Egyptian and German beach volleyball players highlight the massive cultural divide between Western a

[IronLionZion]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3728996/The-contrasting-cultures-brought-Olympics-Perfectly-timed-photograph-showing-Egyptian-German-volleyball-players-highlights-divide-teams.html?ito=social-elitedaily

It is a fast and furious sport played under the sun and famed for its revealing attire - with a practical uniform of bikinis for women and board shorts for men.

But these pictures show the contrasting cultures among some of the nations taking part in the Rio Olympics after the Egyptian women's beach volleyball team took to the sandy arena wearing long sleeves and leggings.

The outfit, used by Nada Meawad and Doaa Elghobashy, who also covered her head with a hijab, was in stark contrast to their German rivals Laura Ludwig and Kira Walkenhorst who stuck to the sport's traditional two-piece outfit for the clash last night.

They seem to do well enough with the coverings. It must be hot though. But they won't get sunburned. It puts some things into perspective. There's video and more pics at the link.

[MineralMan]

1. High school girls volleyball team - 1963

[Hortensis]

5. I wasn't in high school in '63, but that looks a LOT like

my gym uniform in junior high. I had bangs and a teased shoulder-length flip that I fussed over every morning to achieve the perfect bouffant top, which was then sprayed enough that it could survive the daily mile run around the track. Rather of like Callista Gingrich's carapace, probably, but we knew it looked goood.


The Egyptian team wear strikes me as a lot more dignified, and as said no sand where it really doesn't belong. Bet that outfit wouldn't be allowed in Iran, though, for yet another major culture gap. Or girls-girls-girls! beach volleyball shows in anything at all probably.

[Warren DeMontague]

27. goils were goils and men were men

mistah, we could use a man loike hoiboit hooveah again

[opiate69]

93. ..

[Warren DeMontague]

98. And now it's stuck in your head, isnt it.

[opiate69]

99. Has been all day now, damn you!!!

I had to watch it, to excorcise it lol

[Warren DeMontague]

100. I totally didn't understand that show, growing up.

I didn't get the context; I was like "this guy is a total dick! Why would I want to watch this?"

[opiate69]

102. That was my wife's reaction when I watched an episode or two with her.

She's like 7 years younger than me, so she missed it back when... I liked it as a kid, although I probably didn't fully understand the social messaging either. I pretty much knew Archie was wrong, but was too young to grok how deep Lear was mining, as it were.

[TexasMommaWithAHat]

40. The uniforms are sexist, imo.

Both of them!

One is much too covered up, and the other doesn't need to be so bare. After all, the men don't walk around with their butt cheeks showing and their crack occasionally exposed.

But...that's just my personal opinion.

[Bucky]

84. all sports should go back to the original Greek rules: nude events only

except for Olympic jello wrestling, obviously

[lillypaddle]

107. Cool pic! nt

[uppityperson]

2. I like the covered look, or at least the bottoms means less sand in your nether bits.

[jberryhill]

32. I'd think there would be fewer abrasions

[Xithras]

71. Sand is actually the reason they wear bikinis.

In beach volleyball, sand is going to get under your clothes no matter what, but the rules don't allow the game to be stopped or paused because a player needs to "shake sand out". Players wearing long clothing are often forced to play large portions of the game with considerable amounts of sand in their clothing, causing discomfort and abrasions. This is particularly a problem for women, as that sand will often migrate into their "nether bits".

Bikinis provide three primary advantages for women. First, beach volleyball bikinis fit very tightly, keeping more sand out. Second, when sand does get under them, their small size means that the sand usually works its way back out relatively quickly. Third, when sand is "stubborn", their small size allows the sand to be removed discretely and quickly.

Now, I know what the two primary comeback are going to be: 1) If bikinis are so great, why don't men wear them? And 2) Couldn't a woman just wear bikini underwear under a pair of shorts to accomplish the same thing?

And the answers: 1) Because there is a mountain of difference between a sandy penis and a sandy vagina. One is mildly irritating. The other can be painful or even harmful. 2) Yes, she could. But she now has multiple layers of clothes to trap sand, is hotter and heavier because she's carrying more weight on her body. Most male beach volleyball players go commando under their shorts for this very reason, but that option isn't available to women worried about sandy vaginas.

Source: Niece played volleyball for SDSU and just went on a Facebook rant against my mom, who was complaining about the "unseemly" bikinis they wear in the sport. My niece also pointed out that beach volleyball is a beach game by its very nature, and that most people who play it prefer to do it wearing normal beachwear. They don't want to wear a "uniform". Beachwear, to modern and fit young adults, usually means bikinis and board shorts anyway in the western world.

[Bucky]

85. that sounds dangerous actually

too much friction and those women could saw themselves in half

[lillypaddle]

108. Bucky

[uppityperson]

117. I am watching Canada vs USA and the Canadians have long leggings and short sleeved

shirts. The USA women have looking sleeved tops and bikini bottoms.

I understand there has been a wide variety in the outfits which leads me to wonder again about all this.

[No Vested Interest]

3. Could there be a "happy medium"?

Or is it "all or nothing"?

[former9thward]

24. A "happy medium" between woman who are oppressed and those who are not?

No, there isn't.

[choie]

57. Which one is oppressed?

The one who has to be covered up or the one that had to wear a bikini? Answer? Both! In different ways....

[Person 2713]

58. Good ?

[Nuclear Unicorn]

63. The German player was forced to wear her uniform?

[Ex Lurker]

68. The women have a choice of uniforms

most chose to wear bikinis. No oppression there.

[scscholar]

76. But did they of their own free will?

I'm sure an American would be fired from the team because of the lost ad revenue if they decided to not give in to the pressure.

[PersonNumber503602]

78. Has that ever happened, or is that just an assumption you're making?

If it hasn't happened or threatened, then it cannot be accepted as fact just because you (or me, or anyone) thinks it may possibly happen.

[Crunchy Frog]

61. Between different styles of beach volleyball attire.

I'm pretty sure is what they meant.

[No Vested Interest]

73. You are correct! nt

[Warren DeMontague]

25. Yeah, the happy medium is that people who get outraged by exposed skin

change the channel to the Pat Robertson channel or some shit.

[uppityperson]

38. I'd prefer them given the choice of what to wear vs dictating for men's sensibilities

Which too often the mostly covered AND the mostly uncovered is.

Let them chose. That's the happy medium.

[Warren DeMontague]

43. Unless I'm mistaken, they do have the choice.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=8082016

specifically addressing the question of the volleyball players, that is. But I admit I'm not an expert on Olympic Volleyball.


But on the larger issue, no one is more committed to the principle of individual consenting adults making their own personal decisions, than I am.

What seems to bug some people though, is that some consenting adults DO choose to do things like take off their clothes in front of a camera, etc.

[uppityperson]

44. Huh. Here's what a quick search gives me...new guidelines.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beach_volleyball#Uniform_controversy

In 1999, the FIVB standardized beach volleyball uniforms, with the swimsuit becoming the required uniform both for men and women.[19] This drew the ire of some athletes.[20]

According to FIVB rules, female beach volleyball players have the option of playing in shorts or a one-piece swimsuit.[21][22] Most players, however, prefer the two-piece bikini.[23]

Competitors such as Natalie Cook[24] and Holly McPeak[23] have confirmed the FIVB's claims that the uniforms are practical for a sport played on sand during the heat of summer, but British Olympian Denise Johns claimed that the regulation uniform is intended to be "sexy" and to draw attention.[25]

(clip)
In early 2012, the International Volleyball Federation announced it would allow shorts (maximum length 3 cm (1.2 in) above the knee) and sleeved tops at the London 2012 Olympics. Richard Baker, the federation spokesperson, said that "many of these countries have religious and cultural requirements so the uniform needed to be more flexible".[27] And in fact the weather was so cold for the evening games at London 2012 that the players sometimes had to wear shirts and leggings.[28]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/olympics/82926043/Evolution-of-womens-beach-volleyball-uniforms

If you were a female beach volleyball player pre-2012 you could wear a one-piece bathing suit or a bikini with a maximum side width of 7cm (yes, it was that specific. And that small).

The rules stated competitors could also wear full body suits could also be used under the bikini in cold weather, something that was rarely done.

Now, there are three extra choices. Players can wear shorts of a maximum length of 3cm above the knee with sleeved or sleeveless tops or a full body suit.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/28/olympic-volleyball-uniform_n_1385879.html

There aren’t many “sexy” sports in the Summer Olympics (unless you consider sweating sexy, in which case the Summer Olympics are your dream come true). But beach volleyball has long been cheered — and jeered — for its skimpy uniforms, the teeny bikinis worn by tanned, toned players such as Misty May-Treanor and Kerri Walsh much to the delight of many viewers.

But the days of mandatory bikinis are over, says the International Volleyball Federation. According to newly adopted rules, female competitors in Olympic volleyball will be permitted to wear shorts and sleeved tops out of respect for the cultural beliefs of some participating countries.

“Many of these countries have religious and cultural requirements, so the uniform needed to be more flexible,” said International Volleyball Federation spokesman Richard Baker to The Associated Press.

According to the Telegraph, the new guidelines permit “shorts of a maximum length of three centimeters (1.18 inches) above the knee, and sleeved or sleeveless tops.”
(clip)

But there have been those who find the revealing uniforms offensive. The Australian Sports Commission, part of the Australian government, published a fact sheet on “sexploitation” in sports, stating in no uncertain terms:

Women’s beach volleyball, on the other hand, has introduced uniforms intentionally to focus attention on the athletes’ bodies rather than for any technological, practical or performance-enhancing reasons. Women must compete in bra-style tops and bikini bottoms that must not exceed six centimetres in width at the hip (men compete in shorts and singlets).

I don't care what they chose to wear, but it should be their choice. I dislike feeling people have to wear something because it is expected of them, no matter the gender or genderlessness of the person and societal expectations.

[Warren DeMontague]

48. I agree 100% with your last sentence.

I'm pro-choice.

[GulfCoast66]

53. obviously they can choose

I just saw the photos.

I personally choose the Bikini

But I am an overweight, middle age man. I guarantee you would want me covered up!

[La Lioness Priyanka]

70. lol

i think the happy medium is personal to each woman

[No Vested Interest]

72. Agree. And apparently these women may agree as well. nt

[La Lioness Priyanka]

74. as long as we are free to wear what we want to, and are not threatened by violence for it

i really dont care if someone chooses to be a hijabi or walk around in a bikini all day.

[No Vested Interest]

75. You're correct that no woman - or person- should be subject to violence

for their choice of clothing. And we know that in some places violence can ensue when clothing is contrary to local customs.
Clothing is immaterial in the big picture. (Pun- "immaterial"?)

When I wrote of "happy medium", I'm thinking all women would not be as comfortable in a revealing outfit. I'm thinking of a less athletic, older physique, such as this (me) senior woman has.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

77. i think there are many styles of athletic clothing that are not bikinis. but most women athletes in

the olympics are in peak shape, so they are probably comfortable wearing whatever.

[eissa]

4. Well, we all know which one would be asking for it if she were assaulted

I've argued against these coverings with Muslim women for so long, and each time they try to place a new spin on it, it aggravates me even further. No, this is not a sign of "feminism," not when its root reasoning -- that women are natural temptresses -- is designed to prevent men from sinning. You know what men can do to prevent themselves from sinning? Not sin. You know, take some personal responsibility instead of forcing half your population to hide away (which, as we all know, doesn't work anyway.)

Women who justify having their clothing dictated, or that donning the mandated covering is "empowering" have Stockholm Syndrome. Sorry/not sorry.

[Hortensis]

6. That woman's woman's body is actually quite exposed.

As I was thinking above, this would probably not be allowed in stricter Muslim societies, but in Egypt women can obviously play beach volleyball if they choose.

[IronLionZion]

11. I'm impressed that a Muslim country has a women's beach volleyball team

that's a sign of progress for Egypt, maybe.

[Hortensis]

13. I was surprised. A girl we know is heading for

college soon on either a volleyball or basketball scholarship, forgot to ask which she chose. It never occurred to me one of her meets could be in Egypt.

[IronLionZion]

15. Yup, they have basketball there too

the world is getting smaller

[Hortensis]

17. Nice.

[EL34x4]

39. Progress? No.

Actually, I'm surprised that Egypt still has a women's volleyball team.

Sadly, once secular Egypt is rapidly sliding towards rigid theocracy. The days of women's volleyball are probably numbered.

[IronLionZion]

10. Choice is empowering

I personally knew a few Muslim women in America who didn't wear it before, but started recently as an F U to the Muslim haters.

On the flip side, I wonder if bikinis are required for western women in beach volleyball or if they can choose other options if they want.

Men's beach volleyball:

[eissa]

19. I have no problem if it's an F U or a political statement

but don't delude yourself and others into making it some "feminist" statement about "empowerment." That'll just get a massive eye roll from most women, and a hearty laugh from Muslim clerics, who really don't give two shits what reason women give for wearing that oppressive garb as long as they wear it.

[mwrguy]

23. choosing hijab is much more empowering

than being expected to be eye candy for men.

[cwydro]

52. "choosing hijab"?

Do you know that many women do not have choice in those societies?

[Quantess]

60. Yes, it's very empowering to not be called a whore for exposing your hair.

Those are the cultural expectations. It's that slutty, eye-candy hair that drives men to ruin.

[leftynyc]

112. In the US it MAY be a choice

but let's not kid ourselves that the VAST majority of women in Muslim countries have that choice to make - unless the argument is they're choosing not to get beaten in the streets or arrested.

[Marr]

115. Who do you think you're fooling with that chauvenistic garbage?

"Choosing hijab", my ass.

You only prove that you don't actually give half a shit about womens' rights with comments like that. You shrug off the fact that it's not an option for them.

[Warren DeMontague]

34. According to the other thread, the bikinis are optional.

[haele]

7. Luckily it's winter in Brazil.

Otherwise, even with a very breathable fabric, it will get hot very hot very quickly wearing one of those outfits.

Haele

[Mosby]

8. highs in the low 80s, but high humidity.

[forgotmylogin]

29. I'd bet they know what they're doing.

As far as fabric that is breathe able. I'd guess they are used to extreme temperatures in Egypt and may in fact be chilly if it's winter there and 60-70 degrees. (Not sure how Brazilian winter is)

[LeftyMom]

33. It's kinda on the warm side in Egypt, you know.

[MFM008]

9. I would have risked

Short sleeves at least.

[mwrguy]

12. Those Egyptian uniforms are classy

And also look more functional than the western eye-candy pandering outfits.

Give it 20 years and Germany will adopt the Egyptian's outfits.

[tritsofme]

20. Do you really suppose it'll take 20 years?

The way things are going over there, I was thinking 10, maybe 15 years tops.

[mwrguy]

22. You are probably right

[EllieBC]

54. Adopt by choice?

Last edited Tue Aug 9, 2016, 08:03 PM - Edit history (1)

Or by force?

And you think German women who have enjoyed choice of dress will go willingly along with your plan to force them to cover?

[Rustyeye77]

89. At this rate,

they'll probably have no choice under sharia law.

[DFW]

97. Not unless all you watch is Fox Noise

I live in Germany, married to a German. What's going on in Germany right now is that more and more of the immigrants from Islamic countries are in conflict with their daughters, most of whom want to live and dress more like the German women that are teaching them how to blend in to their new home. The Germans aren't going to let Sharia law rule Germany any more than Floridians let Cuban law govern Miami.

[Marengo]

62. Why will Germany adopt those outfits in 20 years?

[Grey Lemercier]

81. they will never wear those hideous tools of bondage

[Grey Lemercier]

79. ridiculous statement

there is nothing whatsoever wrong with the Germans' uniforms. What a sexist positing to say when a woman such as myself or them wears a bikini it's so we can be eye candy.

[Quantess]

106. The underlying message, of course, is that you are a slutty temptress

who, at best, deserves to get called a whore, and might even deserves to get sexually assaulted.

[kiva]

90. Why would you think that?

Historically, women's clothing in most of the world has gotten smaller, not larger; like it or not, the majority of young women prefer briefer clothing, and I see absolutely no sign that it will change.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

103. Doubtful.

I give it 20 years before another enlightenment cleanses Europe of oppressive religious dogma.


Keep trolling though.

[leftynyc]

113. I think they look ridiculous

It's BEACH volleyball and they're covered head to toe. And I very much doubt any non-Muslim country's women would choose to wear that get up at the beach - unless their clerics are going to beat the crap out of them for not wearing it.

[msongs]

14. On DU the opression women is fine if its in the name of "sports". so are the muslim MEN wearing this

outfit? Maybe full on Burkas would look nice too. Like the empowerment of a choice....

[Skittles]

21. both outfits kinda suck

both show the status of the female body as more important than the sport itself

[boston bean]

49. My thoughts exactly. It's the madonna whore complex.

[Skittles]

50. BINGO

and I don't care for the sleeveless thing on anchors / meteorologists - why only the women? Jeez, it's like the more we advance, the more we get behind

[Act_of_Reparation]

66. Do they?

All I hear is the audience bending the narrative to fit their preexisting cultural expectations. What I don't hear is the players' opinions of the uniforms.

[Skittles]

91. if you think women cannot participate in sexist bullshit

you are DEAD WRONG

some people think women POLE DANCING is some kind of empowerment - IT ISN'T

[Act_of_Reparation]

111. You're absolutely right.

Women do certainly do play a part in systemic sexism. It was not my intention to suggest otherwise, and I apologize for not being clearer.

I think, at the end of the day, we're going to find that neither of these uniforms are particularly empowering, but I think that's a discussion best left to the people it most affects: women.

As a man, the best thing I can do here is combat the tendency to judge the character of women by what they wear. A significant swathe of the discussion here is whether these women are classy or hot; and I feel these discussions express cultural expectations of women's bodies, not genuine concern for their autonomy.

[kcr]

67. Yep

I don't know how you can watch the men in their comfortable and practical uniforms and then blather about how those teeny bikinis are choice! Whee! It's so ridiculous. You can even see how women in other sports have a variety of healthy body types. But not beach volley ball. It's clear this "uniform" discourages women who don't conform to that beauty standard from participating.

[ForgoTheConsequence]

104. Different sports and different training methods lead to different body types.

Being fat and slow isn't productive in beach volleyball.

[alarimer]

69. Especially when the men wear perfectly adequate shorts and shirts

THEIR uniform is not in service to an ogling public, yet it's the same exact sport. Women's bodies still only exist for men to ogle at. Sometimes they are covered more extensively because they are too "tempting" and sometimes they are exposed for the sole reason of attracting those eyeballs (in this case to the TV screen). In neither case are they "choosing" exactly.

Imagine the outcry if German team decided to wear what the men's beach volleyball team wears. Or imagine if all of them wore what the Egyptian team is wearing in that picture.

[True Dough]

16. The Egyptian bottoms are form fitting

More proactive than I would have expected, although I didn't expect that country would allow women to play beach volleyball. Glad they have the choice, and I hope the choice in uniform soon exists as well.

[Quantess]

18. Look at those Egyptian sluts even DARING to play sports al all!!!

No matter what they do or don't wear, they are just whores for playing sports, at all. Sports are devil-whorish, but only regarding female players.

[Warren DeMontague]

26. Fuck religious/anti-sex puritanism.

It's the source of just endless amounts of bullshit on our planet.

Anyone who has a temper tantrum because consenting adults choose to take off their clothes or wear revealing outfits doesn't belong in the 21st century.

[bravenak]

37. Or maybe they should move to the 21st century and try it out. It's nice here, we have free wifi.

Plus I think I would die of heatstroke in a full burkah. Fuck that.

[Warren DeMontague]

42. I agree.

And, at least for some of us, legal weed.

But man, it's too bad you guys are saddled with a Red state government. Ours rolled it out (so to speak) quickly and efficiently and it's already making bank for the state budget.

[bravenak]

45. It's taking fucking forever out here to get one damn shop opened up

You'd think we'd rush it since we need the money so damn bad with this budget crisis. Lucky me that I still know all the best weedfolks. I feel bad for other people who have anxiety like me. It fucking helps.

[Warren DeMontague]

47. Oh, they're dragging their feet deliberately, no question.

I mean, look at the difference with the way it is here.


http://www.oregon.gov/olcc/marijuana/pages/default.aspx


And me, personally, I indulge pretty infrequently, about once every blue moon at most (and as such, my tolerance is nothing, and when I do I get massively wrecked) but I'm still an enthusiastic proponent of legalization. Another thing that is awesome regarding full legalization, is the way you really have much more information about strains, CBD and THC content, etc. I've found some of the higher CBD stuff is GREAT for anxiety.

I went in to check out the recreational sales when they started just because, dammit, this is like seeing a human being set foot on Mars; something on my bucket list.

[bravenak]

51. Damn. You guys got it down, why dont we just steal yours?

I dont get that. We should totally just take and do the same exact thing. I honestly think it should all be legal. Now we got folks on bath salts and shit and thats just so much worse.

[Warren DeMontague]

56. absolutely.

The bath salts thing is nuts. Cannabis has a track record of being safely used by humans for thousands of years; not too many people buy "synthetic marijuana" (a misnomer if there ever was one) when the real thing is legal, regulated, and available for adults to purchase.


I actually think Oregon's law is a good model for states looking to pass one of their own. But we had a fairly robust medical dispensary system already up and running, so Kate Brown and the Dem-controlled legislature set up limited recreational sales through the already established mmj dispensaries until the full system comes online. So there may be a few speedbumps as dispensaries figure out if they want to go full recreational or stay medical; I suspect most, the former- but in the short term they both were able to start the recreational sales fairly quickly and start bringing in the tax revenue, which has exceeded all expectations so far.

Part of the motivation, to be sure, is the fact that we share a border with WA state, so the pols here had an incentive not to continue to watch the tax revenue go up there across the border.

[backscatter712]

83. A-fucken-men.

In general in the west, women get to choose what clothing they get to wear. It's in Middle Eastern Islamic countries that they're forced to cover up, at gunpoint in some cases.

If a woman wants to wear a bikini, let her. If she wants to wear something else, let her. My understanding is that the western women's volleyball teams give their members a choice of uniforms.

[bravenak]

28. I would be fine in either outfit

Gotta lose 15 pounds first though. I would prefer not to play in a bikini, strutting around with my booty out. Got too much booty.

[Warren DeMontague]

30. There are not many sports I ever displayed much aptitude for, sadly

but I'm actually not half bad at Volleyball.

[bravenak]

36. Yaaas!!! Me too!

I beat the shit out of the ball on a serve. People used to not be able to catch my fade. Sigh. I miss high school now. I still play a bit but back in the day I Tried everything.

[Warren DeMontague]

41. PDX isn't exactly what you would call a Volleyball hub, though.

I can't imagine Alaska is, either.

[bravenak]

46. Yeah :(

The summer is too short and we aint got no real beach. Even if we did it would be mudflats. The only think nice about climate change is the y'all can move up here when it gets real and maybe it will dry out enough for a beach. One day. Prolly when i'm too dead to enjoy it.

[IronLionZion]

31. Sports are not about booty

and one can't have too much booty anyway.

I wonder if anyone would object to them wearing the men's outfit

[bravenak]

35. Those outfits are better too

I like having booty, dont get me wrong, but I need to concentrate when I serve. My booty distracts me, cause I constantly worry about it busting loose. I think people would be fine in general if the women wore those, but I'm not sure how some 'home nations' would react to women showing all that knee.
If I were wearing that head thingy tho, I'd ask for asylum immediately in a regular country. Too hot to wear that shit.

[Statistical]

55. The big difference is one of those two women if free to chose what she wants to wear. n/t

[leftynyc]

114. +1000

A distinction far too many on DU would much rather you ignore.

[lostnfound]

64. Bodies as art

What's inherently wrong with that?
A body is inhabited by a person, it's not equal to the person.

Freedom is good.

On the other hand having a uniform of some kind is visually appealing, instead of many different looks.

[TransitJohn]

65. Ans as a bonus they won't inspire lust in the hearts of men.

[whatthehey]

80. I am a devoted fan of Sumo

and no not because I am rapidly approaching the typical sekitori build, although that is coincidentally true. Female beach volleyball exhibits no more flesh and hides no more protrusions. Are they oppressed? Objectified? Believe it or not some women (and doubtless men too although less openly even these days in Japan) find them physically appealing. Do many watch just for that reason? I doubt it in both cases. When any manner of full nude XXX rated show can be found free online just for asking, who sees bikinis, or mawashi, as anything other than a tangential bonus if that?

My favorite (by no means the best today, just an up and comer I enjoy watching in matches) Takayasu is the winning guy on the right. Ogle all that exposed flesh and barely concealed naughty bits!

[davidn3600]

82. The oppression of women is OK as long as it's Islam

That's one thing I have learned on DU and by the Democratic party over the recent years. If Christians were forcing women to wear clothes like this it would be an atrocity.

It's simply amazing how the left trips over itself to find excuses for this.

[leftynyc]

116. Don't tag the entire left with that bullshit

And don't tag this entire site with it either. The "left" has many different opinions on this subject so I suggest you sit back and learn something before you spout off like that again.

[IronLionZion]

86. It should be noted that Nada Meawad did not wear the hijab (head scarf)

It was only Doaa Elghobashy. Does the patriarchy force different choices down upon different women?

Here's other photos of Nada being oppressed by the patriarchy and denied of any choice

?w=1000

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/janetheactuary/2016/08/what-about-nada-meawad.html

The goal is to show that sports are for everyone and anyone, and be inclusive to conservative Muslim women. The goal is NOT to promote ideas of western superiority and look down on other cultures. Feminists might argue that bikinis are patriarchal oppression.

In America we have fewer women in Congress than many eastern countries have in their parliaments and we still don't have a woman president even though eastern countries (Sri Lanka, India, Pakistan) elected women leaders back before many DUers were even born.

[davidn3600]

87. Muslim countries have strong patriarchal social pressures

Much of their "choice" of what Muslim women wear is influenced heavily by the religion and the society which is highly religious and patriarchal. Many female athletes from muslim countries have faced threats of violence because they showed a little too much skin during sports competitions abroad.

And I don't see how having a female leader is somehow indicative of anything. Are you actually suggesting the India and Pakistan treats their women better than Americans do? Are you serious??? Have you EVER traveled outside the western world?

[IronLionZion]

88. I hear about patriarchal oppression every day from my fellow Americans

It's all a matter of perspective. Some people think sexual objectification is oppressive.

And I've mostly traveled in the eastern world: Middle East, India, China. I should do more travel to other places.

[Warren DeMontague]

101. Yeah, some people think 'oppression' is them not being allowed to tell other people what to do.

"My neighbors are having a same sex wedding/watching youporn/smoking weed and I can't stop them. I'M BEING OPPRESSED!"


Some people embrace Orwell non-ironically.

[Quantess]

109. Do you hear about honor killings a lot from typical Americans?

How about female genital mutilation prevalent in many African countries (Somalia) and some parts of the middle east, including Egypt?

[IronLionZion]

110. I hear about mansplaining, manspreading, gender roles, sexualization in media

and that if I even think about what happens in the Middle East or Africa then I am trivializing and deflecting the real oppression faced by many successful white women in America: bikinis and shaving.

I was even told that condoms were designed by the patriarchy to deny women any sexual pleasure. And that it is oppressive to deny her sex at any time for any reason, especially if she hasn't showered in a few days and is angry and violent. And I did get to hear a lot about honor killings and female genital mutilation when I oppressed someone by breaking up with her because she was cheating, lying, and being abusive. Ending a relationship is comparable to cutting someone's genitals... to some people.

[riderinthestorm]

118. Lots of body heat escapes thru the head. Covering it MUST have some effect

There is some science here to evaluate...

Optimum performance ensures victory. I'd guess Egypt is fine with their female athletes failing instead of taking advantage of anything that might give them an edge. Uncover?!!

No way.

So lose.

[IronLionZion]

119. That's why the Islamic patriarchy of Switzerland lost to free USA

?t=1996849982

Uncovered legs defeat patriarchy every time.

[MrScorpio]

92. Who won?

[IronLionZion]

95. Deutschland

[Oneironaut]

94. If I were playing Volleyball, I would want USA's style.

Ever run around in 85 degree weather with layers of clothes on? Yuck!

[Calculating]

96. They have a choice you know

The women are allowed to dress in shorts and a shirt, or the bikinis. Seems like most actually like the bikinis. Have some of you ever been to a beach? Are all of the bikini clad women sluts? This puritanical "skin is the devil" attitude is getting ridiculous.

[Cobalt Violet]

105. As an athletic female I would choose the bikini for comfort.

I have found that less fabric is more comfortable in sand or at the beach. Being draped in yard upon yard wet, sandy clothing is not comfortable.

Who fucking cares what men think.

[IronLionZion]

120. Cruel Male Dominated Culture

[Blue_Tires]

121. And here's the chaser:

https://twitter.com/AfroArabian_/status/763702249004621825

[IronLionZion]

122. Netherlands and Switzerland are under the oppression of Islamic patriarchy

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10028083262#post119

plus the upper half of the Americans