Is Jill Stein pulling a Bait and Switch? Her original post implied that she needed

[pnwmom]

to raise $2.5 million to pay filing fees for the audits of all three states.

Now that she's raised that amount, she thanks her donors for funding the audit of the first state -- but she has changed the total amount she needs to $4.5 million.

If she raises that amount, will she be asking for even more?

https://jillstein.nationbuilder.com/recount

[RandySF]

1. Bingo

[JonLP24]

2. She said the extra is for attorneys fees

A long time ago. I'd donate if I could as this is much needed and she came through in the clutch.

[oberliner]

11. Fees ranging from 2-3 million dollars?

That's quite a range.

Has she not inquired as to the costs yet?

[JonLP24]

14. As well as recount observors

I think she has an idea because those figures came pretty early. I remember reading she had a prominent election attorney which I can't find as search results bring up "attorney fees".

[oberliner]

16. The recount observers can't be volunteers?

I would imaging that there would be many who would offer to do so.

[JonLP24]

19. She does have a page for volunteers

http://www.jill2016.com/postelection

I think in any case I think the costs would certainly reach that level especially if it is a lengthy process.

'All I hope the goal is reached, the money poured super quick but not so much right now. I hope some high roller contributes as I'm unsure if regular folks can pitch in $4 million.

[pnwmom]

13. She said that the 2.5M would be enough to file on all three states, implying

that she'd go forward on all three states if she raised that amount.

Now she's saying that the $2.5M will go for all the costs on a single state, and she wants more for the others.

Not the same.

[JonLP24]

18. I can't recall the timeline on this

As I never seen anything go viral so fast but she is very clear here on filing costs in addition fees for attorneys and poll watchers, now that she has enough for Wisconsin she can focus on the next state.

It wouldn't make sense to burn what she has now on filing fees with nothing left over for attorneys.

[pnwmom]

21. But why didn't she have her fund raising goal be her actual goal?

Instead of only having it be for one state and leading many of us to believe she'd file in all three if she got the $2.5M?

[Bavorskoami]

39. Oh for goodness sake!

She was clear from the beginning that the scope of the project would be adjusted to match the funds raised and that the total estimate to file and carry out a complete vote check in those three states would possibly be $6-7M.

It was also written that: "These recounts are part of an election integrity movement to attempt to shine a light on just how untrustworthy the U.S. election system is." Support of such things as verifiable paper ballots and publicly-owned, open source voting equipment was also mentioned. If this effort advances the cause for more transparent elections it will be money well spent.

It's hard to argue with making those goals, or do you think differently?

[NCTraveler]

37. Changed drastically. Nt

[KittyWampus]

46. She also has to PAY LAWYERS. 2.5 million was the filing fees for 3 states.

[octoberlib]

3. I believe it's 2 million per state but

not sure. First 2 million covers Wi and all of a sudden some Wisconsin counties are correcting voting "errors". Like the county that had more Trump ballots than actual voters. Saw a link on Twittter about an hour ago will try to find it.

[malaise]

4. More Groper Don the Con ballots than actual voters

WTF????

[octoberlib]

5. Yep. I'm still trying to find the

link. I think a lot of funny stuff went on, primarily in red states.

[octoberlib]

6. Here it is.

http://twitter.com/BryanDawsonUSA/status/801440499060142080 Sorry , I'm on my phone so it's easier to post a link.

[malaise]

9. Thanks octoberlib

Happy Thanksgiving

[octoberlib]

10. Happy Thanksgiving, Malaise!

[SickOfTheOnePct]

8. Initially in the unofficial count (from election night)

there were three precincts within one county and then another whole county, that had more Presidential votes total than ballots cast. When the counties did their post-election night canvassing, the errors were caught and corrected.

[Grey Lemercier]

7. Here are the filing fees and deadlines for each state:

Wisconsin: $1.1 million by Nov 25
Pennsylvania: $0.5 million by Nov 28
Michigan: $0.6 million by Nov 30
Those are filing fees alone. The costs associated with recounts are a function of state law. Attorney's fees are likely to be another $2-3 million, then there are the costs of the statewide recount observers in all three states. The total cost is likely to be $6-7 million.

https://jillstein.nationbuilder.com/recount

[oberliner]

12. "Attorney's fees are likely to be another 2-3 million"

Likely to be? Has she not spoken to any lawyers yet? Which ones is she planning to use? That's quite a large spread for what the fees would be. Will she itemize how the money she receives was spent?

[SickOfTheOnePct]

17. She probably has to

Based on the donation limits ($2700/person) it looks as though she's doing it as part of campaign fundraising; if so, she'll have to account for it.

She says on site that she can't guarantee recounts, only that she will demand them, and that any money not spent on recounts will go to voting integrity efforts.

[jmg257]

15. Man lots of attroneys will be having very happy holidays this year.

$ $

[EL34x4]

31. There's a lot of money to be made fleecing heartbroken voters...

...with the promise of a magical do-over button.

Orly Taitz ran this racket for quite some time during President Obama's first term.

[uncle ray]

20. she steps up to save our country and we complain about the price changing by a couple of million?

sigh.

i don't give a fuck who leads the effort or what it costs.

[pnwmom]

22. No, it will be tripling the amount in the end. And people donated thinking

they were donating for all three filings.

Getting only one state flipped won't change the outcome. All three states would have to flip for Hillary to win. And isn't that why most people are donating?

[uncle ray]

25. we don't know what it will take in the end any more than we knew who was going to win.

if we collectively are going to throw away a few million dollars, it might as well be on verifying the election results. the failure to do so will be much more costly to us. even if all 3 don't flip, if widespread fraud is found, the election is delegitimized.

[Adsos Letter]

53. This

[Bavorskoami]

34. It was clear 2.5 was for immediate needs filing costs only.

I knew I was donating for filing only and that there would be more costs down the road, for which I will gladly donate again.
This information available right on the fundraising page from the beginning.

[ananda]

23. Same here! It needs to be done, whatever the cost!

Period.

[NCTraveler]

38. That's not the direction of the question.

Stein has shown a level of mental bankruptcy that makes questioning her motives to be fare game. It's not the money, it's the drastic change in verbiage from yesterday to today. I'm of the opinion that a lot of people just got fleeced.

[Liberal In Texas]

24. I understood it last night.

The $2 million to $2.5 million was just to get Wisconsin in the bag.

If you scrolled down and looked at the rest of the post Michigan and Penn. were going to be more but not quite as much as Wisc. I don't think this is a scam, but it could have been a bit more clear.

[FarPoint]

26. All I have to say is....

Buyer Beware.. I don't trust her and we as Democrats are vulnerable to hope. ....

[womanofthehills]

43. So you would rather do nothing than something

[FarPoint]

52. On the contrary... indeed I want an audit...

Just nothing led or promoted by Jill Stein....the Election Spoiler candidate for self serving gains.. not by her or who paid her to be a spoiler.

[Statistical]

27. Total bait and switch. Initial post said 2.5M was the total inclusive cost of recount in all 3

If they raised less they would do a recount in 1 or 2 states. Now she hits ~$3M and it magically becomes $4.5M goal with potentially needing $6M or maybe $7M.

While she will probably do the recount she like most politicians is just exploiting events. She gets hundreds of thousands of donors she can contact in 2020 (yes you know she will be running again). The donations are being made to her election campaign account so any funds left over can be used for anything she wants ... including running for President yet again in four years.

[Bavorskoami]

30. Not true.

You only had to read a little further on her fund raising page. I'll repeat it here - again:

"Those are filing fees alone. The costs associated with recounts are a function of state law. Attorney's fees are likely to be another $2-3 million, then there are the costs of the statewide recount observers in all three states. The total cost is likely to be $6-7 million."

If you know of another organized effort to question the votes in these three states that is realistically going to have the money to file in Wisconsin on Friday and the other two states next week then give us the link. I'll donate to that one also.

[Statistical]

32. The page was updated after she hit 2.5M goal and the goal changed.

If she hits the $4.5M goal it will be changed to $6M and if she hits that it will be changed to $8M.

This is about Jill setting herself up for a run again in 2020. That being said we will get a recount out of it and that is good (if ultimately futile*) but I am not fooled by Jill's motives.


* If any cheating happened it was in electronic voting machines which have no paper trail. There is nothing to 'recount' except the machine total (which is already boosted).

[marybourg]

56. No, not true. I read exactly what was

posted by Bavorskoami by simply scrolling down and reading the entire page well before $2.5 mil. was reached.

I, too, would gladly contribute another small sum if someone else (you?) wants to petition for a re-count in a different way.

[Liberty Belle]

51. I believe 2.5 was for the FILING fees only

That states or counties charge for recounts outside a certain small margin of error.

The revised higher amount is for attorney fees. Having covered these issues in the past that's probably credible; these are large states and the Reps won't just roll over without every trick in the book.

If she doesn't use this money as promised she would lose support from people if she runs again.

But right now this seems the best chance to oust Trump, and instead of complaining that Stein is filing challenges that criticism might be better directed at the Clinton campaign for not standing up to challenge the election results, in which case such donations would be flowing to her Democratic campaign.

At the very least Stein has drawn national media attention to election integrity and the potential for electronic hacking. Some of the machines my reporting once helped get banned in California are among those she is now raising doubts about.

I am not convinced the hackers didn't fully cover their tracks, if indeed hacks occurred, but it's worth every shot to try and expose it wherever it's possible to do so, in my view.

[Bavorskoami]

28. She was clear from the beginning 2.5M was only to file in the three states

From the moment I first saw this yesterday her recount fundraising page was crystal clear that the original goat of $2,500,000 was for just for filing in the three states - the amount that was needed immediately to file in the next few days (Friday $1.1M in Wisconsin for example). From the start the notes explained this: "Those are filing fees alone. The costs associated with recounts are a function of state law. Attorney's fees are likely to be another $2-3 million, then there are the costs of the statewide recount observers in all three states. The total cost is likely to be $6-7 million."

We wanted Hillary to do this. She isn't doing it. Be glad it is being done.

I strongly urged my family and co-workers not to throw their vote away on the Greens or Libertarians. In this case I would strongly urge all to support any effort to expose the chaos and vulnerabilities in our voting systems.

[roamer65]

29. I suspect the goal here is to put the 46EV's into dispute.

That would force the decision into a Rethug H of R and they would then own it completely.

Very much like 1876.

[Statistical]

33. How would that help? Republican Congress would pick the Republican candidate.

Worst case scenario they impeach him later if necessary. Now way in hell Republican Congress is going to alienate Trump's base with midterms coming up in 2018. Not now with them controlling both houses and the oval office.

[KittyWampus]

47. Any Republican would be better than a mentally unfit Trump. And they'd pry Bannon out.

[Statistical]

50. Yeah but the Rethugs aren't going to alienate Trumps voters which gave them complete control

that just isn't going to happen. They will elect Trump to appease his voters. Worst case scenario if they need to they can always impeach him and put Pence in the big chair.

[edhopper]

35. She wants to expand to

NC and FLA.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

41. FL is done

Already certified. Plus, I don't think FL allows candidates to request recounts - they do an automatic recount if the margin .5% or less.

[edhopper]

44. my mistake

but I'll check about the other States. Also lawyer fees. I am not optimistic about the outcome, but feel the attempt is worth it. Even if it only gives Hillary a larger majority.

[Arazi]

40. No she's not that stupid. A maneuver like that would kill the Greens

in.the US forever. Whatever other motives she has, she does have true belief in her party

[CK_John]

42. Oh no; a candidate that lies. nt

[eleny]

45. I say - if that's what it takes, so be it

I don't blame JS for the system. I'm grateful that she's doing this. If just one state shows massive irregularities and it becomes a Clinton win in that state then it'll be worth the few bucks I chipped in. I'm ready to chip in again even after the 4.5M goal is reached.

I always imagined that this kind of thing was going to cost huge bucks. Not her fault. I wasn't a JS supporter but right now I only feel gratitude. If we don't help accomplish some recounts - we have nothing.

[KittyWampus]

48. I don't either. I have my opinion on 3rd party candidates but ultimately it's up to Democratic

candidates to get enough voters to the polls in enough districts and to SECURE THE ELECTIONS SYSTEMS.

[eleny]

49. The problem is that we have to overcome their fraud

It's hard to figure how much of a % that will be from one election cycle to another. 2 million more people voted for Clinton. We haven't been sitting back cooling our heels.

Anyway, I'm glad JS is doing this. If just one state gets flipped because of Republican machinations then it puts his presidency under a cloud. We need this given his agenda made clear by his Cabinet nominations so far and heaven help us his choice of advisors.

[Vinca]

54. I don't think so. I'm not a fan of hers, but if I felt at all responsible for the installation

of the orange blob as POTUS, I'd be trying whatever I could to try to nullify it. As a candidate, she has standing and if some kind of miracle happened, it would be better for Hillary is she wasn't the one contesting it.

[Omaha Steve]

55. It is too bad that Gore didn't have the from the net in 2000

We have much more info and places to donate in 2016.