This behavior - what we see from Trump and his minions - is a cultural game changer.

[NRaleighLiberal]

Each of us has lived a particular slice of life where some basics are what make life tick (at least reasonably well - there are of course serious cultural issues remaining, and this is meant as a somewhat broad generality).

But - common decency. Treating people like you would like to be treated. Being honest - whether it is schoolwork, your job - striving to achieve. Telling the truth - and feeling shame if you are caught in a lie - hopefully leading to changed behavior toward more honesty. Not using religion as a weapon.

Think about what the republican party post-Eisenhower has, for the most part, done - no true ideas that benefit the greater good, deceit, lies, hypocrisy.

Which I suppose is the broad arc that "gifted" us with Trump and those who surround him - nothing but lies, never any shame, insults, bizarre nationalism (Russia???), out-in-the-open power grabs for the wealthy.....of course aided and abetted by a media that is focused solely on eyeballs and money - in a bubble that they seem to feel protected in.

Each day since election day things seem to feel worse- the lies become more blatant - we are adding plagiarism to the mix now (it has always been there, but there it is in the news today) - the tweets, the insults, the childish boorish behavior. Gaslighting as a way of communicating. Loading the cabinet with loathsome characters.

Those of us - I suspect all of us here - who through our years developed a way of life founded on decency and honesty - there is no way for us to make sense of this....or, worse, be able to comprehend where it may lead.

Perhaps it is all a big pendulum swing - we've been here before, long ago, before any of us were around. It swings right to left, and we are just in a rather nasty phase.

But this feels really different...and far worse. Perhaps we realize that there are those in our lives - friends, neighbors, family members - that look at this and celebrate it. That this is what they have been waiting for.

And that is horrifying indeed.

[Faux pas]

1. Kickin' with gusto!

[HAB911]

2. It is very different for me

I'm over the edge

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10028441529

[liberalmuse]

3. Truth!

And kick!

[no_hypocrisy]

4. Trump and his minions are counting on suppressing our voices one by one

when our safety and/or lives are threatened or our liberty is imperiled. If you are unlawfully arrested, you still lose your money if you're lucky enough to afford an attorney. They will wear you down one way or the other.

[Initech]

5. Growing up I was always told that the Nazis were the bad guys.

Now it seems that Nazism is the new normal - calling itself the "alt right". They are self-loathing individuals who have utter disdain from anyone who is not a rich white man. Poor? Fuck 'em. Minorities? Fuck 'em. LGBT? Fuck 'em. Women? Fuck 'em. That seems to be their mantra. And it is indeed horrifying.

[Wounded Bear]

6. K & R ......

Good of you to point out that this isn't new. It's been going on for decades and Repubs have been at the heart of it.

But it is broadly cultural, too. It permeates a lot of things, most importantly entertainment and gaming. I remember a few years ago, when a new edition of Grand Theft Auto was released, it might have been the 2d. One reviewer's comment sticks in my head. Don't remember an exact quote, of course, but the upshot was: "Imagine a game where you can carjack somebody, jump in the car, and circle around and run the guy you just carjacked over."

We're fucked.

[Docreed2003]

8. That's the same game....

Where you can pick up a hooker to regain health, then kill her and take back your money and whatever additional money she has in her. Sick

[world wide wally]

7. I keep asking myself, "How could America do this to itself"?

It is like a beautiful woman just heard it was "good for you", so she slashed her face with a razor.
This will leave a permanent scar at best.

[ffr]

9. I want to be a republican so I too can be shameless.

That must be one of the best parts about being a republican. You can do or say anything and when you get caught in the act you can always turn to the RW M$M to help get your back. Throw out some flashy Red Herring fallacy to distract your audience and you're off Scott free. Only, I could never live with myself or anyone I respect doing that.

We are entering troubled waters.

Thanks Putin.

Thanks Comey.

Thanks Giuliani.

Thanks Russian Television.

Thanks Joe and Jane RW selfish voter.

You really fucked us this time.

[certainot]

10. in 87 reagan killed the fairness doctrine and the rw

bought up all the loudest radio stations in the country and created a monopoly propaganda operation.

they put carnival barkers on every corner and stump in the country and all day long for 30 years they've been yelling hate and lies and making excuses for republican increasingly irrational behavior.

and liberals stuck their ipods in theirears and ignored it and in doing so bush palin and trump became acceptable in 40 states with 80 senators. the left continues to ignore rw radio, even though it kicked their internet ass and more than 88 major universities endorse and help attract advertising for more than 257 limbaugh stations by broadcasting sports on them.

to allow 1200 radio stations to keep making excuses for trump for the next two years would be the most assinine thing dems liberal the left could do, compounding the biggest political mistake in history

protest those universities to look for apolitical alternatives until trumps most important weapon, the talk radio monopoly, falls apart. if americans are going to protest this asshat they couldn't protest more efficiently than at those 88 universities and continue until the only advertisers on those stations were proud protrumpers and trumps best weapon falls apart. we need to let people see that the hate and lies are not accptable.

does anyone believe this guy would have gotten anywhere near the white house if those radio stations weren't supporting him? now making excuses for putin?

[YoungDemCA]

20. Trump's strategy from the start was to listen to the people who called into right-wing talk radio

The political brilliance of that is almost as simple as it is diabolic.

[Ligyron]

24. I know - that's exactly what he did all righty.

I believe that Trump is basically apolitical and without a coherent ideology internally (except "me first&quot and therefore took on this RW mantle since it seemed the quickest, most sure way to receive the public adoration his narcissistic personality demands. His biggest problem, of course, is the considerable and very public dislike this also brings him from a large and very vocal segment of the population and which he finds impossible to ignore.

If liberal philosophy was more popular in the public sphere (because I believe that in reality - it is) he would have gone that route to get there but with the RW take over of the media as per the Powell Memo we're getting this shitbag.

[certainot]

36. here's a diary about that but i wonder if he

thought of that or if putin's people suggested it- the repubs are steeped in it and hundreds of the top political analysts haven't thought twice about it the last 30 years, but the russians know a successful psyops when they see it

"I listened to thousands of hours of talk radio, and he (Trump) was getting reports from me,"

[Fast Walker 52]

11. The blatant dishonesty and sheer delusion from Trump supporters is just dizzying and maddening

I'm so upset about this it is spilling over into my worklife and other areas.

[CrispyQ]

12. The hypocrisy of the GOP is stunning. Unbelievable, actually, for anyone in touch with reality.

McConnell chastising the dems for holding out on the SCOTUS nom? Who the fuck does he think he is? Oh that's right, the majority leader of the party that has lied, cheated, & stolen their way into power across the land. And the other part of the problem is the complicit, 'fair & balanced' media, who let the GOP get away with it. Two different standards for the dems vs the repubs. Thanks to media complicity, ACORN is gone over a pack of lies & deception while ALEC is still around.

I can no longer watch any of the network news shows, but my husband still does. He said Joey Scar was saying this morning how the pentagon doesn't contribute to the debt but that SS does. And of course he isn't called out on his bullshit.

This feels different because it is different. A pack of hyenas is in control of most of the government, & they are going to act fast & bold to gut this country & the rest of us takers be damned.

[chimpymustgo]

35. This is so true. The sky really is falling. We have no recourse - they have all the power

and they won't give it up. They are a criminal, depraved party - and their mission is to rape, pillage and steal. They got their country back - and they are moving full speed ahead to rob it blind.

[nini]

13. This is why I will have nothing to do with those who support that side anymore

They are choosing hate and fascism and in doing so it's like an assault on what i believe in and my well being. It doesn't matter to me what their reasons are - they are enabling the demise of everything this country stands for and we will all suffer because of it.

No more agreeing to disagree with them.

[mnhtnbb]

15. I want to keep a big distance from family who are Trump supporters.

Fortunately, my brother and his wife live in California and we live in NC. My husband has Trump supporting family
in Georgia, and he hates going to visit them: I won't go with him. His family are out right racists, while my brother
and his wife are all about the $$. They will put up with the misogyny, racism, bigotry, xenophobia, and lies in order
to get tax cuts. I have no use for either of them anymore.

[nini]

18. Those people suck the life out of me and I'm tired of it

I am the one to ignore their stuff to keep the peace for my mom. They can't seem to respect me enough to not bring up politics and now with this stuff? Nope..I'm done. I told my mom before Christmas I was no longer going to partake in the family gatherings - she completely understood since she's on my side. She's 92 and I bet if she was younger she'd do the same but she wants to see her family as much as she can at this point.

I wouldn't allow 'friends' to be like that and continue to be around them.. family isn't different when things get to this level. We're not just disagreeing on how to pay down the debt here.. It's our rights, being able to retire etc..

I'm even beyond the stage that it's sad it has to be like this. I'm done.

[Ligyron]

27. I've seen several statements on Facebook about exactly WHY people who feel this way are disengaging.

It's important for our significant others to know these reasons so we don't look petty (which is what they assume since they are).

[nini]

30. Oh they know why I'm sure

I was pretty vocal before, so my silence with them now speaks volumes.

Add to that - I really don't care what they think.

[mnhtnbb]

14. You've nailed it--this cultural game changing behavior--and it is horrifying.

Many of us still can't believe that Trump--the most unqualified person in history-- a character challenged
individual who probably has narcissistic personality disorder and is certainly a pathological liar, not only
became the nominee of the Republican party but will now be inaugurated as POTUS in 10 days. It just
fu*king boggles the mind for those of us who believe in honesty, decency, integrity, common good, and the concept
that government is designed to serve all of us, not be used as a business to enrich a few of us.

It is horrifying. Truly horrifying.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

44. Yes....so insane I can barely say anything about this pit of hell...

Other than curse words.

[mnhtnbb]

46. I have been cursing a lot more than usual for the past two months.

[Cosmocat]

16. The US is now an emergent authoritarian, fascist state

It didn't come out of nowhere on November 8th.

This has been building for a quarter century now, getting a bit worse each year, before taking a MAJOR step forward with Trump candidacy.

Its over now.

1/3 (republicans) of the country is lost, they have chosen to completely separate from reality and live in their hateful little bubble and they aren't coming back.

1/3 of the country are "independents" and apolitical people who for some reason are willing to buy the evil liberal boogyman bullshit and willing to go over whatever cliff the conservatives drive us over far more often than not.

1/3 of us deal in reality, facts and reason and have a belief that we all can do better working together. But, we can't even lead the other 2/3 to the water, much less make them drink it. Nothing we can do.

[CrispyQ]

28. This:

1/3 of us deal in reality, facts and reason and have a belief that we all can do better working together. But, we can't even lead the other 2/3 to the water, much less make them drink it. Nothing we can do.

I have two cousins who listen to hate radio & they loathe liberals. They would never admit that they hate minorities/women/gays, but liberals? Some of their screeds on FB have been horrific. I unfriended the worst of the two after he posted something about open season on liberals come 1/20. On the one hand I wanted to challenge him & ask, "Really? You want to kill me or have me killed? We grew up together!" But I'm half afraid he'd reply, "Yes, I'd like to see you dead."

[SDJay]

17. Great Points All Around. Thank You.

I think if we really drill down to the core of what I agree is a culture that is not changing for the better at all, we've moved almost completely into a "ME ME ME" approach that is now lauded as a virtue. PULL YOURSELF UP BY YOUR BOOTSTRAPS! NO MORE WELFARE KINGS/QUEENS! KEEP YOUR GUBMINT HANDS OFF MY HEALTHCARE! SCREW THE POOR - THOSE MOOCHERS!

This type of attitude, when I was growing up in the Midwest in the 70's, used to draw sharp and negative responses from everyone around. Now this boorish attitude is welcomed and spun as 'just freedom being free and stuff.' USA!

We're becoming, or perhaps in many senses we've already become, a country and a culture of assholes. We are now faced with an all-time asshole coming in as POTUS.

Democracy in my opinion wasn't intended to be 'every person for him or herself.' It definitely was never 'I've got mine so fuck everyone else.' The whole point of democracy from when it was founded was to come together as a populace and govern. That's an idea that I think is completely gone, and this is what we get in response.

[YoungDemCA]

19. Unfortunately there has never been any inherently logical argument for hope

There is no reason to believe things will get better. And likewise, there is no reason to believe things will not get worse. This has all been a sobering punch in the gut for me, and I suspect the same is true for many others.

[heaven05]

21. yep I agree

yet, fact is that MILLIONS of ameriKKKans voted for this culture change. Why? That's the question I keep asking myself as we get closer to our demise as a so called democracy. Why would this clown be POTUS outside of the obvious implications of interference in our election by his bro in russia, racist republiKKKan shenanigans in denying hundreds of thousands if not millions of voters their right to participate in one of the most important functions of our so called democracy and the extreme and yes deplorable ignorance of ameriKKKans that have always been the denizens of the racist underbelly of again, our so called democracy.

It is far worse than it looks or is portrayed by our totally compromised, by money and power, MSM. It is far worse than even your opinion of this being "a rather nasty phase". While true for some who can weather this "phase", it is potentially more dangerous and more deadly, for all not in lockstep to the new fuhrer and his minions out here in society at large, and for those citizens not being the right skin color of the majority of citizens representing this racist, xenophobic, homophobic RW swing in our so called democracy, than at any time since segregation times.....when massa and missy roamed the streets unchecked making life miserable for decent people of all persuasions. Goodbye america, hello new ameriKKKa.

[WiffenPoof]

22. Excellent Post

Well written and insightful. Thanks for posting.

[delisen]

23. Yes. It's different.We have lost our narrative, our national story, and have not yet written

a new one.

Seems like a nightmare where I am in a once grand library where all the great books have been burned, the librarians have been disappeared, and failed writers are roaming the stacks hawking their penny dreadfuls.

[KT2000]

25. My father was a gentleman

His word was good, he was honest and ethical, he knew there were con men but would not fall for one because he knew what fair was. I am so glad he is not here to see this awful downfall of decency. He would have lost all respect for our government as we are going through now.

[hibbing]

26. Next generation

Now think of teenage kids today that will have these formative years influenced by this weak, disgusting and vile human being.

The racist acts that has been even more prominent since the election will grow.

Perhaps it swings to the right or to the left, my observation is that when it does swing left, those ideas were more moderate or even conservative in the past. Hell, if you told these idiots some of the stuff their Saint Reagan did without telling them it was Reagan, they would think it was a Democrat.

I give up.


Peace

[Generator]

29. And if he is gone tomorrow it will still be there

The lack of decency and social norms. (more candidates will use the same race baiting and lying maybe WORSE than Trump if Trump doesn't end our democracy) We aren't getting those back for awhile. So YES, I am advising my teens to find a way to get out of America. This country is not going to be okay for decades if at all.

[lancelyons]

31. I wish this where brought out into the open by the media more.

We all know these things but according to all the right wingers and perhaps media that wont cover it, we are all just biased.

Not only has the GOP ways really changed the values of america culture as you have said, they have also helped allow tv stations like Fox News and media outlets like Breitbart to continue to spread false information about our democracy under the guise of calling out a democratic administration.

I hope this is not the new normal but it sure feels this way.

Even my own father who has listened to Rush and Fox for the past 12 years, cant seem to see past how he has been programmed and in our lively discussions, he can never find any common ground and says exactly what every other right winger says verbatim. No in between no more common ground.

[Achilleaze]

32. k n r

[jimlup]

33. I disagree with the pendulum hypothesis

I think there is a give and take. It is between the governed and the governers. But, ultimately, the governers depend on the consent of the governed to acheive their ends. I will not give my consent to the orange baboon king.

[DonCoquixote]

34. let's admit the world is changed

and as we picked people to fight Trump, let us please please please dispense with the idea that if they go low we have to go high. Pure excrement! We will need to break out the James Carville's, the Joe Biden's, the Michael Moore's and everybody else that would go ahead and give the fine "professionals" but somehow lost us 2016 even though we gave them lots of of money, time, blood, sweat and tears.

This election was a cold civil war. Yes I will say it again, it is merely the continuation of the battle that contrary to history did not end when Lee surrendered. All that happened is that Lee was replaced by Nathan Bedford Forrest, the founder of the Ku Klux Klan. That the time was passed along many times, to George Wallace, to David Duke, to Pat Buchanan, and now the likes of Steve Bannon, and Tucker Carlson. They want anyone who does not fit into their vision gone! The bodies of people can be stacked up in the streets, just like they are every mass shooting, just like they are whenever a hurricane happens, or just like the medical morgues being filled with people who could not get medical care is too poor. This is the desired affect, and they are not only happy with the results, but the church is and chat rooms will do their best to lather them up for atrocities that would make Donald Trump weep.

we must stop bringing knives to gunfights, and if that means that we offend friends, relatives, churches tthen so be it. If not, we will find other actors who frankly would like us all dead, the sort of people who thought Che Guevara was cool when he said "I do not need a trial to execute someone." Let me be very frank, what I'm afraid of is that if we as Democrats do not manage to do a successful opposition to these fascist, sooner or later the Nihilists, those who really just want to break stuff and crackheads, will rise up, and always will have is just a bunch of trigger-happy idiots and half crazed vvisionaries that are wolves in sheep's clothing. We do not want to get to the point where this belief is just a product of the red states.

[dlk]

37. They Truly Are Deplorable!

Unfortunately, what we are witnessing is the culmination of a 40-year plus plan to remake the fabric of our country. Since the 1960's, there hasn't been a liberal majority Supreme Court and the result had been a move toward corporate dominance, with its attendant war on unions, public schools, voting rights, women's rights and all of the institutions that actually promote democracy. The basic rules of propaganda and neuro-linguistic programming have been widely used with great success -- when people hear something often enough, it will become part of their subconscious memory, and they will begin to believe it's true, even when it's an ugly lie. Facts become irrelevant; logic and reason are useless. The opposition has very deep pockets.

Most Americans are decent, however, the time for complacency has passed. As President Obama has said, democracy is not a spectator sport. We all need to participate in every possible way we can, to fight back against this cancer that has metastasized in the form of Donald Trump. Our country is worth saving.

[tomp]

38. I know this is a bit off topic but...

...fuck eisenhower! he (and truman and kennedy) colluded with the dulles brothers in cold war criminality that was essentially an enemy-making machine of the highest order that we are still feeling the blowback from today. All for the sake of feeding the MIC and multinational corps.

I think the main difference with *rump is that the immoral ugliness of the american imperialist system is out in the open. The shit that *rump is trying to get away with now is the same shit that has gone on behind the scenes for at least the last 100+ years. That, in a sense, is a yuuuge difference and no difference at all. Now we are simply being forced to perceive the ugliness that has been there all along. as zipper predicted, we are now looking at the back wall of the theater after the curtains are drawn back and all the props are removed.

concentration of power, wealth, and corruption always leads to revolution. we now know what the usurpation of democracy looks like. we will have to see how the masses respond.

[retrowire]

39. Hey, I'm your neighbor now!

No really!

And you can rest assured that I haven't been waiting for this at all.

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

40. Everything about Trump and his election is utterly mortifying.

On so many levels. I'm so glad I'm no longer a public school teacher. How will they ever enforce discipline again with this cretin in the White House?

[eggplant]

41. While I'm loathe to credit the R's for anything, the sweeping generalization is suspect.

Even someone as crooked and villainous as Nixon has done some good: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Environmental_Protection_Agency

I'm sure that in the last 50 years there must be some other examples. I just can't think of any.

[Hulk]

42. HRC was spot on...DEPLORABLES.

"You can't handle the truth..." fitting statement.

[Warren DeMontague]

43. I know. If you're staying in a hotel, pee in the toilet. Not on the bed.

Even I know that.

[vlyons]

45. I can make sense of it

As a Buddhist, it's easy to understand. The 3 mental poisons are ignorance, greed, and hatred. Without dealing with and overcoming these poisons with wisdom, generosity, and love, there are no other antidotes. The driving forces in the republican party are greed for money and lust for power at any cost. Republicans have fomented hatred and fear of "the others" as a means to get votes. The Republican party has become a vast criminal enterprise, mostly fueled from the top by the unrelenting greed for money.

The Golden Rule about treating others is a rule that is stated in all religions. That's why it's called "golden." But somehow we have lost our way. Our moral compass is broken. Religion has become a con game to get money and pass condescending judgement, rather than teach true moral ethics. The Buddhist code of ethics is similar, but a little different from the Judeo 10 commandments. Buddhist ethics are the ground floor from which one pursues and practices towards higher states of consciousness. They are:

No killing, no stealing, no lieing, no sexual misconduct, no harsh abusive speech, no divisive speech to set people against one another, no envy, no ill-will, no wrong views. A wrong view being one that doesn't recognize that all things are impermanent, and everything is connected to everything else. Barack Obama said something early in his presidency that I've never forgotten. In speaking about the "us versus them" mentality of Republican tactics to fear monger, he said, "There is no them, there's only us."

It's very difficult for me, as a Buddhist, to see ignorant and hateful republicans as anything other than "them." It's difficult for me not to hate them, not to harbor ill-will in my heart towards them. But at least I know it. But somewhere, somehow, we all of us have to practice the Golden Rule - at the very minimum. We have to talk about it. We have to teach morality to our children. We have to understand that practicing ethics and the Golden rule is in our own self interest.

I don't know what else to say, except that I hope that you will give this some thought.

[NRaleighLiberal]

50. Brilliant words. thanks.

[Ilsa]

47. Our changed culture isn't because of pot, free love, or rock music.

It's due to basic deadly sins: lust, greed, desire for power and control. The lies, deceptions, mistreatment of others is part of the path to achieving those evil goals. Jesus is just a name to use to get ahead, not to promote goodness and decency.

K&R! Great post.

[Nitram]

48. If this turns out the way it should, it will be a mere pimple on the face of our democratic

system. Not a game changer. Pop it and squeeze out he pus and it's done.

[RedEarth]

49. Outstanding post!

It's a scary time...nothing like anything I can remember.

[northoftheborder]

51. Last three sentences express my dismay and horror:

But this feels really different...and far worse. Perhaps we realize that there are those in our lives - friends, neighbors, family members - that look at this and celebrate it. That this is what they have been waiting for.

And that is horrifying indeed.