The Idea That Women Use Guns For Self-Defense Against Men Is A Big Lie

[onehandle]

If you listen to the National Rifle Association, every woman in America should carry a gun so she can protect herself from dangerous strangers, domestic abusers and potential rapists. The message is that firearms make women safer, despite clear research showing that they actually have the exact opposite effect.

A new study from the Violence Policy Center should dispel this myth once and for all.

On Tuesday, the center released “When Men Murder Women,” an annual report that analyzes incidents in which one man kills one woman (often a sign of domestic violence homicide), and ranks states on the rate of women murdered by men.

The report found that in 2014, over 1,600 women were killed by men. The most common weapon used was a gun. During that same time period, there were only 15 instances of women using firearms to kill a man in self-defense.

Let that sink in. Fifteen.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/men-murder-women-guns_us_57e14c0ce4b08cb14097f8b4?section=&

[hunter]

1. Years ago, an ex-neighbor of ours shot her boyfriend in the leg with his own gun.

I suspect she was aiming for his crotch.

When I came out of my house, planning to run some errands, a big firetruck and police cars were blocking the street. All the police and paramedics were shielded behind the firetruck, the paramedics tending to the naked boyfriend's wound. A policeman frantically waved his arms at me, directing me back into my house

I think everyone was afraid she'd come out shooting, a suicide-by-cop sort of thing, but they got her on the phone and she eventually surrendered peacefully.

Most gun stories are simply sad and stupid like that, even the pumped up stories gun fetishists like to cite.

Hollywood gun justice, "good guys" shooting "bad guys," is fantasy.

[hack89]

2. Why are you ignoring the two other results of using a gun for self defense?

besides killing someone, one can just wound them. Or you don't shoot at all but deter the attack by threatening them with a gun.

You op is disingenuous and intellectually dishonest.

[gratuitous]

3. Okay, what are the revised numbers?

In 2014, 1,600 women were killed by men and women shot and killed 15 men in self-defense.

What are the numbers for women wounded or otherwise deterred from living their lives by men, and the number of men shot at, wounded or deterred by women with guns? Still running about 100 to 1? More? Less?

As long as we're being all ingenuous and intellectually honest, that is.

[hack89]

6. Lets ask the OP

he is the one pushing an agenda. Surely he has given it the appropriate attention to detail.

[gratuitous]

9. You're the one who brought it up

Look, if you don't know, just say so. But if you're going to introduce a whole new level of statistical analysis, then what are your numbers? The original report had some decent, quantitative numbers: That is, the number of deaths of women at the hands of men, and the number of deaths of men by women in self-defense.

What is your methodology to determine when someone uses a gun to deter an attack, and when a person brandishes a gun as a threat to someone who wasn't contemplating an attack? If you don't have numbers to back up your specious counterfactual, it would appear that the person pushing an agenda isn't the original poster.

[hack89]

12. I asked a question.

doesn't that usually mean I don't know the answer?

The CDC reports DGUs numbers range from 500,00 to 3 million every year (depending which study you use). Which means that DGUs resulting in death are extremely rare while the other two results are the norm. Which means that it is not unlikely that the number of DGUs by women that do not result in death exceeds 1600.

[hack89]

7. Here's what the CDC had to say about defensive gun use

The Institute of Medicine and the National Research Council released the results of their research through the CDC last month. Researchers compiled data from previous studies in order to guide future research on gun violence, noting that “almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million per year.”

And why do you think that ratio is constant? The CDC numbers make it clear that killing someone is a very rare outcome for DGU.

[duncang]

13. My daughter is part owner and manager of a business.

They rotate shifts and every week she will be the only one at her place of business on different days. She has to do a final cleanup, cash out the registers, shut down the lights, and lock up. Sometimes it will be after 3:00 am. They park their cars away from the business in the parking lot so customers will have the close spots. She could give up her part in the business and change jobs. But this has been her dream. She does carry a gun. The article does makes it sound there is no possible reason for a woman to have a gun.


So to add to your post. I agree the article was one sided.

[sarisataka]

15. Using VPC stats

from other "studies" 99.5% of defensive gun uses do not result in a fatality. Studies from other groups indicate that number is low. Hence the desire to only highlight and compare homicides, thus eliminating inconvenient cases of successful self-defense.

[ileus]

4. My wife took over my LCP, and now her 642 sit's in the safe.

I'm pretty upset because the LCP was my pocket gun of choice, but now it's hers.

She did say I could replace it with a new LCP custom.


Personally I've only had two friends that killed their wife with a firearm. One is serving life, the other is worm food.

[LisaL]

5. Only two friends who killed their wives?

All righty then.

[Ilsa]

14. I can't help but wonder if both women would still be alive

if the murderers had limited access to a firearm.

[Skittles]

20. that about says it all

[kcr]

10. Only two? You don't say n/t

[Skittles]

21. they're just women, you know

[Eleanors38]

8. VPC? Is that the outfit what wanted to ban all handguns? They still pushing that in public?

[sarisataka]

16. Yes, that is the same group

which has never repudiated their goal of complete bans.
http://www.nytimes.com/1999/11/04/opinion/laws-that-can-t-stop-a-bullet.html?_r=0
In this piece the current Executive Director of the VPC spells out how expanded background checks, licensing, registration, trigger locks, smart guns... all the things they currently lobby for, are insufficient; only complete bans will reduce gun violence.
(funny that we repeatedly are told NO ONE wants to ban guns)

[Eleanors38]

11. I favor letting intelligent, responsible women choose their method of self-defense. nt

[Lee-Lee]

17. Only an idiot or someone intent on misleading would only cite cases where the man was killed

and act like every case of self-defense ends up with the attacker dead.

The vast majority of times guns are used for self defense the gun in not fired, and in most cases of self defense where it is fired the attacker is not killed.

This whole article is garbage that starts with a flawed argument and just devolves from there. But quite often gun prohibitionists misrepresent self defense statistics by only counting cases where the attacker is killed as valid, intentionally not counting the vast, vast majority of cases where a gun is used and death doesn't result.

I am a woman. I used a gun to defend myself against a man with a knife. He didn't die, in fact he ran when the gun was presented- so to the author of this garbage my story isn't a valid case of self defense.

[Kang Colby]

18. Nice try.

As others have pointed out, most self defense gun use is non-fatal.

[onehandle]

19. Odd. This thread keeps getting bumped for many hours, and yet I cannot see how.

Invisible helpers, thank you for your support.

[friendly_iconoclast]

22. You *could* see how, if you unblocked those who post inconvenient (for you, that is) truths...

[jmg257]

23. Interesting that just over half of women murdered are killed with a gun.

"Nationwide {2014}, for homicides in which the weapon used could be identified, 54 percent of female victims were shot and killed with a gun."

From the article, I thought that % would be higher, cause it means 46% of the women murdered are NOT killed with a gun.

I wonder how many of those guns used (69% were handguns) were actually the victim's carry weapon?



Some good news: "During {the past 19 years}, nationwide the rate of women murdered by men in single victim/single offender incidents has dropped 31 percent — from 1.57 per 100,000 in 1996 to 1.08 per 100,000 in 2014."

Which is weird too, as the number of guns climbs ever higher, and the percentage of women owners increases.

"the proportion of female gun owners is increasing as fewer men own guns. These women were more likely to own a gun for self-defense than men, and more likely to own a handgun only."

From Harvard/Northeastern Survey...https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/sep/19/us-gun-ownership-survey