Is their Humanity DEAD? "Washington Post finds minimal impact on his overall support"

[Divine Discontent]

[center]

“I moved on her like a bitch, but I couldn’t get there. And she was married.”
“I did try and fuck her. She was married.”
“Just kiss. I don’t even wait. And when you’re a star, they let you do it. You can do anything.”
“Grab them by the pussy. You can do anything.”

Nearly 7 in 10 respondents believe Trump probably made unwanted sexual advances, and a majority say his apology for boasts about forcing himself on women on a hot-mic videotape was insincere. Nonetheless, the controversy appeared to have had only a minimal impact on his overall support - Washington Post October 16th.

Overall, Clinton leads Trump by 47-43 percent among likely voters, a slight edge given the survey’s four-percentage-point error margin.

(A post-scandal female New Hampshire Trump supporter 10/15/2016, with an unknown opinion of comments above)

I am ashamed for these roughly 43% of Americans who still support giving massive power to him, despite many of them believing he made unwanted sexual advances on women. Add to that all of these women coming out from all around the country accusing him, and Donald mocking their looks as a reason as to why he wouldn't have been into groping them? Are we in an alternate universe where millions of Republican women STILL support a guy like THAT?

Party before decency? Are you FUCKING kiddin' me?

I want to wave my hand in front of their eyes and ask them if they're coherent, or are they so stunned by all the crap they've been fed for years on AM-hate Radio, Fox News & at Donald's sickening rallies that their humanity is DEAD!

[beachbum bob]

1. nothing will change the mind of a trump zealot....its the other voters he can't win

and you never make a determination based on a single poll...hillary's lead will not be overcome as long as democrats GOTV

[malaise]

2. Yes indeed the party of family values and evangelicals

stands by their man. Rules apply to everyone else. It was no different with Vitter, Ensign, Hastert et al.

[treestar]

14. they can no longer claim they represent old fashioned family values

any one of them from now on, if they voted for Don the Con, I will tell them that their family values are BS.

[malaise]

18. They never represented old fashioned family values

That is one of the biggest ReTHUG cons

[Orrex]

3. I walk several miles each night through my small town in western PA

Two weeks ago I could easily see dozens of Trump signs posted throughout my route, interspersed with "Hillary for Prison 2016" signs.

In the past week or so I've seen about 8 new ones added.


His supporters will not abandon him no matter how monstrous and vile he is shown to be.

[Dash Riprock]

41. I also live in Western Pennsylvania

and I noticed the same thing. Many more Trump signs after those tapes were released.

[MBS]

4. If people were awake, the polls would be about 85 Clinton-14 Trump

Every time I see the 538 election predictions (currently about 85% chance for Hillary, about 14% for Trump), followed by popular vote predictions of 49-42 (or worse, as you said), I think: Wait. In a sane world, the POPULAR vote should be 85-14 , not 49-42. Who are those 42%?

I could imagine 10, even 15% of people in this country as die-hard Trump supporters/white supremacist/NRA die-hard/take-over-the-federal lands/deplorables.
But 42-43%?? WHAT? Has this country forgotten what democracy is? what this country stands for? Why it was founded?

Also, how could any reasonable person even be undecided, much less vote for Trump?
On PBS Newshour last Friday, they interviewed some women in North Carolina who were "wrestling" with their decision. What is there to wrestle with? One of the women was a psychological therapist who, "as the owner of a small business", liked Trump's "economic policies." (But surely, given her profession, she could see the dangers posed by his warped personhood?)

And on NPR this weekend I heard a woman in ?Nebraska?Colorado? I forget - someone engaged in her community, as farm wife, elementary school teacher, school board member, etc, etc- who, at the beginning, seemed to be sensible enough to be able to see who Trump is, but then said she would vote for Trump because of guns and immigration.


Oh yeah, and don't get me started on those alleged 20-somethings who see Trump and Hillary as equally bad, and then would opt for Johnson or Stein instead. . .


I'm even more worried about Trump supporters (and anyone else, including third-party-voters, who can't see, or won't see, how and why Trump is the worst and most dangerous candidate ever nominated) than I am about Trump.

Both Trump AND his supporters (and third-party-enablers) pose a clear and imminent danger to the Republic.

I've never been so terrified about the future of my country.

[Divine Discontent]

37. +1!

[pampango]

5. His base ain't going anywhere. "I could shoot somebody and not lose voters." He's right.

If he can get away with murder, it is not surprising that he could get away with groping.

[Proud Public Servant]

6. They hate Hillary. They hate the media.

And they see all of this as the media assaulting Trump on behalf of Hillary -- confirming the rightness of their opinions and redoubling their support of the anti-Hillary, anti-media candidate. It's the political equivalent of a Chinese finger trap.

[Elmergantry]

7. Why does this surprise anyone?

Did the sexual accusations (Broderick,Jones, Lewinsky and (lying about it under oath)) doom Clinton?

Did not the we Dems stand by Clinton?

Why would you expect the Trumpers to do any different?

[edhopper]

9. You are really

equating the two?

[Elmergantry]

11. I dont see much difference

Both were accused of sexual improprieties were they not?

Both parties are "standing by their man" are they not?

[Orrex]

25. Clinton endured a $40+ million dollar fishing expedition

Do you truly believe that Ken Starr suppressed or overlooked information that would have helped his prosecution? Really?

On the other hand, Starr recently resigned from Baylor University for his part in massive failure to investigate on-campus sexual assaults, so maybe you're onto something...

[bettyellen]

29. Most people do. Lewinsky sought out an liaison. Others were debunked. So nope.

I don't think he assaulted anyone. Broderick's claims of threats from HRC amounted to she said "thank you".

[SammyWinstonJack]

16. Hardly the same.

[kimbutgar]

28. Ken Starr could not find enough evidence that it was rape but consenual with these 3

This false equivalence has been debunked.

[Divine Discontent]

36. +1

and, regardless, it's wrong of people to tie her fate and blame her for his indescretions, which are NOT what Donald admitted on the video.

[Elmergantry]

43. Has anyone found enough evidence

that Trump is guilty of his assaults? No. - - No one is even investigating. So absent any evidence, why would you expect Trump supporters to feel other than what Clinton supporters felt? As far as they are concerned, its he said she said, and that is a worth as much as a bucket of warm spit.

[kimbutgar]

44. But Bill Clinton's never bragged on tape that he likes to grab women's pu$$y or kiss them against

Their wishes.

So I think there is some perverted thing about Cheeto more than Bill Clinton. And who has two ex wives?

[Nevernose]

40. Broaderick & Willey also swore under oath it was consensual

Under penalty of perjury. In Wiley's case, she swore nothing at all happened. Paula Jones was a he said/she said situation, one in which the man involved had never bragged about sexually assaulting people. There's no REASON to give Trump the benefit of the doubt, because he's already admitted to sexually assaulting multiple women. Now it's just a matter of figuring out who he assaulted.

You're right, though: I'm definitely not going to vote for Bill again.

[Foggyhill]

38. They weren't the same, were investigated to death and mostly were a tissue of lies

Not only that, but there.were no declaration that Clinton had anything other than consensual affairs beforehand

So false equivalence

[loyalsister]

39. That's a fair point

Supporters demonized the women and cried victim.

The behaviors and acts were different, but the nature of the support for both men was driven by rape culture.

Mirrors sometimes make us uncomfortable, but the similarities are important because they reveal something much deeper. Both are defenses that permit sexual harrassment and assault to continue at these level.

[edhopper]

8. But, but, but....

EMAILS!!!

What about EMAILS!!!

Isn't that worse than rape?


Morons.

[Divine Discontent]

35. ed, that's what I keep hearing...

they think repeating that to me is gonna make me change my vote... The other current argument is that Bill Clinton is just as bad. Uh, no, no folks, he's not!

[UtahJosh]

10. The beautiful thing is, it's gonna cost 'em bigly.

And for decades to come.

Every time one of those troglodytes tries to invoke "family values" in ANY debate, the easy answer will be right there for us all. "So you were against Trump, right?"

They threw the baby out with the bathwater on this one, and exposed their hypocrisy for all to see. Let's make sure they *never* forget it.

[treestar]

15. Absolutely

well put.

[vercetti2021]

12. Price to pay though

The next generation of voting is soon and they'll remember this. The Republican party is going to have a bitch of a time getting that generation.

[Saboburns]

13. Why yes, yes it is dead

Did you not know this??

[Divine Discontent]

34. Like Fox Mulder, I want to believe.... that 4/10 aren't goose steppers, but they are

I have voted out of my party before for lesser video admissions. So, it's stunning. Nonetheless, she'll trounce him in the Electoral College!

[Mme. Defarge]

17. 43 percent?!

That's an argument for more immigration if there ever was one.

[AngryAmish]

19. They have to go.

[Igel]

20. Saw campaign flyer stuck to my front door a few days ago.

Mostly minority neighborhood.

It was for Clinton. Well, Clinton's name was on it and it said to vote for Clinton, but the big selling point was that she wasn't Trump.

Often it's easier to get people to vote against somebody than for somebody.

I read something recently that sort of provides a rationale for a lot of truly abysmal behavior I've seen in the last 20 years--justifying hate, grievance, resentment, bigotry, and more than a reasonable about of anger and belligerence. It's a bad rationale, in no way anything I think of as justification for any of that. And most of it's been on the left, with a resurgence of it into the national spotlight in the last year on the part of the right (weaker than but similar in some sense to the Xian Right of the late '70s and early '80s--and in spite of the attempt to cast this as a '80s phenomenon through ignorance-based silence, the Xian Right has its roots in the mid '70s).

""To those who are committed to a religious life, the existence of a crisis makes observance even more necessary. It is vital to retain the forms of observance and worship that have signified continuity with the past and that protect against discontinuity. Maintaining one's way of life under hostile attack serves also to sustain one's self esteem, which is always at risk under pressure."
Ostow, Mortimer. 1980. "The Jewish Response to Crisis." Conservative Judaism 33:3-25 quoted in Bokser, Baruch M. 1984, 2002. The Origins of the Seder: the Passover Rite and Early Rabbinic Judaism. Jewish Theological Seminary Press, New York.

This gives motive to a lot of what's happened as overt racism has diminished and threatened what used to be relatively well-defined communities. "Attack" doesn't have to be overt; two cultures living in juxtaposition always will influence each other and, unless there's some bright line that prevents merging, will merge. One will be lost and leave a vestige behind or the result will be an amalgamation. (To the species, the difference makes absolutely no difference except to the extent it leads to lower survival fitness. To individuals who insist on maintaining their group identity, whether because they hate others or find their identity and prestige vicariously in their culture or just can't handle change, it's more important when threatened to be given space, to be given authority to continue in one's cultural observances and outlooks, and to maintain continuity.

We "get it" with African-American culture, even if it does lead to separatist innovations like Kwanzaa, Malcolm X's idiotic "Islam is better because Xianity is the religion of slavers" (when Islam was the religion of slavers who enslaved more blacks than Europe did, and then castrated the males), and hate groups like the NBP. We don't have empathy for those outside out groups, which is when we claim empathy is most important for the other side to have.

Clinton is perceived as a threat by those supporting Trump. Rightly or wrongly, that's the perception, and just a lot of progressives only hear Trump through progressive organs and sources, so Trumpists only hear Clinton through their sources of choice. However, she's done little to argue against this, at least little that I've seen. The best she's done is to argue that Trump's a bigger threat to this group, then to that group, then to this a group over here. Unity against is always weaker than unity for, and unity against is usually more short lived than unity for but after 60 years of arguing that identity and separatism and narrow-self-interest is good and is the common good (ours, at least), there's not much unity for things left. Just unity for getting things; "if it doesn't help me, I'm uninterested, but if it doesn't hurt me, then do what you want" is about where most younger Americans are, with some already to "if it doesn't help me, I'm pretty much uninterested, but remember--it hurts me if it makes it less likely that you'll help me." In other words, it's taken 60 years to flip JFK's slogan on its head and get to "Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you."

[smirkymonkey]

21. Hypocrites and Idiots.

That is who they are.

[erinlough]

22. It hurts to think 43% of my friends, neighbors and co workers are these people.

But upon reflection the number is not that high. The 43% is of likely voters, which could be as low as 50% of the population. That is still far too many, but it helps...

[Divine Discontent]

33. Yes, it is sad to realize a good chunk of society is so corrupted by whatever is feeding them

such horseshit, that they'd still back someone who said what Donald said, and in the manner he said it. I do not buy the false equivalence that Donald and Bill's issue are the same as several have stated in person to me, or I've read here.

[Denzil_DC]

23. Circling the wagons.

It's not an unusual effect for those allied to any party or political figure in the face of what's perceived as a partisan political attack, and it's been borne out by research in the past.

But anyway, take this poll with a pinch of salt, like all others. Trump needs to get more than his base to turn out in any case.

[stone space]

26. The Trumplicking gunhumpers at the NRA are still standing behind their candidate. (nt)

[shenmue]

27. Yes, it is

[Divine Discontent]

32. TY, to the point. Sadly true, they simply block out believe what they're told & ignore Don's probs

[mreilly]

30. This is the right-wing brainwashing pay dividends

... these people have been conditioned to believe no matter what Trump does, Hillary will always be worse. And no matter how bad a Trump presidency might be (some even admit it will be bad!) Hillary will "always be worse."

It simply doesn't matter that the facts confirm she didn't murder Vince Foster, she and Bill LOST money in Whitewater, they weren't dealing drugs, Hillary NEVER laughed at getting a rapist off, she was cleared of all criminal wrongdoing over Benghazi/the email server, she apologized and took responsibility for the same stupid email server issue (which Trump supporters scream is worse than him being a pedophile rapist), and the Clinton Foundation NEVER accepted money for favors in a pay for play scenario.

Remember, these are the same folks who spent 8 years moaning Obama was a socialist Muslim born in Kenya who wanted to implement Sharia Law, supported terrorists and was ruining the country. They demanded he produce his birth certificate. He did. They declared it a fake.

Conversely, it doesn't matter Trump is a serial sexual assaulter, shitty businessman, peddler of impossible pipe dreams, and all around scumbag. They "just know" he will make America great again. And if he can't or won't and spends the next four years starting wars, torching the economy, promoting rioting in the streets and pissing off the rest of the planet, well, it's not his fault. It's always someone else's fault. Never theirs.

They "just know" what they want to believe. Anyone who tries to convince them otherwise is "part of the conspiracy." That's the right-wing brainwashing paying dividends as I said.

People who live in reality rejected their nonsense and that's why they're going to lose the election. They'll squawk about stolen elections and other bullshit but it won't matter. They'll be kicked to the curb with their trash candidate and the beauty - and irony - of their brainwashing is they'll NEVER wake up and formulate a strategy to get them anywhere, such as picking a decent, moderate and intelligent Republican to nominate in 2020. No, they'll manage to find an even bigger asshole than Trump. Now that's an accomplishment!

[Divine Discontent]

31. Fantastic answer, thank you. n/t

[Nevernose]

42. +1

Their candidates, in general, really do seem to get crazier every year, don't they?