Flynn is asking immunity from Senate Intel Comittee

[edhopper]

not from prosecutors. There is a big difference.

So stop thinking the hammer is about to fall on Trump and they are assembling criminal charges.

Oliver North got immunity, nothing he said lead to criminal charges against Reagan.

[caroldansen]

1. Ahhhh. But the good news is that trump is not Reagan.

[get the red out]

2. Why does he need it?

Why does he even need immunity from the Senate Intel Committee then?

[edhopper]

5. becasuse he is guilty

like Oliver North was.
But the Intel Committee isn't looking get to his boss, as a prosecutor would.

[LisaL]

3. What in the world are you talking about?

He wants immunity from prosecution.

[edhopper]

4. yes

but in exchange for testimony. The Intel committee is interested in getting the facts, not making adeal to get higher ups, as a prosecutor would. There is different intent in the immunity.

[BumRushDaShow]

6. The nuance is described in the below NYT article

Michael Flynn Offers to Testify Before Congress in Exchange for Immunity

By MARK MAZZETTI and MATTHEW ROSENBERG MARCH 30, 2017

<...>

The F.B.I. is investigating whether any of President Trump’s advisers colluded with the Russian government in its efforts to disrupt the 2016 presidential election. An immunity deal would make it extraordinarily difficult for the Justice Department to prosecute Mr. Flynn.

It is unclear whether any of Mr. Trump’s other former advisers have asked for immunity from the congressional committees.

It is common for witnesses to demand immunity in exchange for their testimony to ensure that their words cannot be used to prosecute them. Under federal law, Congress can grant witnesses immunity for their testimony, but lawmakers normally do so only after consulting with prosecutors.

Congress normally avoids doing anything that could disrupt a federal investigation. Federal law allows the Justice Department to delay a congressional immunity deal but not block it outright.

<...>

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/30/us/politics/michael-flynn-congress-immunity-russia.html?_r=0

[edhopper]

8. Thanks

but they have in some cases, like Oliver North. And I think they will do so now, especially with the GOP in charge.

[BumRushDaShow]

17. Right

I just cited the article to help clarify what the technicalities are regarding "immunity" and potential ramifications for granting it.

In this case, given the GOP controls everything, and given their current propensity to throw all manner of precedent and compliance with existing ethics rules and other laws by the wayside, they could easily grant this, Flynn could lie his ass off and exonerate the entire TFEE, and then all of them will be on their way to continue bilking the treasury and the taxpayer.

[edhopper]

18. So true

there will be no penalty for perjury.

We have seen that with Sessions.

[MineralMan]

7. If a Congressional Committed give someone immunity,

nothing that person says in committee hearings can be brought as evidence in court. Essentially, it makes it almost impossible to prosecute that person, since all evidence in court against the person would have to be independently developed.

While prosecution would still be possible, it would be very unlikely to happen.

Further, if that person implicated others in congressional testimony, that person would probably be offered immunity by a prosecutor to get that information into trials of the others.

Still, Flynn has other things to worry about. There are many people who do not want anyone with immunity to be testifying. He's going to need to watch his back very intently from now on, I think, and even that may not be enough.

[edhopper]

9. for Flynn yes

but to much speculation around here that he is flipping on Trump.
That Trump indictment is just around the corner.

[MineralMan]

10. Hmm...an impeachment would be more likely than an

indictment for Trump, I think.

Indicting a President is a tough nut to crack when it involves official stuff. I'm not sure that could actually happen, although much of this went on before he was President, which does provide a window. However, impeachment is easy, since Congress sets the rules for what are "High crimes and misdemeanors."

[edhopper]

11. yes, your are right

but that is another thing. Anyone who thinks this GOP Congress will impeach Trump, or even take it up is smoking something.

[MineralMan]

12. I disagree. This GOP Congress would prefer Pence.

That, to me, seems crystal clear. But, they will need a very strong reason to impeach Trump. When they have it, the votes to impeach and remove will be there in both Houses and will be bi-partisan, I think.

Trump is a loose cannon that could sink the GOP ship as soon as 2018. Lots of people want to keep their phony baloney jobs in Congress, and they will act based on that, not the good of the nation.

Pence would sign pretty much anything the Republicans send him, including stuff I don't even want to think about. Trump might sign the same stuff, but his administration is careening near a collapse, and that would hurt a lot of GOP congresscritters in 2018.

[edhopper]

14. They might prefer Pence

but they will never impeach trump. Party over Country, no matter what.
We have seen nothing but cover for Trump from the GOP leadership.
It's foolish to wait for impeachment.

[MineralMan]

16. I'm actually not waiting for anything. Just observing.

I feel fairly certain that Trump will resign before this year is out. I'm just musing.

[edhopper]

19. I don't think his ego

will let him resign.

I think he will burn it all down before he let's that happen.

Our nation’s struggle for existence forces us to utilize all means, even within Reich territory, to weaken the fighting power of our enemy and to prevent further advances. Any opportunity to inflict lasting damage on the striking power of the enemy must be taken advantage of. It is a mistake to believe that undestroyed or only temporarily paralyzed traffic, communications, industrial, and supply installations will be useful to us again after the recapture of lost territories. During his retreat, the enemy will leave behind only scorched earth and will abandon all concern for the population.

[KingCharlemagne]

13. The Justice Department already has Flynn dead to rights on a few federal felonies, even

before he has testified under oath once.

Much will depend on Flynn's "proffer" - if Flynn says he will testify that Trump directed him to tell Kislyak that sanctions would be lifted in a Trump administration, that would be testimony worthy of a congressional grant of immunity, I would think (and lay the groundwork for Trump's impeachment for high crimes and misdemeanors).

[L. Coyote]

15. They wish they could get immunity deals. The evidence is already gathered, sorry guys.

We would not know about the investigation if it had not already done its work. When the White House ordered document retention, the game was up. That weekend, Trump's strategy of cyber-lynching the black guy revealed they have no valid defense and they need to get the evidence thrown out. They know it is over.