I think we all agree that Bernie Sanders is a fine Senator,

[MineralMan]

who helps Democrats with their efforts in the Senate, despite not being a member of that party.

I don't know of anyone on DU who doesn't agree with that statement.

However, he is just one Senator who votes with the Democratic Caucus. We have many fine Senators in our Democratic Party, including the two from my state of Minnesota, Amy Klobuchar and Al Franken.

I think Bernie Sanders is doing an excellent job in the Senate, and encourage him to continue doing that as a full-time member of the Senate. I'm sure everyone agrees with that, as well.

We like you, Senator Sanders. That's clear. We'll count on you to continue voting with the Democratic Caucus, and we thank you for your cooperation with Senate Democrats.

[left-of-center2012]

1. Take cover! n/t

[MineralMan]

3. Why? I'm praising the man, just like I always have.

He has done excellent work as a Senator, and contributes to measures put forward by Democratic Senators consistently. He's a good man and a fine Senator.

[left-of-center2012]

5. Pro-Sanders posts often get attacked

While I was a Sanders supporter in the primaries,
and a Clinton supporter in the fall,
many still blame Bernie for Hillary's loss,
and voice it here.

[MineralMan]

8. Well, I am not ashamed to post a positive thing about

Senator Sanders. So far, I've not seen anyone disagree with my praise of him in this thread. Perhaps someone will, but I doubt it.

[yardwork]

22. Bullshit. Point to one post "attacking" a pro-Sanders post.

What unmitigated whining.

[elleng]

25. Joking, right?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017430931

[yardwork]

42. That post proves my point.

Nobody is attacking any post in that thread. Disagreement with the OP is not an attack.

Unmitigated whining.

[elleng]

47. Disagreement is NOT whining.

Disagreement = lack of consensus or approval.

Whining = give or make a long, high-pitched complaining cry or sound/complain in a feeble or petulant way.

[yardwork]

72. Lol. You are the one equating disagreement with "attack."

That's the whining of which I speak.

[elleng]

73. I am not,

I provided dictionary definitions.

WHINING=

GOT IT YET?

[FailureToCommunicate]

29. Yeah, I was rolling my eyes over the above statement as well. That link is just the

most recent.

Look, I get that people are angry about how things turned out, but blaming Bernie supporters, especially here, is really to be misplacing that anger.

Let's all just get along okay?

[left-of-center2012]

31. "Let's all just get along okay?"

Yeah, the Bernie attacks are really old and tiring.

Time to move forward
and stop fighting the primaries.

[bekkilyn]

35. I came to the decision

to just go ahead and start putting some of the more prolific Bernie-bashers on ignore simply so I don't get tempted to get dragged into yet another unproductive argument with them. Helps save on stress levels and allows greater focus on more positive things. I want progressive policies in this country like single-payer, money corruption out of politics, women's health/choice, etc. and I really don't care who helps us get there as long as we get there.

[mac56]

36. I put the most obnoxious Bernie bashers on ignore during the primary,

and have never bothered to un-ignore them.

[FailureToCommunicate]

37. Yeah, it's not really something to raise blood pressure about, just kinda pointless now. Bernie

said "WE" in that interview, I believe, to acknowledge all the zillions of people who bothered to contact their representatives and engage on the legislation, to make their voices heard. That's always a good thing.

[beam me up scottie]

92. +1

[laserhaas]

30. And thats why...things grow dim

Cause being a true progressive ...is not welcome

Unless the mob rules

[Wounded Bear]

6. Yeah, well you didn't nominate him for pres in 2020...

I think the previous poster is expecting a rash of BoBs to attack you for that.

I agree, he's a fine progressive, and one that many Dems should emulate.

Me? I'm glad he's on our side, if not officially in our party. He does a lot of good work.

[MineralMan]

11. No. I was a Clinton supporter, as anyone who knows me

understands. Had Senator Sanders won in the primaries, though, I would have supported him enthusiastically, of course. He ran as a Democrat, and I support Democrats. But, Hillary Clinton got the nomination, and won the popular vote. I regret deeply that I was not able to help her win in those three crucial states.

[sharedvalues]

38. You included a sideways swipe about D party membership

[MineralMan]

58. I included no swipe of any kind. Senator Sanders

is proud of being an independent. He makes that very clear. I cannot fault him for that. He did become a Democrat to run for that party's nomination for President, but has reverted back to his independent status.

That he votes almost 100% of the time with the Democratic caucus in the Senate is something I praised, as well.

[MineralMan]

59. How strange. Really?

Well, apparently a jury found the post to be OK, so I'll not worry about that at all.

[Ken Burch]

81. There's an implication in the way you worded your OP, though

that the enthusiasm Sanders supporters feel towards Bernie is both unhealthy and in some way unfair to the rest of the party.

DO you actually believe that?

[MineralMan]

83. I said nothing of the sort, nor implied it.

Perhaps you perceived something for some reason I do not understand.

[WiffenPoof]

121. I have been attacked mercilessly...

...for my support of Sanders... Just suggesting that he represents the original tenets of the Democratic Party.

[Me.]

2. Speaking Of A Fine Senator...

I was unaware until yesterday that Sen, Franken holds a breakfast for his constituents in his office once a month. He sits and listens.

[MineralMan]

4. Senator Franken is, perhaps, the most approachable

person I have ever known who was in Congress. I have chatted with him on several occasions, and he always listens closely and is always ready to discuss his positions. I'm proud to have him as one of my two Senators. Amy Klobuchar, too, is a very nice person, who speaks clearly and openly about her positions, almost all of which I agree. I have met her only once, though.

[Wounded Bear]

10. In support of your OP...

Bernie is also famous for his town halls in his home state, and his constant contact with the people.

Excellent trait in a politician, TBS.

[MineralMan]

12. Yes. I'm sure that's why he keeps getting re-elected.

It is important for a Senator to be in touch with his constituents. That is a lesson all Senators who serve multiple terms understand. I know he is dearly loved by people who live in Vermont.

[Wounded Bear]

16. IIRC, Vermont was a bit of a red state pre-Bernie...

It's how a socialist can get elected in a red state, by talking directly to the people and being honest about what he intends to do and actually working to do it.

[Beartracks]

60. Responding to voters' concerns is what the GOP calls...

... "pandering."



==============

[Me.]

27. I Also Understand

He serves some type of cereal made from rice grown by Native Americans. Who knew... he certainly doesn't brag about this.

[murielm99]

52. Senator Durbin is also very approachable.

I have met him many times. He also has a variety of young people as aides, and they learn and grow as politicians and people who are willing to stay involved in government. They are young men and women both. His wife also conducts leadership programs for young women.

We have many fine Democratic leaders.

[MineralMan]

61. He is not alone in that. I think most Democratic Senators

are happy to communicate with their constituents. It's one of the hallmarks of the Democratic Party. Senators are very busy people, of course. I don't expect personal replies to my emails and letters to them. My conversations with Al Franken have come when he is here in the state and is at a DFL Party function here. A number of times, I've approached him and asked about some issue with him, and he has always listened and stated his opinion clearly in response.

He's always affable and open in such situations. I've talked with his wife and daughter, too, and have had some fairly lengthy conversations with them. Very nice people, all around.

[murielm99]

78. Franken spoke at our Governor's Day brunch

here in Illinois a few years ago. He was available for people afterwards. He is a wonderful speaker and leader.

[left-of-center2012]

9. I would love to see Franken run for POTUS 2020

But I think he's taken himself out.

How about a "Draft Al" campaign?

Imagine Franken in a debate against a nutty Republican?

[Me.]

28. Fine By Me

[MineralMan]

62. Well, he told me in person that he wasn't interested in 2016.

However, 2020 is another election. I haven't seen him to ask about that since the election.

[coco22]

7. And we want all congress persons..

and Senators to call for Nunes to step down NOW! and we want OPEN hearings! and Bernie is great!

[MineralMan]

14. Well, since Nunes is in the House of Representatives,

Senators don't have much to say about his chairmanship, really. Senator Sanders really needs to focus on the house of Congress in which he is a member, I think. That's plenty of hard work, right there.

[Tom Rinaldo]

13. Nicey stated.

Some may (and do) rank him higher or lower than some other Senators on our side - we all have people with whom we resonate the most with and there's no need for consensus on that. But yes, we do have a number of excellent Senators - Sanders being one of them.

I appreciate the sentiment you expressed here.

[MineralMan]

15. Thank you. There is no reason for anyone to bash Bernie Sanders.

He's a good man and a fine Senator.

[NurseJackie]

51. What a lovely post. And there's no reason for anyone to accuse party leadership of being "feeble"...

... or to suggest that the Democratic Party is "opportunistic" or "ideologically bankrupt". Surely you can agree that it's not unreasonable for loyal Democrats to be offended by these (and other) public smears.

It should come as no surprise to anyone that there would be resentment when such things are said about the Democratic Party. What I'm observing would be more accurately described as push-back (not baseless or mindless bashing). There's a cause-and-effect here in 2017 that's totally unrelated to last year's primary... these are things that are happening NOW in response to things that are happening NOW.

It's really not helpful for anyone to ignore the reality of what's happening in 2017 ... or to pretend that push-back is manifesting itself in a complete vacuum. It's also not helpful to pretend that Democrats who defend the honor of the party are guilty of some sort of unfair or unwarranted "bash" against the attacker.

I fully support those who respond to any attack that causes division and that weakens the party, no matter who the attacker may be. Those types of baseless attacks on our party are wrong. They're offensive and threatening no matter who's doing the attacking. Democrats and the Democratic Party do not deserve that.

Democrats and the Democratic Party are NOT "corrupt" and we're NOT incompetent, we're not lazy, and we're not standing by and doing nothing. We're not collaborators, we're not compliant, we're not "the same as" the GOP, we're not "on the take".

We wouldn't stand by quietly if Donald Trump were saying these things, would we?

The smears need to stop. The "best of intentions" excuse-making needs to stop. Amplifying and intensifying divisions and stoking flames by attacking the party... it all needs to stop. Attacking our party causes divisions, and divisions weaken our party. Why would anyone want to intentionally do things that demonstrably weaken our party?

LOL

[alarimer]

91. The problem is, there is a faction that brooks no criticism of the Democratic Party.

And that is even more dangerous. This is a party that has lost its way. It has lost 900+ seats in state legislatures over the last 10 years, has a minority of governorships, and is currently the minority party in Congress. Clearly the status quo has not been working.

[synergie]

103. I've yet to see this faction. What I've seen is a faction that brooks no criticism of

a certain Senator. Literally anything and everything is considered criticism if it's not pure adulation. THAT is dangerous.

The party has not lost its way, it's been badly maligned especially in the last cycle. We have a great deal of work to do to correct all that damage the chaos sowing outside forces have inflicted.

We have the majority of people in our party, but they won't come out to vote, they're being told that both sides are the same, and that this false equivalency means that they need to destroy everything or just not even bother to participate, and that's dangerous.

We need to stop the nonsense we've seen all over this site this weekend, where it's all about demonizing anyone who dares to not lionize a single man, and brooks no criticism of him, ever.

One man does not a party make, nor can he address the damage that has been inflicted. Enough with the flame wars and let's get back to where we were before the disruptive elements started this ridiculousness. On a thread that's literally saying Bernie is a good guy, and he's working with other good people, we see where the elements that seem to find fault with that, to divide us.

That manufactured rift, THAT is what's the most dangerous. The faction that seems to be engaging in some sort of mimicry of a religious level of fervor needs to be defanged. This is not what we're about. Criticism of everyone involved should be allowed, as long as it's constructive. Name calling and undermining of anyone on our side, be it the party or individuals is what our enemies want us to do.

It's why they're hyper reactive, and why they keep crossing that line. Let's be fair about what's actually being said here, what's not and what's being imagined and asserted. Repeating RW lies is not "criticism", attacking the party that is currently working together well with its citizenry is not "criticism". Let's recognize the problem, and root out that infection that leads to these ridiculous food fights.

Once again, I'll note that it got really nasty really fast, and that seems to be deliberate. Let's not let that dangerous faction that brooks no opposition to its religious fervor, (no matter how you choose to interpret that) take over and distract us from our purpose here.

We're here to fight Trump and a dangerously corrupt GOP, figure out what the heck went on during the last election cycle. We're doing that with our Democratic coalition, featuring members of the party and the two Independent senators who are working hard with them. The personality cult doesn't like that, it seeks to divide and attack, and we must not let it succeed again. We literally do not have the time for these games.

[FDRsGhost]

104. THIS.

Yes, completely agree. Some, instead of wanting to turn left, want to keep running the car into the brick wall in front of them.

[NWCorona]

17. I agree! The left needs to get back into the "big tent" mentality

We have a lot of work to do!

[50 Shades Of Blue]

18. K & R

[CousinIT]

19. Thank you.

Well stated.

[riderinthestorm]

20. Thank you for this MM nt

[Mr. Ected]

21. Bernie is an asset to the American people. For this he deserves kudos and respect.

Our party is enriched by his passion to defend the masses when so many in government on the right side of the aisle have outright abandoned us, threatened us, spit on us, deceived us, and sold us out.

The Democrats have a lot in common with Bernie. We need to celebrate our similarities and seek to harness Bernie's influence on millions of Americans. To concentrate on our differences is to divide us at a time when we need all the consensus we can muster.

[NurseJackie]

54. The Democratic Party and its leaders deserve respect as well.

[Mr. Ected]

71. They have mine!

[NurseJackie]

74. Yeah! I'm a proud and loyal Democrat, too! :-D

[Mr. Ected]

75. I have a lot of faith in Perez and Ellison to lead the charge into 2018

I also believe the entire Democratic base has been energized by the foul stench of so-called Republican leadership.

There's never been a more important time for Democrats to unite.

[NurseJackie]

79. They're a great team! I like them both.

[Omaha Steve]

116. Glad to hear you are on board with Bernie as a new leader of the D party

[elleng]

23. Thanks.

[bekkilyn]

24. Finally some reason (nt)

[mcar]

26. He is one of many

I applaud them all.

[Trumpocalypse]

32. Yes he is a fine Senator

And spokesperson from liberal causes.

I just wish he would stop attacking the Democratic party.

[liberalnarb]

63. He usually raises really good points.

The Democratic Party is by far the better Party and I do consider myself a proud Democrat, but we need to get back to being a Progressive Party of The People we want to win again. Sanders is right.

[Trumpocalypse]

93. Sanders isn't a Democrat

If he wants to change the party he should join it instead of snipping from the sidelines.

[Omaha Steve]

95. I wonder why he was chosen to help lead the D party by Senator Schumer?

Out of the desert into the promised land.

Feel free to stop my the Labor Group anytime: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1117

OS

[Trumpocalypse]

99. He wasn't

Please don't indulge in fake news.

[Omaha Steve]

100. Link?

So who did chose him to be a party leader?

OS

[Trumpocalypse]

101. He's not

He's not a member of the party.

[Omaha Steve]

109. This is going to leave a mark

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/chuck-schumer-is-all-in-on-bernie-sanders-democratic-party_us_58307a38e4b030997bbfc3cc

The Vermont senator lost to Hillary Clinton, but the new Senate minority leader thinks his message is a winner.

By Michael McAuliff

Schumer will be the person who crafts and leads the strategy, but in sitting down to explain it to The Huffington Post on Friday, he revealed how much of it comes from Sanders, as well as Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.).

Snip: Schumer explained that includes staples from the Sanders and Warren wing of the party ― debt-free college, at least some of the free college that was so mocked by the Clinton campaign, a higher minimum wage, a “bolder” stance on trade, a tougher stance on the “rigged” system of lobbyists and special interests, and major investments in infrastructure, among other ideas.


“There’s this debate ― do we appeal to the Obama constituency or the blue collar constituency? A bold, strong, progressive economic message that focuses on the rigged system and what we’re going to do when we change it, will appeal to both groups,” Schumer said.


Regardless of progressive distrust of Schumer, he has long made it his mantra to focus on the needs of the middle class. And for him, the successes of both Sanders and Trump with disaffected white voters tells him he needs to address them more clearly. And the fact that the economic messages of Sanders and Warren from the left resonated better with them than the cautious pronouncements of Clinton tells him the progressive message is actually the one that speaks to the broader audience.

[Trumpocalypse]

112. Doesn't make him a member of the party.

So he should join or shut up.

[Omaha Steve]

115. He is still a leader of the D party

Good enough for 13 million and Sen. Charles Schumer is good enough for me. As a chosen leader you should be listening to him.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/politics/trailguide/la-na-trailguide-updates-hold-democrats-elect-sen-charles-1479309559-htmlstory.html

NOV. 16, 2016, 8:19 A.M.

Sen. Charles Schumer elected minority leader; Bernie Sanders and others get leadership posts

Sen. Charles E. Schumer of New York was elected by Democrats as minority leader of the Senate on Wednesday, and he quickly added new leadership posts for members representing the party's left and right flanks following this month's stinging election losses.

Schumer will take over for the retiring Sen. Harry Reid of Nevada, who tapped his former lieutenant for the top spot. Sen. Richard Durbin of Illinois and Sen. Patty Murray of Washington kept top spots.

But Schumer also broadened the Democratic leadership tent with the intent of improving the party's standing with both its progressive wing and its working-class base, two groups whose frustration with the party and Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton helped lead to President-elect Donald Trump's victory.

Joining the leadership team are Sen. Bernie Sanders of Vermont, who challenged Clinton for the presidential nomination, conservative Sen. Joe Manchin of West Virginia and Sen. Tammy Baldwin of Wisconsin.

[Trumpocalypse]

120. Still not a member of the party

He gets a courtesy position, doesn't make he a leader of a party he's not a member of.

[Omaha Steve]

128. .

[liberalnarb]

96. He's still an independent because that's what his constituency elected him as.

[Trumpocalypse]

98. That's an excuse.

And a lame one.

[Omaha Steve]

110. Yet he got over 40% of the D vote for president in the primary season

Won almost 1/2 of the states. Had the endorsement of over 2 million union members.

On the Democratic underground he had 2,108 donations for a total of $77,149.00!

[Trumpocalypse]

111. Still not a member of the Democratic party.

[Omaha Steve]

114. Apparently you don't want this action passed because of an I

[Trumpocalypse]

119. Doesn't change the fact he refuses to join the party.

[Omaha Steve]

127. Doesn't matter

[Trumpocalypse]

132. Yes it does

It shows where his true loyalties lie.

[Omaha Steve]

134. So IF he won the D nomination you would have stayed home?

[Trumpocalypse]

135. Of course not

I even voted for him in the primary.

But now he needs to either join the party or stop attacking it.

[Omaha Steve]

138. Thank you for an honest answer

[FDRsGhost]

105. Bernie then would go against his constituents in VT by switching parties

Remember, they elected him not as a Dem but as an indy. This would go against the very people he represents. I don't care what he is, he's on our side and that's good enough for me!

[Trumpocalypse]

106. That's fine

But then he should shut about a party that he is not a member of.

[FDRsGhost]

108. I disagree.

His voice is just as legit as anybody's else's.

[Trumpocalypse]

113. So it is OK that he joins Republicans

in attacking the Democratic party.

[FDRsGhost]

117. As was stated several times

what you see as an attack, I see as legit criticism. Was it an attack when Schumer voiced his displeasure on Twitter over the Obama administrations handling of Israel?

I don't get this whole "the party should never be criticized" thing, especially when criticism is warranted. Of course, since it's Bernie doing this, it's ok to be upset or something something.

[Trumpocalypse]

118. It is an attack whether you admit it or not.

It is made worse by the fact that he is not a member of the party.

And yes it was an attack by Schumer. He lost my vote forever for that.

[FDRsGhost]

122. It was justified criticism

And it was done by someone in a leadership roll of the party.
I'm sorry you're upset and obviously have a grudge about Bernie but it's time to move on. He is fighting for us and currently leading the battle.

My point is, stuff like this happens all the time but because it's from Bernie, people hyperfocus.

Take care.

[Trumpocalypse]

123. It is not a grudge

But he's not a member of the party so I don't like him publically attacking it the same way I don't like any non-Democrat like Paul Ryan or Sean Hannity or Jill Stein publically attacking it.

He is not in the party's leadership because he is not a member.

If he wants to change the party, he should join it and work to change it from the inside.

Publically attacking it only helps the GOP.

[FDRsGhost]

124. It doesn't matter if he's a member of the party, he has a roll in it

and that honesty is one of the reason why he is the most popular politician and people trust him. That is an ASSET to the party and THAT is how you bring people in to the party; hence his position of the head of outreach.

Uhhhh Bernie IS in leadership. Has been since after the election. Where ya been?

Sanders named to Senate leadership post
http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/senate/306336-sanders-named-to-senate-leadership-post

Senate Democrats tap Bernie Sanders to lead outreach
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2016/11/16/senate-democrats-tap-bernie-sanders-lead-outreach/93960822/

Bernie Sanders Tapped For Role In Senate Democratic Leadership
http://jewishweek.timesofisrael.com/bernie-sanders-tapped-for-role-in-senate-democratic-leadership/

Sanders joins Democratic leadership, isn't officially a Democrat
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/independent-bernie-sanders-democratic-leadership-231486

BERNIE SANDERS, ELIZABETH WARREN TAPPED FOR SENATE DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP TEAM
http://www.newsweek.com/bernie-sanders-elizabeth-warren-senate-leadership-521936


Do you understand that if Bernie was to switch being a Democrat he would go against the very people in Vermont who elected him as an indy?

Publicly attacking? It's valid criticism as I keep saying and you need to stop because right now YOU are helping the GOP by trashing Bernie, the most popular politician in America at a time when Republicans are getting closer to being able to hold a constitutional convention, at a time when Democrats only hold 26% of the electorate, at a time when Democrats have been killed at the state level by losing over 1,000 seats. Bernie is right in what he says and we CAN NOT afford to keep doing the same thing or our party dies and goes of the Whigs. Do you want that to happen? I sure as hell don't!

[Trumpocalypse]

125. He promised that he would join the party

then broke that promise. Nor did he ever release his tax returns, just like Trump.

They gave him a courtesy position with no real power, probably hoping to shut him up. But as long as he runs to cable news to attack the party, he is doing more harm than good.

That puts him in the same company as Rush, Mitch McConnell and all other non-Democrats that attack the party publically.

[FDRsGhost]

129. Can you link to where Bernie promised to join the party?

I've not seen that.

Bernie's position is a very powerful one and Dem leadership knows this. Think about it, nobody has done what he has done before with fundraising. This is incredibly valuable to the party and leadsership also knows that Bernie's message resonates across the board, especially with young voters who are the future of America and the future of our party itself.

Bernie is doing more harm than good? Completely disagree. He brought more young voters into the political process (see primaries( ever in the history of elections. He packed stadiums of 10s of thousands of people, he's out there holding town halls opposite of the likes of Ted Cruz fighting about health care in this country and he walked into the Lions Den in WV to talk to former Obama voters who voted for Trump to find out what the hell happened.

If that's bad, I don't ever want to be good ever again.

Equating Bernie to the likes of Rush Limbaugh isn't just wrong, it's downright idiotic. If you honestly believe that then you don't know Bernie which is rather obvious considering you weren't even aware he was in a leadership roll to begin with.

Have a nice day.

[Trumpocalypse]

131. Then you are not paying attention

http://www.politico.com/blogs/2016-dem-primary-live-updates-and-results/2016/04/bernie-sanders-democrat-independent-222228

Since neither Sanders or Limbaugh aren't Democrats yet both attack it publically, they are the same even if you refuse to admit it.

The Outreach Committee is not a powerful position. That is idiotic to say do.

And didn't encourage his supporters to join the Democratic party, he did not good for it.

You accused me earlier of having a 'party must not be criticized' mentality. Yet I have no problem with that if it comes from a Democrat.

However you have the mentality that Saint Bernie can't be criticized even when he is publically attacking the Democratic party which only helps the GOP.

[FDRsGhost]

136. lol says you who didn't know Bernie was in a leadership position

Why are you hating on Bernie so much? Seriously, what is up with that? You've been doing it long before I ever joined the site too it seems. So why are you so upset with the guy? He's out there fighting like mad right now. The primaries are long over. I don't get it at all.

"Sanders' campaign says he'll stay a Democrat after election". He is technically a member of the party although some are stuck on the whole (I) label. He caucuses with Dems, he votes with Dems constantly and he's in a leadership role. He campaiged and supported Hillary after she won the primaries. So what more do you want him to do really? Is changing that (I) to a (D) that important to you? Why? Even if he did I'm sure that probably wouldn't change the fact you can't stand the guy. If it walks like a Democrat, acts like a Democrat and does Democratic things, it's a Democrat, right?

Now you've changed your argument of "Bernie isn't in leadership" to "It's not an important roll" lol. The Outreach Committee is more important than you realize. Bernie is in charge with bringing in new blood to the party. How much more important can you get as it relates to the party? That's the entire future of our party itself. This is a good thing.

Bernie told people to vote for Hillary. Yes or no? Yes he did. How often do you hear any Democrat say "come join our party"? yet Bernie is out there center stage taking on Republican big shots face to face and holding rally's with Schumer and Warren over Trump's cuts.

Ahhh, now come the ad hominem personal attacks on me. That doesn't strengthen your position at all. In fact it actually weakens it. Again, what part of "what you see as an attack, I consider legit criticism" do you not understand? We can't continue down the same path which has caused us massive losses. That's reality. I'm sorry if you dislike that but you've obviously an axe to grind against Bernie. Whatever it is, who knows, meanwhile he'll keep fighting while you keep on hating.

I'll take the guy who walks into the Lion's den. Thanks.

[Trumpocalypse]

137. It's a courtesy appointment, not a leadership position.

And it is not hating to point out that his attack on the party only aid the GOP.

The outreach committee has no real power. It is mainly for optics than anything else.

So if my "ad hominem personal attacks" as you call it don't strengthen my position, why are your "ad hominem personal attacks" OK? I think I'm detecting some hypocrisy here.

[JTFrog]

126. Our party isn't even close to dying.

We have 10,000 Democratic women who just signed up to run for office. We've had massive turnouts in the streets. We have a kick ass team leading the DNC. We have Democrats in red states pulling in record donations.

By the way, we won the election last year. Not because of Bernie. In fact quite the opposite. The spoiler who wanted to primary Obama and who said that Clinton wasn't qualified to be president only helped give cover to the bullshit Russian interference. We won the popular vote by a landslide despite the BoBers and the divisiveness.

I have no doubt that senate and house seats were interfered with as well as the general election. I am sick to death of this ridiculous crap that the Democratic party is somehow corrupt or dying.

We didn't have the wrong message. Our party is not corrupt. That's bullshit propaganda that doesn't belong here.

[FDRsGhost]

130. Did I say it was corrupt?

No I did not. Did I say that we've lost over 1,000 seats? Yes. That isn't propaganda, it's a fact.

Look at this; this is a map of states which we hold as solid blue states; meaning we have a Dem gov and at least 1 state level house or senate.



You're sick of the message well I'm sick of us getting our asses handed to us. Over the last 9 years this happened;

1,000+ state legislature seats lost.
12 Governors lost.
69 House seats lost.
13 Senate seats lost.

The Non-Voters Who Decided The Election: Trump Won Because Of Lower Democratic Turnout
https://www.forbes.com/sites/omribenshahar/2016/11/17/the-non-voters-who-decided-the-election-trump-won-because-of-lower-democratic-turnout/#7acbf7b053ab

What does voter turnout tell us about the 2016 election?
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/voter-turnout-2016-elections/

Voter Turnout Fell, Especially In States That Clinton Won
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/voter-turnout-fell-especially-in-states-that-clinton-won/

Now the question is HOW we we get people engaged. You're assertion is indeed correct that we are on the correct path with people taking to the streets but that is half the battle. We NEED to fight on what we believe in and what we stand for too, simply being the party of anti-Trump isn't going to win us elections and that's why things like Bernie's "Medicate For All" bill is important.Actions speak louder than words and we are just now getting started at not only opposing Trump but taking to the town halls and telling people what we stand for as Democrats. THAT is a GOOD thing! That is how you bring people in to the party.

[Trumpocalypse]

133. Well said!!! nt

[Doremus]

33. Agreed and thank you. nt

[ananda]

34. Minnesota senators are great!

Al Franken has been outstanding with regard to GorSUCKS.

[aikoaiko]

39. I think you're wrong about all DU members agreeing with your assessment of Sanders.

There are many vocal DU members who hate him and vomit, mostly figuratively, but I think literally in some cases, whenever he is praised at DU.

[sharedvalues]

40. Why the swipe about his party membership in first sentence?

And why end talking about his party membership?

Despite your stated goal it certainly seems that your words partially criticize Bernie. Take that stuff out of here.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

45. Because if he keeps criticizing the party and wanting to change it

He should join and contribute to building resources and leadership within the party

[Tom Rinaldo]

48. I see no swipe. It's true and framed in a positive manner

It's a distraction to look for divisive intent in a unifying thread. Just my opinion, as someone who has consistently supported Sanders.

[bekkilyn]

50. I'm a Bernie supporter and didn't interpret it as a swipe

In most of the actual Bernie-bashing posts, there are always people using the "Bernie isn't a Democrat" excuse whenever they want to discount anything positive that people say about Bernie. So when MineralMan said positive things about Bernie's efforts, despite Bernie not being a member of the party, it sounded to me like MM was speaking *against* the "Bernie's not a Democrat, so he should just go away and fall into a deep pit." mentality that some people vocally espouse here.

I may have misinterpreted, but his entire post seemed in good faith, so I'm fine with giving him the benefit of the doubt on this one.

[cwydro]

55. That's hardly a "side-swipe"

It's a fact.

You seem a bit sensitive.

[MineralMan]

64. There was no swipe at him.

He is proud to be an independent Senator. It is his choice to maintain that status.

I believe you are reading something into my post that was not in any way intended.

[tammywammy]

41. You're lucky to have two such fine Senators.

I'm not so lucky in Texas.

[MineralMan]

66. I have worked hard to help keep both of them in office.

If I lived in Texas, I'd be frustrated, I'm very sure.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

43. Younger senators who will run in 2020 need some light

And when all the focus is on Bernie and his very very safe seat, they don't get any.

[secondwind]

44. Let's hear it for Bernie, he's done a splendid job n/t

[mvd]

46. I understand what you mean

Sanders is my favorite Senator, and he shares concerns about he Party that I do. His being blunt both changed the platform and helped wake us up a bit. We are doing a good job resisting Trump. But just becuase others aren't as to the left doesn't mean we don't have other good people in the Party. They should all be recognized when they fight for us.

[DownriverDem]

53. Yes, but

Bernie joined the Democratic Party to run in the primaries. He did create a lot of excitement. I agree with many of his ideas. However when he lost he quit the Dem Party. I felt insulted by that. Then he tried to have it both ways and encouraged his supporters to vote for Hillary. Many didn't listen to him. They voted 3rd party, principle/purity or not at all. And now we have a president who could possibily be charged with treason.

The point I am trying to make is, the repubs were who we needed to beat. The lesson is that we must unite to beat the repubs. Bernie will play big part, but I sure wish he were a Dem.

[bekkilyn]

56. I don't believe he changed back to I as an insult

The people of Vermont elected him as an I candidate, so it would be a bit unfair to them to remain a D once he no longer had need to do so after the election. Maybe he'll switch to running as a D in 2018 for his senate seat, but I also think that maybe it would be best to not do it if he continues outreach into deep red states. Many in those states have extremely irrational views about Democrats from all the right-wing propaganda, so Bernie going into those areas as an I and introducing Democratic policies to "break them in more gently" so to speak may work more to our advantage. I can see positives both ways though, but have no idea what Bernie's actually planning.

But I do think he kind of had to go back to I at least until 2018 and didn't intend it as a slight. Many of his supporters who registered as Democrats are still in the party too, so he did bring a bunch of new people in who decided to stay and work for Democratic goals.

[NurseJackie]

67. "Outreach" does not mean smearing Democratic Party leaders by calling them "feeble". (LOL)

Oh my god! Can you imagine the outrage if Trump or Ryan or Spicer or Conway were to smear Democrats and the Democratic Party that way?

I doubt anyone would be trying to excuse that behavior by saying they mean well, and they're just trying to help, or that we should appreciate what "straight-shooters" they are, and "give them credit for being so honest".

Nobody would say that. Nobody.

LOL

By the bye, he's already filed as an Independent. He will not be running as a Democrat. Any indications otherwise given was purely for strategic reasons. I'd recommend that you stop spreading the rumor, or holding out any false hope that he is. I never believed he'd actually file to run for Senate as a Democrat in his home state, and it turns out that was correct.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_election_in_Vermont,_2018

[Omaha Steve]

89. Oh my god! There you go questioning D leadership again

Just because you don't like the method to win in 2020 laid out by US Senator Schumer means your opinion is the only view.

There is a Warren-Sanders wing of the party. Without it and the I's D's lose. Who reached more I's and young first time voters in 2016?

Video below.

Wikipedia is not a credible source BTW.

However, citation of Wikipedia in research papers may be considered unacceptable, because Wikipedia is not considered a credible or authoritative source. This is especially true considering anyone can edit the information given at any time, and although most errors are immediately fixed, some errors maintain unnoticed.
Wikipedia:Academic use - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Academic_use

[FDRsGhost]

107. Why is this only a Bernie thing?

Where is the outrage over things like this?

House Democrats Furious with President Barack Obama Over Lack of Support for Reelection Campaigns
http://abcnews.go.com/WN/house-democrats-furious-president-barack-obama-lack-support/story?id=11174124

Or when Schumer took to twitter to criticize Obama publicly?

Link to tweet

Or when Mark Warner took to facebook to voice his pleasure?



Was it bad when House Democrats voiced their concern and outrage over how Obama wasn't supporting or doing enough with re-election campaigns?
http://abcnews.go.com/WN/house-democrats-furious-president-barack-obama-lack-support/story?id=11174124

Was it bad when Perez said "Dems Haven’t ‘Been There’ for Voters, But Will Unite to Oppose Trump"
http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/new-dnc-chair-perez-trump-s-greatest-nightmare-united-democratic-n725746

Seriously, what is with the Bernie hate on here? As I said yesterday, I'm new and honestly this is a huge turn off for the site and people like myself who just joined here. It seems some just want to hate on Bernie because they can and take every change and opportunity to put the guy down and I simply don't get it, at all.

As far as Bernie being an indy, and? Most of America is indy at almost 50% of the electorate, Bernie is on our side and he is an asset to our party. You can win elections on JUST registered Democrats, you need a big tent and Bernie is part of that plan hence outreach. This is important and is also vital. Also, if Bernie was to switch to Democrat you do realize he would be going against his constituents in VT who elected him as an indy, correct? The very people he represents.

[democrank]

57. Vermont has open primaries. We don't have to register party affiliation.

[George II]

69. His senior Senator, Pat Leahy, and Vermont's Representative are Democrats.

[democrank]

70. Yes indeed, George II.

We also have a Republican Governor, a Progressive Lt. Governor, and an Independent Senator. Still, Vermonters don't have to declare a political affiliation.

[defacto7]

68. K&R

Thanks MineralMan for speaking a positive message about a great senator.

[still_one]

76. No one on DU should have an issue with your OP MM

[Ken Burch]

80. Please consider self-deleting this...it serves no good purpose.

Look, I like you, Mineral Man, and I've always respected you.

But it looks like you started this just to provoke some Sanders supporters in to an intemperate response.

Some people supported Bernie's campaign...some still stand with him on what he joins them in fighting for.

And those people know that there's a lot of other people in politics who do good things and have strong principles.

It's just hard to see how your OP helps the cause of unity.

[MineralMan]

84. No, I won't do that.

Sorry.

[Ken Burch]

90. What is the point of the OP, then?

Do you honestly think that Sanders people NEED to be reminded that there are other progressives around?

It's a movement...not a cult.

[MineralMan]

94. Why do you ask?

In the first place, my post was not written just for "Sanders people." In the second place, it was written to point out that Bernie Sanders has done a very good job in the Senate and has voted almost 100% of the time with the Democrats in the Senate. Finally, I wrote it to point out that there are many very good Senators who represent their states ideally in the Senate, and we should be aware of some of them we may not know very well.

I'm sorry that you somehow misread my intent.

[Ken Burch]

97. Ok.

n/t.

[SidDithers]

82. DU rec...nt

Sid

[StrictlyRockers]

85. We are stronger together.

I think now is the time for unity among liberal progressives. Now is not the time for re-living old battles.

[NastyRiffraff]

86. I have to disagree with you, MM

I enjoy your posts; you are thoughtful and intelligent. But It's simply not true that "we" like Sanders. I don't. and many here don't. That's not an "attack" (note to potential alerters) but simply how I feel. There are a lot of reasons, but to avoid the inevitable alert, I'll just say I think he's a grandstander and a blowhard.

[MineralMan]

87. Well, everyone is entitled to their opinion.

I don't share yours. Many of our Senators have unique personalities. That's not surprising really. I measure Senators by their votes, though.

Bernie Sanders votes with the Democratscalmost 100% of the time. He is on our side.

[Talk Is Cheap]

88. Maybe people here should realize that....

DUers can write about anything they want, to support anybody they want, provided that it doesn't
break the forum rules.

If I don't care about a particular thread or topic, I simply do not respond to it.

People here need to grow up and not demonize people for their beliefs and what they write (again
following rules).

Seriously, if you don;t like Sanders, please, please, just do not post on the thread. Or write a thread
that *you* want to talk about instead.

Sanders is an ally. He is doing good work for Democrats and their policies. And, if you think
he is 'criticizing Dems', maybe it is 'constructive criticism'.

[whistler162]

102. Nope!!

He is a Vermont Senator, one of two doncha know!

Yes, he is a very good Senator.