up for saying that Fox News and the networks are telling him what to say since that was on another thread.
politicasista
(14,128 posts)why do people continue to blame Kerry for the SBL, yet we praise Obama for taking the high road (which he should)? Shouldn't the lack of Dem surrogates that were M.I.A. get the blame too?
The big difference is that Obama has surrogates, Kerry and Gore did not, or had very few.
Bolo Boffin
(23,796 posts)pressure from Rupert Murdoch and the WSJ, thank you very much! I mean..."
Love this guy.
RockyMtnGuy
(83 posts)I'm so sick or all the Rethug shit. Sunday morning talk shows never call a single one of them out for lies. It's about god-damn time the President makes a stand and stops taking the crap. I want to see him get angry, like all of us are angry.
Catch2.2
(629 posts)just say he's going off what the SC said, not Rush Limbaugh or any other republican loudmouths? Just playing devil's advocate.
aint_no_life_nowhere
(21,925 posts)Is it purely for his ego? Is it to lower taxes and make himself even richer? He doesn't seem to stand for anything. He doesn't strike me an obsessed ideologue. At least an asshole like Santorum had a goal and a purity to his evil. Romney is just a kite blowing in the wind, depending on the direction of the stream of air gushing from Limbaugh's ass.
BumRushDaShow
(129,483 posts)of the office and what it means in terms of the hegemony that comes with it. Airforce One. Marine One. Thousands of the world's greatest military saluting as the President walks past them. Access to the world's leaders, (theoretical) access to the dirt on every one of your enemies, and on and on.
It's a power thing. You can have all the money in the world but ironically enough, the office of the POTUS has the power.
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)His father ran and he got a little taste of the power.
Kinda like Palin stringing along the media to keep them nipping at her heels.
The Jungle 1
(4,552 posts)Bam
Dats gonna leave a mark.
Now keep that news cycle going for the next two weeks.
Initech
(100,103 posts)demosincebirth
(12,543 posts)Kennah
(14,315 posts)The President isn't wading slowly into the 2012 fight. He's fully in, punching, and connecting.
Response to kpete (Original post)
D23MIURG23 This message was self-deleted by its author.
Third Doctor
(1,574 posts)He's on Mitt's ass 24/7.
magnifisense
(285 posts)The GOP wants a puppet. Romney is their puppet.