Where did we go wrong as a nation?

[lpbk2713]

What did we do that was so horrible that we should be cursed with a psychotic misanthrope
for a head of state?

And I didn't say "leader" because he will never have a clue what it takes to be a leader.

[hatrack]

1. Laziness, Ignorance of History, Wishful Thinking, High Tolerance For Bullshit

Believing our own PR . . .

That's just for starters.

[ffr]

3. +1 n/t

[Dave Starsky]

9. Yes. Yes, indeed.

Freedom isn't free. We really do have to work for it. All of us. All the time.

[2naSalit]

19. apathy too.

[Auntie Bush]

37. All the right wing hate radio was a big help.

[Solly Mack]

68. That's a good start.

[Takket]

2. removal of fairness doctrine

It opened that ways for a generation of brainwashing. even if the fairness doctrine was brought back, it would take another entire generation to undo the damage and return America to being the shining beacon on the hill

[LisaM]

6. I do think that has a lot to do with it.

Of course, there's a whole bucket of other things - like the media consolidation that took place under Bush, and the vote suppression that's been going on right under our noses for a long time. Partisan Supreme Courts, too.

[FiveGoodMen]

26. Amen!

[eleny]

4. Slavery

[StevieM]

5. July 7, 1987. We went wrong when we celebrated Oliver North as a hero. (eom)

[mnmoderatedem]

85. I always visualize the hypocrisy of the right wing reaction...

of Iran Contra happening under the Obama administration rather than the Reagan administration.

I mean just imagine that....

[MoonRiver]

7. Decades of right wing propaganda had a lot to do with it.

[Va Lefty]

8. The murders of JFK, Medgar Evers, MLK and RFK

really enabled this whole shitstorm we have now

[elleng]

10. Good/informative history here. Please watch:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10028538827

[irisblue]

11. 22nd Amendment, 1947 aka republicans will never let anothrr FDR in

taking a long view

[ismnotwasm]

12. When we let racism and sexism slide.

[sailfla]

13. Yup, ignorant, apathetic, stupid, uninformed...

Then we watch Duck Dynasty, reality TV, Pawn Stars..We are one dumb down fucking country.

Any questions, America?

[mvd]

14. Complex question

Where did it start? With Nixon. After all the progress of the 60s, they were able to fight back. Reagan made things worse, and everything since has led to Trump and the tea party radical Republicans. While our party has not helped with going to Third Way type thinking, that is still no excuse. Even if we haven't done enough to help the working class, it should be obvious that the Repukes do far less.

[Blue_true]

40. Tip O'Neill opined that all politics was local.

I am no fan of Joe Manchin, but he is all Democrats can expect out of West Virginia for the US Senate. I wish Senate seats were apportioned by population, but that isn't the rule that we are operating under.

I have always been of the constant change mindset, when we as Democrats see a chance to grab a big slice of change, we need to grab it. But the simple reality of our Constitution makes it possible for people from rural, poorly educated parts of the country to slow down progress. America is changing, we are continuously changing from a rural nation to a nation where the vast majority of citizens live in coastal states. As technology continues to drive change and the way people think, it will become harder and harder for rural people to have real influence, there are many elements of good in that, but also some bad (the rightwing rural people will become reactionary and potentially violent).

[pangaia]

53. Maybe you have hit on something...

".....we are continuously changing from a rural nation to a nation where the vast majority of citizens live in coastal states...."

Perhaps this is one reason the jerks claim climate change is fake... wipe out all the Dems on the coasts...

[mvd]

69. Maybe you are right about West Virginia. They went hard right

However, I feel we can have success in those areas by standing up for our principles, even if the people in those areas disagree. They would respect you at least. And maybe even change minds. It's had some success already, so worth a try. I agree that the demographics will be changing in our favor.

[NCDem777]

79. Another big thing to remember

is that these regions are staking their everything on reviving jobs that no longer exist.

No matter how much coal industry holds their breath and whines about environmentalists, the fact is coal isn't coming back. Many of the mines are tapped out and countries are switching over to cheaper energy sources. Even China is doing it. The writing's on the wall.

Same with manufacturing. Once all the stuff that was going to happen regardless of who won stops happening, what then? Then there is the pesky automation factor.

Conservatives can bleat about "regulations" all they want but it still remains true that paying one guy to keep an eye on 5 robots is cheaper than paying 5 guys to build what the robots can.

And once that black lung disease coverage goes away, we have a big opening.

[Raster]

56. I agree. There should have been formal impeachment proceedings....

...complete with trial in the Senate and prison term for Nixon. The Republicans became master of "let's move on and come together, blah, blah, blah" when it's Repubs in the hot seat. Now when it's Dems, the story is different. Consider Clinton's impeachment in the House... a long, drawn-out affair whose intention was to humiliate and delegitimize a sitting Democratic President.

Another fuck-up was Raygun and Iran/Contra. There should have been comprehensive investigations, trials and prison terms.

And yet another fuck-up was letting the WAR CRIMES of cheney*/bush* slide.

[frazzled]

15. Opioids

Not really kidding.

[Dave Starsky]

16. You're absolutely right. And antidepressants, too.

Pain exists for a reason. It's telling you that something is wrong, and that you need to do something about it. Even if you're not sure what that is.

[TexasBushwhacker]

36. Those of us who are alive because of antidepressants

and don't have to spend our lives writhing in pain because of opioids certainly appreciate your sensitivity.

[Dave Starsky]

44. Oh, I am completely sensitive to it.

I am not discounting your pain or your depression. It's very real, and it's terrible. I just submit to you that maybe the root causes, whatever those are, aren't being addressed.

[blue neen]

74. "The root causes"?

People are genetically predisposed to Clinical Depression. For instance, the genetic polymorphism of SLC6A4 is indicated in some who have Depression.

Please do your research before making unfounded comments about antidepressants. Thank you.

[Dave Starsky]

82. Yes. I know.

It is simply my opinion that both are overprescribed and/or often prescribed ineffectively. Apparently, it's an opinion shared by the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality and the National Committee for Quality Assurance, as both are now the targets of HEDIS measures that healthcare entities use to track the effectiveness of treatment programs and services.

So, yes, I have done some research on this. Thank you.

[blue neen]

83. I guess you are aware, then, that genetic testing is now available

to help determine what anti-depressants and pain medications would be most effective for individuals.

Genesight is one company that offers them.

[TrekLuver]

17. Let's not forget all the progress we have made. Yes this is a setback but there is no doubt

that the United States is moving towards a progressive state. No it's not where we want it to be but these changes happen slowly. What also brings me great comfort is that history will see this whole fiasco quite clearly....we shall be redeemed.

[Blue_true]

43. You stated how I feel. President Obama

Made considerable progress. Our problem as Democrats is that after we get a Democrat President that push forward progressive policy, we get into a family pissing contest where we break up into weakened pieces, we did it after Johnson and got Nixon, we did it after Clinton and got Shrub, we did it after Obama and got the monster that we are stuck with for four years (I absolutely do not want Trump to die in office because that will almost surely give us a President Pence to fill out his term and set up strongly to win a four year term - national grief, even for a asinine loser President CAN lead to such an end). I want a live Trump to get his ass kicked by a Democrat in the 2020 election.

[bdamomma]

62. The way he looks

I don't know. He is 70 yrs old, suffering from a mental disorder and definitely does not eat well.

[octoberlib]

18. Decline in popular trust in government started with 9/11

then Citizens United, obstructionism by republicans,. Then Trump comes along and says he's gonna drain the swamp and enough people fell for it. Republicans caused most of this shit , so people elected another Republican thinking he's going to fix it. Go figure. From the Nation:


 For small-d democrats who are worried about Trump and Trumpism, the latest Democracy Index provides vital perspective. The new president is a bad player. He disrespects and disregards democratic values, encourages distrust of democratic infrastructure, and expresses disdain for the essential source of information in a democracy: a free and skeptical and questioning press that is willing to speak truth to power.

But even before Trump entered the presidential race, the crisis was real, and it was metastasizing.

Robert W. McChesney and I made this point in our 2013 book Dollarocracy: How the Money and Media Election Complex is Destroying America and our 2016 book People Get Ready: The Fight Against a Jobless Economy and a Citizenless Democracy (both Nation Books). We used the Democracy Index and other measures to warn that the combination of big-money politics; lobbying abuses that tip the balance of power to corporate interests; underfunded and dysfunctional media; assaults on labor rights; the gutting of voting rights; and the manipulation of election systems by partisans was undermining the infrastructure of democracy.

Undermining the infrastructure of democracy necessarily undermines confidence in democracy—which we suggested would create a crisis for the United States, a country that already has embarrassingly low levels of voter participation when compared with fully functional democracies. The 2016 Democracy Index provides a fresh measure of that crisis, noting that

The decline in the US democracy score reflects an erosion of confidence in government and public institutions over many years. According to the Pew Research Centre, public trust in government has been on a steady downward trend since shortly after the September 11th attacks in 2001. Donald Trump won the November 2016 presidential election by exploiting this trust deficit and tapping into Americans’ anger and frustration with the functioning of their democratic institutions and representatives. He positioned himself as the insurgent candidate, a political outsider taking on a “rigged system” who would “drain the swamp” in Washington, DC. However, his candidacy was not the cause of the deterioration in trust but rather a consequence of it.

https://www.thenation.com/article/the-economist-just-downgraded-the-us-from-a-full-democracy-to-a-flawed-democracy/


Trump is a symptom of a flawed democracy.

[Spider Jerusalem]

41. More like "Watergate", or "Vietnam"

it was already pretty well advanced by 2001.

[Hamlette]

45. and turbo charged by Reagan for the right. "the government IS the problem" nt

[Blue_true]

46. I agree. Vietnam damaged trust in government

And Watergate destroyed that trust. After Watergate, republican Presidents have been lying opportunists that pitted segments of the population against each other.

[NCDem777]

63. I think Vietnam was a major point for another reason

All those images of hippies and leftists calling soldiers, who were often sent to war not of their own choice, baby killers and other horse shit damaged Democrats' credibility with veterans.

[Blue_true]

73. I agree. Like Madonna doing the expletive

Laced Women's March speech, sometimes we step on our message with poorly thought out speech. I have two brothers that were in the service near the end of the Vietnam war, one fought there and was never the same - to have people yelling and spitting at him for something he could not change was a bit much. I came from a poor family, running off to Canada or Mexico or getting some bigwig to get deferments for them wasn't an option that either of my brothers had.

[Vinca]

20. A good chunk of us didn't vote.

[moondust]

21. Didn't fight rapacious greed and bigotry

hard enough and they continue to be richly rewarded--from slaveholders to Reagan to Trump, and a whole lot in between.

[CrispyQ]

22. When we switched our motto from "E pluribus unum" to "In God We Trust."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E_pluribus_unum

[TransitJohn]

23. Ford pardoned Nixon, showing Cons there would be no consequences

Followed by Iran- Contra, Iraq, etc. No consequences, so they keep racing to the bottom. They will keep doing so, until they find the floor, if there is one.

[unitedwethrive]

24. Not prioritizing public education. An educated population is the keystone for any great country.

The right purposefully cut education funding over and over again, I believe for the very reason of making them less able to think critically about their government and its leaders.

[Doc_Technical]

25. "Every nation gets the government it deserves"

Joseph de Maistre

[agenasolva]

27. When we allowed racism, sexism, and White Nationalism to run rampant

[Blue_true]

47. When there is one political party that either

Encourages that stuff or give it a head turn and a wink, what can civilized people do but fight it as best possible?

In reality, we as Democrats are our own worst enemies. For example, on climate change, we fight each other viciously on the margins instead of focusing as a unit on the big picture, republicans don't believe in climate change or environmental law, when we bloody each other, we facilitate, or at least make easier, republican wins. A similar logic exists for every major issue that confronts the nation today.

[Locut0s]

28. You failed to educate your population...

America has long had a distaste for what it perceived as elitism. But it's let it become a distaste for even a base level of education. An ill informed public reaps what it sows.

[bdamomma]

65. yes Education is the key

that is one factor and taking things for granted.

But we have to move forward quickly.

[aikoaiko]

29. Allowing slavery at our inception.

[Blue_true]

48. The British and Spain and French brought slavery to

America. The British, Spanish and French did not outlaw slavery until after the USA was a self standing nation.

[FiveGoodMen]

30. The SBC

[workinclasszero]

31. Right here

"When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross."

[icymist]

32. Allowing consolidation of our media which let hate speech go unchallenged.

Also, letting foreigners buy some of our media.

[democratisphere]

33. Complacency and allowing fake news from fake fox news,

national enquirer, russia, wikileaks, comey, facebook, google and many others to take root and become viable.

[Dem2]

34. Bizarre election cycle

Forgetting the lessons of history.

[unblock]

35. the thread winner is "slavery" as other have noted, but i'll add allowing and not countering foxnews

and hate radio.

not only did they brainwash a very significant minority of the population, they also reduced politics and the discussion of policy to the level of tribalism and schoolyard bullying and name-calling.

[Blue_true]

38. Change is always hard. Too much was left

On President Obama's plate to fix. He had to fix a near depression economy and get it healthy, he had to save a whole industry (autos), he had to reverse years of inaction on clean energy, he had to make long needed changes to healthcare, he had to enforce Court rulings granting openly LQBTQ Americans basic rights, he had to manage two wars that should have never happened to begin with, he had to deal with hostile republicans hell bent on making him fail, lastly, he had to deal with people that hated him simply because of his race. Getting through that all freaked the straddlers out, many went for the comforting words of a con artist on November 8, 2016 (a second day that will live in infamy).

[Blue_Roses]

52. This just makes me miss President Obama that

much more.

[bdamomma]

67. Comforting words???

words of hate, bigotry, disdain for minorities, women, LGBT, Muslims. He has divided people. But only 26% voted for him. We are the majority.

These people were conned by a BS artist.

[madinmaryland]

39. Where we went wrong, I don't know. When we went wrong was Nov. 22, 1963.

While LBJ did enact major legislation, it all was for not with his continued escalation of the Viet Nam War. Everything went downhill after the election of Nixon. It's been a slow drift to more conservative positions the last 50 years after 40 years of progressive policies. Sadly, it is probably going to take another catastrophic economic disaster to return to more progressive policies. Hopefully there is not a war involved.

[briv1016]

42. I don't think it's necessarily America that has a problem. It's humans as a whole.

Look around the world and throughout history. From Brexit to Rwandan to Jim Crow and slavery; humans have always hated the "others." We have shown our willingness to follow horrific leaders like Hitler, Mussolini and Pol Pot.

On our current course, humans are not long for this world.

[Blue_true]

49. Some time I fantasize that if another inhabital

Planet is found, we should send people that can't live with "others" to inhabit it. We will need many planets, because there are many groups that hate "others".

[bdamomma]

70. that sounds good to me

They are not tolerance of others, we all come from somewhere else why can't we embrace that.

I just don't like leaving this horrible situation for our children. I am glad my parents and all my relatives aren't around now to see what we have become and our beautiful country.

[Worktodo]

50. Newt Ginghrich and the Internet

Or however you spell it. Back in the 70s and 80s the political class shared in the spoils but Newt wanted it divided between the Rs and Ds. He may be one of the behind the scenes forces pushing the gerrymandering after the most recent census.

Also the Internet (like radio and TV) has been disruptive.

But fear not! We the People have prevailed a lot over the last 200 years. America's a better place than it was and we'll just keep getting better. All of those people who were out on Saturday-- keep going!!!

[pangaia]

51. Well, for one thing a policy of attempting to extermninate the people who were here before 'us.'

And doing a pretty good job of it.

[Blue_Roses]

54. We got complacent

President Obama had such a soothing affect in everything he did, that we got used to it being calm. (calmer than the previous 8 years) I never worried about waking up to a disaster by my own president. Now I wake up scared to look at the headlines. The only silver lining in all this is that it has mobilized a sleeping giant and that is a force to be reckoned with. We are still here and we won't let Trump forget it.

[liquid diamond]

77. I too find myself scared to check headlines. Who knew CNN could be so scary?

[Dave Starsky]

84. Every day is like an evil, sadistic advent calendar.

Instead of a little chocolate Christmas tree or angel behind the door, there's a live cockroach or a severed finger.

[liquid diamond]

90. That's a graphic and creative way of putting it.

[Initech]

55. Two words: Southern strategy

The GOP's embrace of southern values - god, guns, and anti-gay culture that helped Nixon and Reagan get elected is what led to this. Nearly all our woes can be traced back to that.

[Raster]

57. Even more heinous aspect of the Southern strategy...

...was a concerted effort TO HARNESS RACISM AND USE IT AS A POLITICAL TOOL. Fuck you, Lee Atwater. I hope you are rotting in hell.

[bdamomma]

58. Being too

complacent and not paying attention. Just being truthful.


We had 8 years of calmness, professionalism, dignity, intelligence and the truth
now look at we have........................


I will end it with this:

"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last the White House will be adorned by a downright moron"

H.L. Mencken
The Baltimore Evening Sun
July 26, 1920

[wildeyed]

59. 3/5ths compromise at the Constitutional Convention in 1787.

We gave racists the power to determine the directions of our democracy and never recovered.

[Akamai]

60. I think a lot of it stemmed from ignoring antitrust laws, and

Relatedly, the concentration of media power. 6 major media companies control almost all of the major media outlets. And so the heads of these companies are able to increase their profits by supporting Republican agendas.

E.g., CBS CEO in May Les Moonves said that in bringing introducing Trump to America CBS made: "So much money!"

Oh, Joy! They screwed the country but at least CBS made "so much money!"

what lost and greedy souls!

[NCDem777]

61. I hate to sound like a Bernie bro (though I am pro-Bernie)

but we took our base for granted.

President Obama back tracked on a lot of things that should have been done differently. For example, he bailed out the big banks instead of taking them to task after running as a populist candidate. If he had fought them like Iceland did, and helped out main street. that would have done a lot of good.

Yeah Wells' Fargo's lackeys like Limbaugh and Alex Jones would have screamed conspiracy this and UN takeover that but it would have made the Republicans look like the assholes. Instead we bailed the banksters out. Like Republicans would.

He ran on a platform of getting us LESS involved in the Middle East but we're involved even more. Now with unmanned drones terrorizing villages willy nilly. Yeah there's ISIS but at what point did getting us involved in Syria and Libya seem like a good plan? If the other nations had issues with Assad and Qaddafi, they needed to work it out. They've spent the last 50 years screaming that they want us out of their business.

Honestly, had President Obama not pushed us into Syria, thus creating, however unintentionally, a global refugee crisis, the Progressive movement would not be in a global crisis. Not only did it piss off anti-war progressives here at home, but they created problems significant enough to make even psychopaths like Trump and Firage look appealing to moderates.

To top it off, we ran an interventionist candidate in a country in a very much anti-intervention mood.

It's hard to claim to be the anti-war party when you have drone bombing operations in 5 different countries.

[Fichefinder]

64. I do not like agreeing with you

But I do.

[Blue_true]

76. The Syrian refugee crisis did cause damage to progressives

Worldwide. I hope strongly that the Chancellor of Germany and the President of France hang on to power during their upcoming elections - hopefully our experience of letting Russia affect our election was a wake up call for their intelligence services and politicians. I have increasingly little hope for the UK with May as the PM, hopefully she mucks up Brexit and cause Labor to make a strong comeback (although Labor has an ineffective leader who refused to step aside earlier this year, sort of what we have with the once impressive Pelosi).

I don't agree with you on the banker. Under the laws that existed, they committed no crimes. We can't change laws to make acts a crime, then try people that did actions before the law with crimes - that is exactly what would have happened if we tried bankers post laws being changed as they were. President Obama did the only thing he could, get civil fine money from banks.

I don't think Hillary ran nearly as interventionist as Trump ran. Now with Trump in place, we will have the existing conflicts and are likely to have some added, not to mention getting back into the business of brutal torture. Hillary would not have started more wars and certainly would not have given the CIA a green light to resume torturing prisoners. Even remotely comparing Hillary to Trump in this area is like comparing a 3/4 full glass to an empty glass.

Lastly, with Hillary, at least we could influence her decisions. Trump doesn't give a shit about what we think, he is lost in the house of mirrors that he built for himself.

[Nay]

86. Gotta agree with you completely. All what you say is true, and it has hurt the

Dems tremendously. It doesn't help that there are a lot of conservative Dems, and it really hurts when we face a buffoon like Trump and immediately start voting "yes" on ANY OF HIS GHASTLY CANDIDATES for public office. We needed to be an immovable bloc -- I DON'T CARE if the pubs had enough votes to vote them in anyway. That's not the point. The point is to SAY NO.

[GliderGuider]

66. The Powell Memo and Citizens' United.

Add in a bit of decadence, complacency and 40 years of hate radio and you're there.

[kairos12]

71. Election and veneration of Raygun.

[Iggo]

72. Reagan boner. (n/t)

[liquid diamond]

75. Racism, racism, racism

specifically coming from whites. It has hurt this country since the slave days, and it continues today.

[sarcasmo]

78. Fox News and Rush Limbaugh.

[Solly Mack]

80. We should have always jailed criminal presidents.

If our democracy is too fragile to jail presidents who commit crimes then our democracy was always too weak to weather threats.

Bush got away with his crimes, and so will Trump.

We will never know how strong our country could have been because it was weakened each and every time a president was allowed to get away with their crimes.

We've allowed presidents, and those in government, to get away with far too much, and now they think they can do anything at all to the people and get away with it.

They're not wrong in their thinking.

Much like Trump's bravado is not real strength, allowing presidents to get away with crimes isn't a show of strength either.

Each time they got way with their crimes, our democracy died a little more.

We didn't recover from their crimes. We just pretended it didn't matter.

But it did matter.

[Nay]

87. Yes. A thousand times, yes. nt

[DarthDem]

81. Repeal of the Fairness Doctrine

. . . enabling the rise of hate speech and corporate media control.

Also, Clinton largely squandered his first two years in office, although you can argue that was ultimately mooted.

The fascist coup by the five members of the SCOTUS was fairly significant.

Going back even further, the assassination of RFK.

[Thomthom5300]

88. corporations

Then when we let them be people it was all over. Greed lets them buy all power. This will be the end of man. Robots will take over.

[Inkfreak]

89. Ebb & flow of a free society.

Highs & lows. We seem to be at a low point.