General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsFor the Record, I think they hacked Brexit too.
I think they're in the process of hacking Germany.
And to be clear, I think they have fucked with, are in the process of fucking with, and are continuing to plan to fuck with VOTING MACHINES, etc.
I think there has been a coordinated effort from them for quite some time. I don't *just* think they had some operatives here, but hosted some of us there (Manafort, et al) I think DU was just a part of it (the hack)
We will not overcome the way they cheat if we only ever talk about it in the past tense.
Do NOT let them frame the fucking narrative.
nini
(16,672 posts)They were a bit stunned that passed too.
onenote
(42,768 posts)The vote there was done entirely with paper ballots.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)and they had NOTHING to do with any malfeasance this time around.
Nothing whatsoever.
onenote
(42,768 posts)Anything to back up that claim?
How paper ballots are counted in the UK:http://theconversation.com/explainer-how-britain-counts-its-votes-41265
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)Last edited Sun Jan 15, 2017, 02:00 PM - Edit history (1)
This is a discussion board. This is not the "I have to prove something to you because you think I need to stifle my speech (or in this case, post) to suit YOUR spite. I don't. I'd love to see our machines examined...by now, the chain of command would muddy it though, wouldn't it? But I digress...
There is a dichotomy going on here at DU:
1) One one hand, we're an anonymous bunch of activists, too small to make an difference, and certainly not important enough for the Russians to hack on election day
2) On the other, we aren't supposed to say 'VOTING MACHINES WERE HACKED' because our influence is so vast that it might dissuade people from voting and adversely effect our credibility.
hardluck
(641 posts)Being asked to provide any facts to support your assertion. And on a discussion board! So do you have anything to support your assumption besides your feelings?
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)Alekzander
(479 posts)LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)onenote
(42,768 posts)and claiming that the Russians hacked the Brexit vote is a foolish claim.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)see post #45.
Because this really is getting crazy.
onenote
(42,768 posts)ProudProgressiveNow
(6,129 posts)Generic Brad
(14,276 posts)The most vulnerable point in the election process is in the tabulation of the votes. Our machines are probably not hacked. But I would bet dollars to donuts that the vote counting/reporting process has been compromised in many key places.
milestogo
(16,829 posts)BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)It comes naturally to him.
He cheats and steals from his own people in order to amass his whopping $200 billion dollar fortune within 17 yrs, so why should any intelligent country believe he wouldn't do the same in elections in countries that defy his sense of entitlement to rule the world?
Of course he was involved in Brexit - just as he's involved in Calexit. He clearly schemes to divide and conquer the world who dared to unite against his god-given right to oppress it...and murdering his dissenters isn't above him, as we well know.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)kimbutgar
(21,210 posts)The rethugs and thump. I know it is a dream but remember that 47% video that did in Romney. Someone out there has this video, email or memo detailing what they did.
triron
(22,023 posts)producing fake news in Germany.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jan/07/german-police-quash-breitbart-story-of-mob-setting-fire-to-dortmund-church
deminks
(11,017 posts)Fanboy of Putin and the Orange Menace. Has been here on several occasions supporting the orange dumbass and basking in his Brexit lies.
I think he and le Pen carry Putin's 'greetings' when they are here.
Yes, they hacked the Brexit vote to weaken NATO/EU. Yes, they did it here, but got an absolute criminally insane zombie installed. Yes, they are working in France, Germany, and Sweden to do the same thing.
onenote
(42,768 posts)care to share your ideas about how they did it?
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)care to share your ideas on that?
onenote
(42,768 posts)So I think the ball is in your court.
Baitball Blogger
(46,758 posts)LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)Alekzander
(479 posts)everything in their power to prevent it from happening.
They at least are ahead of where we were before our election.
deaniac21
(6,747 posts)NobodyHere
(2,810 posts)MFM008
(19,820 posts)Imo.
Through swaying public opinion through fake news. Lies. Etc.
Getting public fearful especially of immigrants/foreigners, BUT they will mess with votes if possible.
And I mean republicans.
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)Blue_Warrior
(135 posts)What is your theory ?
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)Blue_Warrior
(135 posts)Okay, sorry for asking.
melman
(7,681 posts)It's a legitimate question. Why not try answering it?
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)Baseless bullshit, yeah. But actual facts? None.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)Hey. Thank for the kick!
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)but I am SURE you knew that. Remember the South Carolina field office vandalized? It had completed ballots in it.
I've worked campaigns in earnest since 1986. EACH. one. You're not going to tell me that shit can't be done.
Thanks.
So let's hear the theory then. How'd they do it?
muriel_volestrangler
(101,368 posts)Because ballot box stuffing is not normally called 'hacking'.
The Brexit vote was at the Leave end of what the pre-referendum polls expected, pretty much all over the country. To change 50% to 52%, they'd have had to get extra votes in hundreds of locations. If Russia could organise that without a trace, they'd have such control over the whole country that they'd already be the government.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)This is getting to be like hair splitting.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12512672454
muriel_volestrangler
(101,368 posts)In the US election, we have an actual action by Russia - a literal hacking of emails, and sending them to Wikileaks, who published them (and their publishing of the Podesta emails, day by day, was designed to make it look as though they were a problem, even though there was nothing significant in them).
There is no equivalent action in the Brexit vote - no 'unknown player' doing something for the Leave campaign. There was plenty of bullshit, by it was said openly by British politicians.
If the only way you can describe it is as 'shenanigans' or 'something afoot', it's useless, frankly.
Denzil_DC
(7,266 posts)And the opinion polling since has been pretty much in line with what you'd expect if the actual vote was accurate - right down to Scotland, Northern Ireland and a few other regions being for some unfathomable reason immune from this "hacking".
I think we've had far more productive post mortem discussions on the UK forum about what actually happened to bring about the result.
Which may mean, down the line, we have a quarter of a chance of addressing those issues.
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)Do you ever tire of being wrong.
Hacked a paper ballot. Laughable.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)Do you ever tire of it?
***And yet you said you'd leave me alone***
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)And anytime I see someone spouting bullshit with no basis in reality, I call them out.
You keep spouting off baseless conspiracy theories and when you're presented with facts, you cover your ears like a child who doesn't want to listen.
You post bullshit, I WILL call you out.
So, Russia hacked Brexit? Fucking prove it.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)Baseless.
Never happened.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10028458577#post136
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)bullshit conspiracy theories as well. The same thread where you were presented with facts that disproved your theory and you plugged your ears like a child. Same with this thread, too. I'm seeing a pattern.
You say you want discussion? That's not true at all. You post bullshit, someone says "hey, that's bullshit" and then you start attacking them and crying victim. Your shtick is obvious and you're detracting from the real issues being discussed on this message board. If you want to post your nutter theories, then use the Creative Speculation forum.
pintobean
(18,101 posts)Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)Russians, armed with axes, rushed in and hacked the paper vote in the UK while no one was looking because tinfoil.
roamer65
(36,747 posts)MI6 should be investigating it. If they are, then the referendum is invalid.
dalton99a
(81,599 posts)KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)The Far Right in all western Democracies are getting help from Russia. But there was no need for ballot stuffing.
You seem to think that if a population does something stupid as a result of propaganda, it's got to be vote flipping or ballot box stuffing.
The pre-vote showed it was almost an even split on Brexit.
JI7
(89,276 posts)To be explained.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)And I want to be clear here: There was a coordinated effort that included all of those things...not any one specific for the enchilada.
Lest you forget the South Carolina office that was vandalized had completed ballots in it.
Pretending this bizarre dichotomy exists wherein we are some news site, and we are a completely irrelevant and too little to be hacked ourselves on that day.
I have worked elections since 1986.
It'd be nice not to face a double standard when I DISCUSS them
ProudProgressiveNow
(6,129 posts)Response to LaydeeBug (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
etherealtruth
(22,165 posts)... disinformation they utilized here.
Apparently the British fall for the same garbage the folk in the US did
Denzil_DC
(7,266 posts)Because without it, this is just not a plausible assertion. And if it were, I'd be all ears, believe me.
Now exercising covert (or not so covert) influence is another matter. We know a whole lot about the moneyed interests that swayed a number of people to vote for Brexit. They're largely in plain sight, and have run some powerful UK media outlets for years. There's no need for conspiracy theories to account for that.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)Funny that.
Denzil_DC
(7,266 posts)People post news and opinions, and others quite often ask them where that news or that opinion came from if they haven't made it clear. Seems an innocuous invitation to provide evidence to me.
And since last I looked, 21 people had reced your assertion, maybe one of them could chip in and explain why they agree with your assertion.
Because, I'm afraid, unless you're holding out for some reason, you appear to have no basis for it.
LaydeeBug
(10,291 posts)Denzil_DC
(7,266 posts)I apologize for mistakenly assuming you wanted a discussion about it on a discussion board.
brooklynite
(94,745 posts)BooScout
(10,406 posts)There was no way in hell the vote on Brexit was hacked. Not with paper ballots and the number of checks in place to assure that something like that just can't happen.
Brexit happened because theirs a helluva lot of ignorant, scared, racist, xenophobes that live here in the UK, just like in the States.
AnotherMother4Peace
(4,251 posts)ananda
(28,877 posts).. to protect women from the rapists on stage.