Ever wonder how a so-called progressive could enthusiastically support Trump?

[DFW]

So did I.

About ten years ago, at Mama Ayesha's on CT Ave., Helen Thomas, my brother and I were having dinner when a couple came up and said hello. Helen introduced us, as we didn't know each other. They have since split up, but the guy asked me to be friends on Facebook, so I did. I haven't seen him in years, and we were never what you would call friends. He became a rabid Hillary-Hater, and I stopped responding to his posts eventually, but before I did, one of his friends asked me to friend her, so I did. This woman became not only a rabid Hillary-Hater, but a totally obsessed one. Still calling herself a total progressive, she proudly voted for Trump, and STILL supports him.

Here are a couple of her recent posts. I read them and shake my head (as to the point where I am in serious danger of getting whiplash). She's for real, alright. What she posts is UNREAL, but informative. How some people can't bring themselves to call HRC anything other than "Killary," etc. escapes me. She is totally convinced Hillary would have started World War Three right away, probably with their beloved Vladimir Vladimirovitch. This is not biting satire from the Onion. This is a real person. It's a shame to lose the vote of someone like this to Trump, but do we even want people like back in our tent? A tent big enough to house both me and her inside it would have to stretch from Nome to Tierra del Fuego:

1.)
"I am not surprised about Trump signing DAPL and Keystone pipeline today. However, I am VERY DISAPPOINTED though. Yes, I voted for Trump. Was there a better realistic candidate?! Remember the greatest president we never had...Bernie. It's the DNC's fault."

2.)
"I don't believe marches like on Saturday will go very far with Trump. Trump likes progressive ideas, speaking his language, not whining. He's a "do-er". People who address him in the business language he speaks with ideas and proposals, job development, etc."

3.)
"Many people abroad are THRILLED that Trump is POTUS**. Brexit is the beginning of the fall of the EU and Trump is that booster. The world is reacting against globalism and corporate control, a revolution."

**She must know all four of them.

Now keep in mind that this is someone who by all appearances is rational, well-educated, and yet she comes out with stuff like this, and I'm talking about numerous times per day. A real obsession.

If we're looking for a rational explanation as to why people who seem comfortable, rational and on the surface emotionally stable, support Trump and hate HRC (and by extension, the rest of us) to this degree, I am beginning to think we'll never find it. My worry is that she is not some fringe loner. There are lots of people posting just like her. Trump wants to abolish the EPA? Oh, sure, why not? What good has it ever done anyhow, right?

These people don't drink Kool Aid, they drink LSD straight up with no ice.

[stevenleser]

1. What is her JPR name? nt

[brer cat]

2. !

[DFW]

3. She has never heard of DU

So I seriously doubt if she has ever heard of JPR, either. Seems strictly facebook, although she was touting a group called (no joke) " Bernie or Bust for Trump."

[bravenak]

26. LOL

[irisblue]

4. closed head injury, has to be.

[rug]

5. Why do you think either of them was progressive in the first place?

[DFW]

9. I knew the guy. If Helen Thomas sad he was a friend.....

Then there is no way he was anything but one of us. Way back when, anyhow. Maybe the reason his lady friend left is because she couldn't stand the transformation. She was an acquaintance of Helen's, too, and maybe she couldn't stand his metamorphosis.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

17. I was going to pm you this to get your thoughts.

Trump is a hater, point blank. Empathy is part and parcel of progressivism. Once you lack that there is no governor on what actions you would take.

As an aside the WW lll charge is risible. Whether one likes or dislikes Democratic foreign policy Hillary represented a continuation of it, from Roosevelt to Truman to Johnson to Kennedy to Carter to Clinton to Obama.

[rug]

20. Yeah, that's what makes the change puzzling.

I wasn't thinking their original positions were not progressive, I was more wondering whether they embraced them or simply fond them convenient.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

21. I am emphatically not pointing fingers, rug.

I post on a lot of boards. I escape the safe confines of DU. I had this argument with a former Sanders supporter who ended up voting for Trump and excused his xenophobia by arguing that if we allowed in immigrants there would be less money to be spent on building a social democracy here. What kind of leftism is that? Of course there should be deference to our fellow Americans but not at the expense of a callous disregard for everybody else.


Oh, and Trump ain't about building a social democracy.

[rug]

24. Well, Mussolini started out as a socialist.

The more nationalism creeps in, the more socialism is squeezed out.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

25. How does the old saw go?

Mussolini went from a young Marxist to a fascist and believed in both with an equal fervor.

[forjusticethunders]

34. Socialism is EXPLICITLY globalist. This is how our left wing has been poisoned by the right.

Like, what about the "INTERNATIONALE" screams populism, protectionism and walls to you?

[TrekLuver]

6. Well I can't judge anyone for using Killary with now I carry on about Trashpot.

Yes she can have a sleepover in the tent ...perhaps a weekend getaway...join forces for one purpose and then she can get the fuck out.

[JI7]

7. if voted trump they are not progressive. peopke can claim to be many things

Doesn't mean they are. Trump does it all the time.

[Generator]

8. What is her education level?

The one Trumper I know did earn a masters but he was always full of hate. Trump just gave him permission to be evil. Everyone else I've known has less than that in education that is a Trumper. Smart people might post this shit but they know it's not true. It's especially galling to me when they claim they would have voted for Bernie. I know he loathes Trump. They just spout shit because their parents never loved them or treated them poorly. They were abused so now they get to do the abuse.

The WW3 Hillary thing is Russian propaganda. Jill Stein-Putin lover spouted that. Propaganda works for those with hate in their heart or shit for brains.

[DFW]

10. I would surmise at least BA

But I never asked. She would probably only take it as a provocation if I asked now.

[chrisf1]

11. As a Bernie supporter who was cautious to support Hillary, maybe I could share my view

As a little background, I wanted Bernie Sanders to run for President prior to his announcement, which made me an ardent Bernie supporter all the way through the primary. I'm very much to the left of where you might place Hillary, and was never optimistic about what she might do as President during the primary.

After Sanders was knocked out, I went through a period of not knowing who to support for President. At that time, Trump looked like a centre, maybe centre-right authoritarian to me. Hillary looked like a centre-right moderate. Socially, I vastly preferred Hillary, but Trump was at times looking closer to where I stand economically at that time.

Their VP picks turned me off entirely. I thought, while Tim Kaine is a respectable Senator and decent public speaker, to be the entirely wrong approach for the Clinton campaign. I thought that Mike Pence was a disastrous choice, and he was the beginning of what ended my cautious hope for the best with Trump. Kaine on the other hand wasn't a deal-breaker, but not anyone who would convince me of alignment with my values.

Trump is a masterful player of populist leanings. He is, quite simply, what his voters want him to be, and that's why he was able to win. It's not a question of what Trump's policies are - he was so vague at the time of the election season that placement of him politically was near impossible. But the key decisions - such as Mike Pence for VP, was an indicator of where his Presidency would go, and it's nowhere that anyone remotely liberal should be happy about.

The person who wrote these posts, not to be offensive, doesn't strike me as highly intelligent. But there's ground to be made with nearly everyone, and as soon as they see the warning signs in terms of what kind of monster Trump will be, they will realize their mistake - too late, but they will have that realization nonetheless. I don't know how "progressive" this person really is, either. Nonetheless, it's a broad term, and hard to exactly define, which is why you may come across apparently bizarre situations such as this.

Another example is anyone who is homosexual that supported Trump (and I know a few). They were bothered by Pence, but not enough to change their minds on who they thought Trump was. Given the apparent consideration of William Pryor for SCOTUS, I don't think that type of support can really last. This type of support for Trump is based on facades that will come crashing down eventually.

[DFW]

13. I agree that much of Trump's support will eventually evaporate

But in time to save anything? Voting rights? Abortion rights? The EPA, even the right of government employees to open their mouths within earshot of other live humans??

If Trump's adieu is along the lines of "Cancer cures smoking," there won't be many pieces to pick up after his overdue departure.

[chrisf1]

16. There's a hope, from my view

The only way to save those things is to have a strong unity of Democratic Senators who will not back down on appointments and hope that some of the more anti-Trump Republicans (McCain, Rubio, Graham, Collins, etc) can come through on voting nay for dangerous people. The problem with that is some Democratic Senators seem intent on voting in favor of those appointments to save face in their states (Manchin, Heitkamp, etc.).

I think that there will be no appointment of, say, William Pryor to the Supreme Court. Pryor, for all intents and purposes, would be the most disgusting SCOTUS nominee of our lifetimes. He has little independent streak to speak of, and is arguably a Christian supremacist. Gorsuch and Hardiman by comparison are respectable choices (I prefer the latter).

The hope we have is that bringing enough opposition will deter the administration from their more nefarious ideals. We can only do that if we don't let up in any area of opposition.

[Raster]

15. Let those facades come crashing down as quickly and BRUTALLY as possible...

I supported Bernie in the Primaries, but switched to Clinton for the General. I think a handful of reasons contributed to her loss, and I think the United States is in a far worse position because of that loss. Between tRump and Clinton, the better choice is so freaking obvious, it boggles the mind that supposed honest, intelligent persons could justify or rationalize a tRump Presidency as anything but a GROSS MISCARRIAGE of our electoral system.

I have been involved with the legal and financial community since 1983. I have been HIGHLY AWARE of tRump for years. I have no delusions what-so-ever about tRump's supposed business acumen. He has none. tRump has not been able to secure financing in the United States for at least a decade because of his failure as a businessman. The only thing tRump excels at is self-promotion.

Further, as a Gay man, I am absolutely baffled that ANYONE that considers themselves LGBTQ or an ally of LGBTQ, could ever consider voting for tRump/pence. Baffled.

[yardwork]

12. The lies about Hillary really brainwashed a lot of people.

The brainwashing affected people on both the left and the right. Then, to fill the void left by their refusal to consider Hillary Clinton in realistic, fact-based terms, millions of people simply projected their hopes and fantasies onto Trump.

It makes no rational sense but it happened. Kind of a mass hypnosis.

[DFW]

14. When enough of them start suffering due to a lack of health coverage

Or, abortion rights, or closing of schools, or any one of the many destructive things Trump has promised.......will THAT be enough to wake his voters up? I fear not. They'll just watch Hannity tell them to blame it on the libbruls, and so they will.

[dhill926]

22. sadly agree...

[Blanks]

27. The first Farm Aid was in 1985...

Reagan had been president for over 4 years. He was able to blame everything that went wrong his entire first term on Carter.

The farmers that went bankrupt don't hold it against Reagan even though he was at the helm when they lost the farm.

My point is that there is no convincing true believers of anything other than what they want to believe.

They'll lose it all and it will be Obama's fault unless the democrats are better at spinning than they have been in the past.

[LeftInTX]

31. I know.

They loved him in Texas when Texas went into a horrible oil recession.

They loved him when homes foreclosed.

They loved him when interest rates were sky high.

They loved him the same way they loved adjustable rate mortgages.

They loved him when the stock market crashed in 1987.

They loved him so much they voted for his VP in 1988.

[yardwork]

28. Blaming Democrats - from both the right and left - is the plan.

[Cha]

23. The psyche ops and brainwashing were complete

You have described it perfectly, yardwork.. Mahalo!

The lies about Hillary really brainwashed a lot of people.

The brainwashing affected people on both the left and the right. Then, to fill the void left by their refusal to consider Hillary Clinton in realistic, fact-based terms, millions of people simply projected their hopes and fantasies onto Trump.

It makes no rational sense but it happened. Kind of a mass hypnosis.

Team that up with comey and Russia's interference.. a shitload of mass HRC.. I saw it in Real Life from both sides of the spectrum.

[CajunBlazer]

18. ...

[Cha]

19. Bullshit.. so sad. there are blotus fans who

look @ the crowd size pics of him and President Obama and chose his as the biggest 'cause they know that's what he wants.

Reality deniers .. I'm lumping your "friend" in with those.

DonViejohttp://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=8533887

[DFW]

29. She is one "friend" I have no intention of meeting

She doesn't just deny reality. She has declared open war on it.

[MountCleaners]

30. It's long and old, but it's a classic of background reading

Political Research Associates on RW populism, from 1990 and 1999. Remember the Reform Party?

http://www.politicalresearch.org/1999/02/27/right-woos-left/#sthash.y3r9Xn4G.dpbs

I love this site, it's very educational.

On a more contemporary note, I have a FB friend who is fortunately anti-Trump. But a few years ago, she was expressing progressive sentiment....and linking to Alex Jones.

Some people haven't read a lot of political science and don't realize that the extreme right makes overtures to naive people on the left via trade deals or labor issues. "Globalism" is a term that comes from the far right. Alex Jones laments "globalism" all of the time.

[muriel_volestrangler]

32. The view abroad: of 24 polled countries, only Russia prefers Trump to Obama

https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/global-advisor-obama-trump-approval-2017.pdf

Just 3 countries have "Trump will be a good president" over 50%: India (65%; 89% of them thought Obama was a good president); the USA (52%; 56% though Obama good); and Russia (74% and 13%). The global average is 34% think Trump will be good, and 76% though Obama was good.

[forjusticethunders]

33. The tell is """"globalism"""". She's brainwashed.

"""Globalism""" is a racist, anti-leftist buzzword that has somehow been Trojan Horsed into progressive discourse by outlets like Counterpunch, Common Dreams and AlterNet (all of whom are likely on Putin's payroll). But it was really thought up by right wing "populists" who use the word to refer to what they used to call a "Judeo-Bolshevik conspiracy" to take over the world.