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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsTeacher Cant Stop Smiling After Being Accused Of Having Sexual Relations With Teen
Fowlkes taught anatomy and physiology at the school, according to her school district, which announced her suspension in a statement on Monday. The school had employed her since 2014, it added.
The decision to suspend her followed school administrators on Friday receiving a report about allegations of her having relations with the teen in person and via electronic messages. Local authorities, including Child Protective Services, were promptly contacted, the district said.
Smile if you're a pedophile
RoadhogRidesAgain
(165 posts)That poor poor kid
oberliner
(58,724 posts)Hard to tell on here sometimes.
Calculating
(2,955 posts)Pedophiles are attracted to prepubescent children. A 17 year old male is hardly a little boy. Inappropriate relationship between teacher and student? Sure. Pedophile/child molester? Not really. Should she be fired from the teaching profession? Definitely.
Kentonio
(4,377 posts)HoneyBadger
(2,297 posts)FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)Texas Penal Code § 21.12. Improper Relationship Between Educator and Student
http://codes.findlaw.com/tx/penal-code/penal-sect-21-12.html
If someone punches someone is that assault or is it murder?
Some people sure like to ratchet things up!
BeyondGeography
(39,374 posts)You never know, do you?
IronLionZion
(45,457 posts)She certainly doesn't seem to feel guilty
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)It makes the jury feel you are not guilty. Seriously it works which is why many photographers always say don't smile when getting a mug shot. This woman was brilliant. She will walk.
littlemissmartypants
(22,694 posts)Fact: semblance of smile, possible deception signal.
IronLionZion
(45,457 posts)Back when we thought Republican criminals could go to jail
JTFrog
(14,274 posts)TheBlackAdder
(28,209 posts).
Still, I would be both pissed and scared being falsely charged.
Because, you never know how things will turn out, the damage to the name, and the costs incurred.
.
anneboleyn
(5,611 posts)FSogol
(45,488 posts)First one is clearly a mugshot. You can see the wall ruler for measuring height in the background that's in all mugshots.
FSogol
(45,488 posts)BannonsLiver
(16,396 posts)How novel. And appropriate.
BeyondGeography
(39,374 posts)BannonsLiver
(16,396 posts)It's the approach of reasonable, thoughtful people everywhere.
IronLionZion
(45,457 posts)IronLionZion
(45,457 posts)regardless of the ages, any adult teacher should know this is wrong
The audacity of these people. So smug
Jonny Appleseed
(960 posts)I think it's safe to assume this doesn't go to trial. Double standard sure, but that's life.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,202 posts)She gives up her teaching license and they drop the charges.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)Tolerating a double-standard is merely enabling that same double-standard. But no worries... a lazy mind values bias more than rational thought.
That's life, as well.
Jonny Appleseed
(960 posts)In this case there are TWO (duo) mainstream heteronormative genders and the basic behavioral and sexual characteristics existing on the bell curve for them. There are biological differences in most cases and, by definition, psychological as well.
You can continue to see the world in a way where everybody is a gelatinous gray blob, but I'll live in reality.
MosheFeingold
(3,051 posts)And, yes, it makes a difference that she's very pretty. She's presumably pretty bright if she was a science teacher, too.
So she clearly would have had men chasing her. It's not like her options were limited.
I suppose it's about her having control in the relationship. Or perhaps the thrill of the forbidden.
The boy's motivations are obvious, even to an old man who only vaguely remembers.
IronLionZion
(45,457 posts)and apparently the smug impunity of believing she will get away with something she knows is wrong
Iggo
(47,558 posts)Of course that's assuming she did it (which I admittedly shouldn't assume).
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)What makes this a criminal situation is that it IS illegal for a teacher to have sex with students.
However, there are innumerable 26 year olds having sex with 17 year olds in Texas, who are neither "sick individuals" nor criminals.
Iggo
(47,558 posts)jberryhill
(62,444 posts)...and that's up to the legislatures of the states to decide.
Whether someone is mentally ill is a question for the mental health profession.
Whether someone has violated the law is a question for legal profession.
But I sincerely doubt that a 26 year old who is lawfully engaged in a relationship with a 16 year old in Pennsylvania (yes 16), becomes a "sick fuck" if they wander into Delaware and do the same thing.
Someone with so little sense of responsibility to do what this teacher is alleged to have done certainly seems to have a problem of some kind, because one would expect a teacher to exercise sufficient ethical judgment even if they were unaware of the law on the subject of sexual exploitation based on a position of authority, but the "pedophile" tag seems to be applied with such joyous abandon here at DU, and it is helpful to know the context before wandering into pizza parlors with guns.
Iggo
(47,558 posts)I agree.
They're a sick fuck to start with.
Calculating
(2,955 posts)An attractive lady like her would have had no problem getting guys who were 18+ and not her students.
Jonny Appleseed
(960 posts)People are saying "power and control", but honestly, how much power/control does a cute female teacher have over a 17 year-old boy? I know that when I was that age my teachers had less psychological control over me than I had over them.
IronLionZion
(45,457 posts)knowing that she can do things that would land others in prison, and get away with it
Just because a 17 year old boy is willing, doesn't mean he isn't being taken advantage of. An adult teacher should know better and be held responsible
Jonny Appleseed
(960 posts)Maybe a reason that she decided to follow thru on it. But that same philosophy doesn't prevent ugly male teachers from doing the same even though they know they won't get off easy if caught.
IronLionZion
(45,457 posts)One possible reason is there are more opportunities available and more copycats feel inspired when they hear about it
http://www.businessinsider.com/why-teachers-have-sex-with-their-students-2012-2
A google search doesn't yield much social science research on this topic unfortunately. But it would be something worth studying.
womanofthehills
(8,718 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)It would be understandable if a woman you don't consider "very pretty" did the same thing?
Goblinmonger
(22,340 posts)"I mean, hey, if she was ugly, I'd get her jumping on any penis offered, but this one's cute."
MosheFeingold
(3,051 posts)And my post didn't say anything about that.
But, yes, a pretty (and apparently smart and educated) person has more dating options than an ugly person.
That may not be fair or whatever, but it's reality, for both men and women.
In my long life, I've seen many an ugly person of both sexes make piss-poor decisions when given attention by a more attractive person -- or really anyone who shows them attention, for that matter. That's a statement about how society values physical attractiveness and unfairly treats less attractive people.* It's a fact, not a judgment.
So, while it is not understandable or excusable for an ugly person to make a stupid decision like this, this teacher's physical beauty eliminates a common variable for bad choices, yes.
* And regarding the beauty double-standard, go look at the sentences imposed on attractive women for this crime vs. the sentences imposed on less attractive women for the exact same thing. They're actually been enough events that there was a study. Pretty people got parole (at least at first) or some sort of slap on the wrist. Ugly ones get the slammer.
Bradical79
(4,490 posts)The teacher student fantasy is very prevalent, but most people keep it in the realm of fantasy.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Laffy Kat
(16,383 posts)That is very creepy.
Skittles
(153,169 posts)something is very wrong with these women
their lack of judgement makes them unfit to be teachers and yes, they need to be charged
Calculating
(2,955 posts)Looks like she loves attention and to flaunt herself. I have little doubt that she did this because she felt entitled to forbidden pleasure, and now that she got caught she thinks the best strategy is to just smile and laugh about it. Affluenza in a nutshell.
JCanete
(5,272 posts)getting into some really ugly terrain. That's how people discredit witnesses and victims too. I don't think we should engage in it just because in this case, the person is herself accused of something we find predatory. That shouldn't all of a sudden, make that kind of value judgement about a person because of how she dresses at a party, okay.
littlemissmartypants
(22,694 posts)Agschmid
(28,749 posts)Kinda feels a bit sexist if you ask me.
Orrex
(63,216 posts)JCanete
(5,272 posts)kinesthetic learners.
Joking of course, but yeah, as others have said...first, this would be an abuse of her age and position and is certainly a power imbalance...not pedophilia. Second, your tag is inappropriate and dangerous for another reason, other than bandying out the wrong label, since at this point you don't know if she is actually guilty of the crime she's been accused of. I don't think we should be so quick to try people in the court of public opinion without even having the evidence.
True Dough
(17,306 posts)That said, I did laugh.
Angry Dragon
(36,693 posts)I thought one was innocent until the facts proved otherwise??
Don't follow the republican path
eniwetok
(1,629 posts)We are free to think anyone is guilty of something even without hard proof. For example I don't need to see a strategy memo to know the GOP is guilty of a traitorous starve the beast strategy... the deliberate sabotage of the fiscal health of the nation for political purposes.
Angry Dragon
(36,693 posts)eniwetok
(1,629 posts)We don't have access to secret GOP memos... through there are a few incriminating quotes. We KNOW STB is true because it explains GOP fiscally irresponsible actions...
Angry Dragon
(36,693 posts)StevieM
(10,500 posts)offenses right out in the open.
Angry Dragon
(36,693 posts)Beartracks
(12,816 posts)VOX
(22,976 posts)marybourg
(12,633 posts)called on to sit in judgment at a trial.
phleshdef
(11,936 posts)As far as I understand the age of consent in Texas is 17 years old
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)It is illegal for a teacher to have sex with a student.
It is not illegal in Texas, for a 26 year old and a 17 year old to have sex.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)How ironic. And pathetic.
Locut0s
(6,154 posts)Don't get me wrong it's clearly wrong as it's abuse of power in her position. But 17 is clearly not pedophile territory. Pedophilia is sexual attraction to prepubescents. 17 is basically an adult. As others have said in Texas, and many other states, their relationship would be legal if not for her job. I'm not arguing what she did was right, obviously it's was terrible judgement on her part, abuse of power. But pedophilia it is definitely not.
anneboleyn
(5,611 posts)would people be posting about how the student was LUCKY and it wasn't *really* a problem and a 17 year girl isn't a child...are we now in Milo territory? Yes, I know what the TECHNICAL definitions mean. As an educator myself I find anything like this to be a gross abuse of power, and in a case like this I suspect mental illness is involved. I see posts joking about how he was lucky and saying a "17 year old boy isn't a child." Yes, I know the TECHICAL DEFINITION. Don't cite the OED or Greek roots for me. But this is ridiculous, and laughing it off because the teacher is female and attractive (I guess -- if she looked very different or if she wasn't a blonde white woman would people be posting that the student was LUCKY?) is really not appropriate.
IronLionZion
(45,457 posts)and I do see a significant gender disparity. It's heartening to see women and teachers agree this behavior is wrong. Others seem to be having their own fantasies.
No one can know what is going on in the student's mind or how it will affect his life and psychological state going forward.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)Is because the male-female relationship is so often couched in terms of male aggressive behavior. Our culture encourages males to be sexually aggressive and even predatory. So many people assume the male was actively pursuing the relationship, and enjoyed it.
That perception could be wrong, but many young men buy into the cultural tropes and it could be the young man DID pursue and enjoy it. But the woman still has the responsibility to avoid such entanglements.
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)No 17-year-old boy would feel victimized from sleeping with her.
Just none.
I know that if you flip it to the other side and the 17-year-old was a woman we'd pretty much all feel differently.
But that doesn't really matter.
The 17-year-old boy wouldn't feel like a victim.
And it's pretty damned presumptuous to tell him that he is one and just doesn't know it.
Horse with no Name
(33,956 posts)However, despite the age, using your position of power over a subordinate to seduce them into a sexual relationship is wrong--no matter what the optics. The players almost always have different motives for succumbing to the relationship and neither are valid and can potentially harm future relationships. What lasting relationship can ever top the "Hot Teacher" forbidden fruit sex?
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)I'm certainly not claiming that it's legal
But the truth deserves better treatment than the people calling this pedophilia and rape are giving it.
NYC Liberal
(20,136 posts)It's also pretty damn presumptuous to say that "NO" boy would feel victimized or have any issues.
The article, by the way, says that she was arrested based on statements given to the police by him.
Locut0s
(6,154 posts)Maybe I missed those posts, quite possibly. Only speaking for myself I know I never said he was lucky, nor that why was done was not wrong. Quite the opposite. Most of the arguments I saw though were that calling this pedophilia is not right. What's wrong is the power dynamic involved between the teacher and student. His young age does serve to magnify the gravity of the crime but that's about it. And yes I would make the same argument if the genders were reversed. Noting again that I'm not arguing a crime was not commited, just not the crime of pedophilia nor anything close to that severity IMHO.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)Isn't there a similar power dynamic involved there? Yet, such relationships are perfectly legal and occur with some regularity.
An unequal power dynamic does not make a relationship illegal, generally speaking. An adult engaging in a relationship with a minor does.
BainsBane
(53,035 posts)It's normalizing predatory behavior.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)She's only 10 years older than the boy, and while that seems like a lot when he's 17 and she's 27, it wouldn't seem so much if she was 37 and he was 27. My dad was 10 years older than my mom.
But that just means the adult in the room (legally speaking) needs to me very careful about managing that relationship. The teacher-student relationship is one of power and it cannot be abused. Yeah, she's conventionally attractive, and I don't the boy "minded" it, but it still an abusive relationship. It's always amazing to me how being horny can completely turn the brain off.
HoneyBadger
(2,297 posts)Adrahil
(13,340 posts)linuxman
(2,337 posts)Doesn't take much to get users kid-gloving a (alleged) sexual predator around here.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)law against Teacher-Student romantic relationships. But, because the Age of Consent is apparently 17 years old in Texas, she isn't a sexual predator by definition, she did not rape the kid unless she held grades over his head to force him to have sex with her.
linuxman
(2,337 posts)Sexual predation to me.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)or whether he willingly engaged in sexual with her. As thing are, she violated the law against teacher-student romance.
While she is a decade older than the 17 year old, she is still young. The great majority of 17 year olds have had sex by that age and eventhough they may not be capable of handling the emotional side of sex, the physical side is familiar to them. I know in my case, my High School had a number of very attractive 23-24 year old female teachers and pretty much every male student that I knew had sexual fantasies for them - and I was among the nerd crowd, being a high grade point average student, I can only imagine what the jocks were saying.
Mosby
(16,319 posts)That's the same as murder.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Probably no jail since she had sex with a statutory legal person. Each state sets it's own age of consent age. IMO, even if the boy was ready to have sex with her and was legal per Texas law, What she did was gross.
IronLionZion
(45,457 posts)like something out of a horror movie
Real life is not always like some porn fantasy. You have no idea what someone else has experienced. It may not be as great as you imagine.
miyazaki
(2,244 posts)Hekate
(90,714 posts)...their students?
Christ on a trailer hitch, what a weird and ignorant thread.
Regardless of the difference in ages, regardless of whether or not the student is or is not "of age," there is a profound difference in status and yes, power. Teachers have the power of life and death, so to speak, over their students' transcripts -- whether they can take the next course in the curriculum, whether they can be accepted to the college of their choice, whether a future employer will look on them with favor.
When my husband was still teaching at the local college, a young lady came into his office wearing a low cut top, leaned over his desk and said, "I'd do anything for an A." Really, honey? And have him get fired in disgrace? He told her to open her textbook and study.
Yes, college-level teachers, with their over-18 and over-21 students, can lose their careers. The rule is -- never date, much less have sex with, someone who is actually in your class at the time. It is a helluva conflict of interest. Wait until all the grades are in. That's what my brother did when he was a TA, and fell hard for the young woman with the waist-length blond hair. Only when she was well out of his class did he date her and court her.
High school students are of an age to be socially naive, impressionable, and vulnerable. Boys may be horny, but that still applies to them. There have been a couple of cases in the last 15 years or so of predatory teachers who seduced a student and got pregnant accidentally on purpose. You guys who snicker at how "lucky" the boy in the OP was, think on that.
She needs to lose her license to teach K-12 kids.
IronLionZion
(45,457 posts)I can believe that a teenager would not think about the consequences. But it is very disappointing that many adults don't either.
It's probably not quite as awesome as many are imagining.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)College instructors who have sex with their students have not committed any crime.
Hekate
(90,714 posts)I was employed in Personnel (now Human Resources) at the local University of California for years.
The ones who get away with it are the ones with the good sense to not date students they have to give a grade to.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)And is, of course, not illegal.
The law deals with incidents regarding minors very differently.